Cancelled a funded job. Now what?

5750b19f · ‎06-15-2020

Since there is no Upwork support I can talk to I needed help here. June 9 I hired a webdev to work on some order form stuff that we need. Before hiring, I handed him the requirements, the theme he needed to work with, the plugin he will work with. Since he have a nice Upwork profile with positive feedback and decent portolio, I hired him since he said he'll be able to do this in 7-10 days. Now where the did it go wrong?

1. He did not update us of what has he been working on until 5 days later. It was a Saturday.

2. He did not evaluate thoroughly of what cannot and can be done until Monday (15th June) where he already did the job (he said all tasks done). Some of the most important parts that we want done is not possible. This should have been avoided if he read thoroughly the requirements that I have given him before hiring.

3. Unsatisfactory quality of the job.

4. Someone else is working on this job and we have not been informed.

5. Nearly 80% of the work have issues with it and I have to spend 1.5 hours of what has been wrong an note that to him. We have not received a reply for nearly 12 hours even though I messaged him on a working day during working hours, not until we messaged that his work is less than spectacular. Then he replied instantly and it's already midnight!

I told him that we cannot proceed with this and that we lack confidence on him. He said it's ok no problem. So I cancelled it. Even though it's escrowed I cancelled it and chose pay nothing (but needs approval from the freelancer).

Now, what will happen if he didn't approve the refund? He said he is willing to work with me to meet the requirements but I caught him already lying twice, first one is that he said he doesn't work on a weekend that's why he isn't able to update me sooner yet I received an update about the job on Saturday, 13th June.

Second is that there is someone else doing the job. He said his name was "this guy" but his Slackname is different so I confirmed if he is really "this guy" and he said yes. Now, today I asked him if someone else is working on this job and he said yes. We have not been informed with this! Now that's disappointing. In case that this has gone into dispute, are we on the right here? Are we entitled for a full refund?

prestonhunter · ‎06-15-2020

It this goes to a dispute, none of this matters.

In a dispute, Upwork encourages the client and freelancer to come to an agreement. But Upwork can not make a decision about whether or not the client receives a refund.

Upwork does not look at the facts of a case and render a verdict.

If this goes to a dispute, and if you and the client can't agree on what to do, then if both of you decide to pay $291 and go to arbitration, then an independent arbitrator (not Upwork) will consider what each of you has to say and will render a decision about who gets the money.

You said that you want a full refund. How much money is that?

BojanS · ‎06-15-2020

Hi Sheena,

I'm sorry to hear about your experience. You are awaiting for a freelancer's response on your escrow refund request. If they approve this request or do not respond to it within 7 days, the remaining balance in escrow will automatically be refunded to your payment method. If the freelancer disputes the escrow refund request we will notify you by email and you can either accept or reject the dispute.

One of our team members will reach out to you directly via a support ticket to further assist you with this concern.

Thank you!

~ Bojan

jr-translation · ‎06-15-2020

Bojan S wrote:
Hi Sheena,

I'm sorry to hear about your experience. You are awaiting for a freelancer's response on your escrow refund request. If they approve this request or do not respond to it within 7 days, the remaining balance in escrow will automatically be refunded to your payment method. If the freelancer disputes the escrow refund request we will notify you by email and you can either accept or reject the dispute.

One of our team members will reach out to you directly via a support ticket to further assist you with this concern.

Thank you!

Why should there be any need to wait? The freelancer in question should be suspended for ToS violation.

prestonhunter · ‎06-15-2020

re: "Why should there be any need to wait? The freelancer in question should be suspended for ToS violation."

I understand where you are coming from.

I agree that what this freelancer did was wrong. And I agree that the freelancer violated Upwork ToS.

But based on my readings in the Forum, I don't think Upwork itself is likely to act quickly or decisively in a matter such as this based purely on a client's description of events.

I think that Upwork acts with a great deal of deliveration when it comes to resolving disputes over money that is in escrow.

Upwork's ToS specifically state that Upwork may actually make decisions about the disbursement of escrow funds in instances in which users have violated Upwork ToS. But this is an action taken rarely.

I'm not saying how I think things should be, or what I think Upwork should do... I'm simply making an observation based on descriptions about how such things have happened in the past.

As a practical matter, at this point the client has not even had his refund request declined. I don't see any reason why Upwork would not wait for something to happen first: If the freelancer agrees to the client's refund request, then Upwork doesn't need to make any decisions at all or even start a dispute. If the freelancer does nothing, then Upwork will automatically send the money back to the client.

jr-translation · ‎06-16-2020

Preston H wrote:
re: "Why should there be any need to wait? The freelancer in question should be suspended for ToS violation."

I understand where you are coming from.

I agree that what this freelancer did was wrong. And I agree that the freelancer violated Upwork ToS.

But based on my readings in the Forum, I don't think Upwork itself is likely to act quickly or decisively in a matter such as this based purly on a client's description of events.

I think that Upwork acts with a great deal of deliveration when it comes to resolving disputes over money that is in escrow.

Upwork's ToS specifically state that Upwork may actually make decisions about the disbursement of escrow funds in instances in which users have violated Upwork ToS. But this is an action taken rarely.

I'm not saying how I think things should be, or what I think Upwork should do... I'm simply making an observation based on descriptions about how such things have happened in the past.

As a practical matter, at this point the client has not even had his refund request declined. I don't see any reason why Upwork would not wait for something to happen first: If the freelancer agrees to the client's refund request, then Upwork doesn't need to make any decisions at all or even start a dispute. If the freelancer does nothing, then Upwork will automatically send the money back to the client.

If the freelancer get suspended, the money is returned to client and the client does not have to deal with a freelancer that violates the ToS.
I reported to freelancers for providing me a machine translation and provided evidence. They are both still around continuing to scam clients. Freelancers that knowingly violate the ToS need to be removed.

jr-translation · ‎06-15-2020

4. Someone else is working on this job and we have not been informed.

That is a serious ToS violation.
falsely stating that one Freelancer will perform the work on a job when another will in fact perform the work, including submitting a proposal on behalf of a Freelancer that is unable, unwilling, or unavailable to do the work;