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Re: Having a lot of trouble with Contractor

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Active Member
Greg G Member Since: Oct 26, 2017
1 of 17

So, a contractor here has violated contract by not performing the work specified and has billed the maximum agreed upon fee. So, they have all my money and I have nothing in return. No files, no records, nothing.

 

Upwork says they can't do anything about it.

 

Buyer beware - this place is still very high risk contracting!

 

Anyway, if anyone out there has had a similar issue and was able to resolve it, please any advice would be appreciated.

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Moderator
Valeria K Moderator Member Since: Mar 6, 2014
2 of 17

Greg,

 

Sorry to hear the contract with this freelancer didn't go as expected. I checked your support ticket and I see that the team has been assisting you with this issue and forwarded your requests and concerns to the freelancer. Dispute button is available on hourly contracts for a limited amount of time after each timesheet is submitted. If dispute wasn't filed during the review period, the payment for the hours logged is released to the freelancer. Upwork team can assist the client with communication but doesn't have access to the funds that have been released. 

 

~ Valeria
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Community Guru
Jennifer D Member Since: Feb 15, 2016
3 of 17

Greg, I'm sorry to hear about your situation. But Upwork is very safe if clients take time to understand how it works and use the tools available for them.

 

Hourly contracts (it sounds like that's what you set up) pay the freelancer on their time spent, not on a specific deliverable. Fixed price contracts are designed to pay on delivery of a specific deliverable. The tools available to clients to manage both types of contracts are quite different.

 

In future, if you're looking to pay a freelancer to deliver you a specific thing, then you should look at using a fixed price contract. This way, you don't pay until they deliver you the product, and you have 14 days to review it and make sure it's working exactly how you want it.

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Greg G Member Since: Oct 26, 2017
4 of 17

If the contract and NDA specify what the hourly rate is for, then if they don't deliver what was agreed, they are in violation of contract. This is basic law. If they can't come up wth a reason why they can't meet was was agreed upon, they are in violation and can be sued. If I wanted a legal mess, I would have just dealt with them directly. But as I've stated, Upwork doesn't protect Clients it seems - all I ever hear is what you stated - I just didn't do it right and I get what I deserve.

 

Look, I had a fairly simple and straightforward request. If the contractor wanted more money to finish, I'd be happy to talk about it. But that is not what is happening here. They are not responding to any messages and have deceived me and Upwork staff deliberately - and they are just gone!

 

Upwork needs a more intense inquiry into this contractor. I am not mentioning their name because I am still being patient with this situation and I am still giving Upwork and the Contractor a change to make good out of this. They haven't touched this project for 5 months.

 

Do you still think I'm being unreasonable? 5 months!

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Community Guru
Jennifer D Member Since: Feb 15, 2016
5 of 17

@Greg G wrote:

If the contract and NDA specify what the hourly rate is for, then if they don't deliver what was agreed, they are in violation of contract. This is basic law. If they can't come up wth a reason why they can't meet was was agreed upon, they are in violation and can be sued. If I wanted a legal mess, I would have just dealt with them directly. But as I've stated, Upwork doesn't protect Clients it seems - all I ever hear is what you stated - I just didn't do it right and I get what I deserve.

 

And you can feel free to sue them. But Upwork can't help you enforce a contract that you agreed to directly with the freelancer, which is outside their own standard contract.

 

Look, I had a fairly simple and straightforward request. If the contractor wanted more money to finish, I'd be happy to talk about it. But that is not what is happening here. They are not responding to any messages and have deceived me and Upwork staff deliberately - and they are just gone!

 

If they are not responding to you, what makes you think they will respond to Upwork? Upwork can't force a freelancer to talk to you any more than you can.

 

Upwork needs a more intense inquiry into this contractor. I am not mentioning their name because I am still being patient with this situation and I am still giving Upwork and the Contractor a change to make good out of this. They haven't touched this project for 5 months.

 

Mentioning their name would get you nowhere because a mod would edit it (it's against the forum rules) and anyway it's extremely unlikely anyone here would know who you're talking about.

 

Do you still think I'm being unreasonable? 5 months!

 

I don't understand why you would be persisting to deal with a freelancer who isn't delivering anything for so long. If you're hiring a freelancer for a significant ongoing contract, it's in the best interests of both of you to do a small trial first.

 

I'm not saying "you get what you deserve". I'm saying that Upwork has tools you can use to prevent this happening again in future. You could have run into exactly the same problem with a contractor outside Upwork. Your situation is bad, and I'm sorry it happened, and the freelancer you worked with is not a professional. But I'm not really sure exactly what you want Upwork to do here.

