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Re: Dispute - Fixed-Price Contract, 0% delivered, freelancer wants payment for their time?

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Active Member
joram K Member Since: Jun 3, 2016
31 of 40

Why has upwork no commented officialy on this post?My advice to you is lick your wounds and move on.My complaint was for two small amounts,$18 and $50.I kept being tossed and turned,at first it was their adamant insistance that they had refunded my money,when i tabled evidence to the contrary the narrative changed to that i must wait for 7-10days for the refunds to refelct in my primary billing method.When this did not happen i was given the line that the  contract amount had not been charged to my card,at point this was almost a comical show.I plainly asked them if they knew how an Esrow account works?Again when stories ran dry it was a no show,no communication from them.

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Community Guru
Claudia Z Member Since: Jul 28, 2015
32 of 40

@Richard M wrote:

 

The latest in our situation is that the freelancer still contests that they are entitled to 1 week’s payment.

Upwork have asked them to provide evidence of the work completed, but have not given us a timeframe on how long they will allow the freelancer to submit work.
 


You should have been firm you are not going to use their work and want to get your money back.


Did you send to Upwork the invoice for the hosting? The fact you purchased a hosting using as payment method paypal that tracks back to them results in a TOS violation.


Do they have any work history, feedback on their profile? Their refusal to set milestones saying they will do it (they cant, only the client sets milestones ) might indicate that they were not able to withdraw the money, at least at that moment, and their goal were to use redirected ways to get money from you.

 

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Richard M Member Since: Jun 1, 2016
33 of 40

Thanks Claudia and Petra for your input and advice.

Yes we sent a screenshot of the hosting company's invoice and the copy of the freelancer's Id card showing an identical address in our first repsonse to Upwork regarding the dispute.

 

As pointed out by Claudia,

In the Upwork User agreement https://www.upwork.com/legal/

 

14.1 SITE LICENSE AND INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS

"You agree not to use the Site or Site Services for offering any goods or services other than Freelancer Services as permitted by this Agreement."

 

The freelancer sold us their webhosting within the first hour of the contract.

This communication was made through Upwork's own messaging service.

 

 

The freelancer took payment for their webhosting via Paypal.

 

The Upwork User agreement https://www.upwork.com/legal/ shows.

 

7. NON-CIRCUMVENTION
You acknowledge and agree that a substantial portion of the compensation Upwork receives for making the Site available to you is collected through the Service Fee described in Section 6.1 (“Service Fee”). Upwork only receives this Service Fee when a Client and a Freelancer pay and receive payment through the Site. Therefore, for 24 months from the time you identify or are identified by any party through the Site (the “Non-Circumvention Period”), you must use the Site as your exclusive method to request, make, and receive all payments for work directly or indirectly with that party or arising out of your relationship with that party (the “Upwork Relationship”). You may opt-out of this obligation with respect to each Client-Freelancer relationship only if Client or prospective Client or Freelancer pays Upwork for each such relationship.

 

 

We will be happy to resubmit the Hosting evidence to Upwork again.

 

Thank you.

 

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Active Member
Richard M Member Since: Jun 1, 2016
34 of 40

Hi Upwork,

We'd appreciate if you could give some response regarding this, as our mediator appears to have gone silent.

 

Thanks

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Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
35 of 40

Hi Richard,

 

Remember this bit from my previous post:

 

How much money are we talking about here? ($ 500? How much is still in Escrow?) I am wondering if it is worth calling their bluff, standing firm, and forcing their hand to go to arbitration.

 

Please note that under Escrow rules Upwork CAN NOT decide the dispute. They can mediate, and make suggestions, but those would be non-binding.

 

A binding decision can only be made in arbitration.

 

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Richard M Member Since: Jun 1, 2016
36 of 40

Hi Petra,

We understand that the Upwork cannot make a binding decision in a dispute.

We thought however that they would have power in a situation where the freelancer has violated the Upwork Terms of Service User Agreement.

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Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
37 of 40

 


@Richard M wrote:

Hi Petra,

We understand that the Upwork cannot make a binding decision in a dispute.

We thought however that they would have power in a situation where the freelancer has violated the Upwork Terms of Service User Agreement.


 They DO have power: They have the power to suspend the freelancer's account. That does not affect the Escrow situation, it is a different issue. Two wrongs do not combine to invalidate the very complex legal situation when it comes to Escrow.

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Community Guru
Preston H Member Since: Nov 24, 2014
38 of 40

re: "We'd appreciate if you could give some response regarding this, as our mediator appears to have gone silent."

 

Moderator.


There are no "mediators" here.

 

There IS such a thing as mediator within the Upwork way of doing things, but they're not in the Forum. So the distinction is meaningful.


For the record, as this IS the Community Forum, moderators are under no particular obligation to participate in any forum or to answer any questions or provide any information here.

 

That they do, and do so often, is a blessing we should be grateful for. But there is no abrogation of duty when we don't see official Upwork responses to every question or request.

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Active Member
Richard M Member Since: Jun 1, 2016
39 of 40

Sorry for the confusion,

The mediator we were referring to, is the one who is dealing with our dispute via email.

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Active Member
joram K Member Since: Jun 3, 2016
40 of 40

Upwork though not legally bound to provide any feedback through this forum,my thought is that by virtue of them being the "service provider" and forum facilitators they have a moral obligation to provide some sort of response  to the concerned parties.

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