 

(It's also worth noting - I'm not sure you realise - that I am a client like you. I don't represent Upwork.)


 

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Active Member
Greg G Member Since: Oct 26, 2017
6 of 17

"If they are not responding to you, what makes you think they will respond to Upwork? Upwork can't force a freelancer to talk to you any more than you can."

 

Upwork can take disciplinary action.

 

"I don't understand why you would be persisting to deal with a freelancer who isn't delivering anything for so long. If you're hiring a freelancer for a significant ongoing contract, it's in the best interests of both of you to do a small trial first.

 

I'm not saying "you get what you deserve". I'm saying that Upwork has tools you can use to prevent this happening again in future. You could have run into exactly the same problem with a contractor outside Upwork. Your situation is bad, and I'm sorry it happened, and the freelancer you worked with is not a professional. But I'm not really sure exactly what you want Upwork to do here."

 

All this is based on assuptions to frame me as an idiot. You don't know what you're talking about. We got screwed okay? Even Upwork was admitted to that. My point is Upwork is promoting a crook - and the more crooks they allow here, the less prestige they will have. It's in Upwork's best interest to ban crooked freelancers...or, maybe not, depending on what their intentions are.

 

"(It's also worth noting - I'm not sure you realise - that I am a client like you. I don't represent Upwork.)"

 

That's obvious - you're a rude **Edited for Community Guidelines**.

 

I won't be using Upwork ever again. Worst business experience I have ever had.

 

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Moderator
Vladimir G Moderator Member Since: Oct 31, 2014
7 of 17

Hi Greg,

 

I understand your frustration but please refer to the information Valeria shared above and our team shared on your ticket, and hopefully you'll reconsider your decision to stop using Upwork. Note that we take action against users who violate Upwork ToS and do have protection programs in place, which are available to both freelancers and clients.

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Community Guru
Rene K Member Since: Jul 10, 2014
8 of 17

@Greg G wrote:

 I just didn't do it right and I get what I deserve.

 

 


No, I'm afraid you misunderstood what was told to you. You don't deserve anything bad happening, quite the opposite.

 

Upwork provides clients with tools to avoid being scammed. For hourly jobs for instance, there is a whole week review period that is given to you, so you can check the previous week's work, and a dispute system if you're not happy with what was done.

 

Why you waive your rights to check and dispute the weekly outputs of your freelancer, I have no idea. If you ask me, it wasn't a wise decision.

-----------
"Where darkness shines like dazzling light"   —William Ashbless
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Active Member
Greg G Member Since: Oct 26, 2017
9 of 17

"No, I'm afraid you misunderstood what was told to you. You don't deserve anything bad happening, quite the opposite.

 

Upwork provides clients with tools to avoid being scammed. For hourly jobs for instance, there is a whole week review period that is given to you, so you can check the previous week's work, and a dispute system if you're not happy with what was done.

 

Why you waive your rights to check and dispute the weekly outputs of your freelancer, I have no idea. If you ask me, it wasn't a wise decision."

 

Right. So I'm supposed to hire a developer to check on the developer to ensure what they are doing is 'worth' the payment. See this is the problem - if I can't trust the contractor, there's no way yo protect myself. That's the guise that Upwork promotes - you're much safer dealing with Upwork - but you're not.

 

Interesting you're all for the freelander here - and not the client. Very interesting.

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Community Guru
John K Member Since: Feb 17, 2015
10 of 17

@Greg G wrote:

 

Right. So I'm supposed to hire a developer to check on the developer to ensure what they are doing is 'worth' the payment. See this is the problem - if I can't trust the contractor, there's no way yo protect myself. That's the guise that Upwork promotes - you're much safer dealing with Upwork - but you're not.

 

Interesting you're all for the freelander here - and not the client. Very interesting.


 Actually, you're supposed to hire a reputable project manager to check on the developer, if you're not up to the task yourself. And as to 'all for the freelander', Upwork doesn't favor freelancers over clients, BUT if either a client OR a freelancer chooses not to learn how Upwork contracts work, then one could easily take advantage over the other, and that's why there's policies in place like a 5 day review/dispute period for the previous week's work on hourly contracts, but clients AND freelancers ignore the policies to their own peril. It works both ways, inexperienced freelancers get swindled by unethical clients all the time at Upwork, because they don't learn how the site works before they start working and the same goes for new clients, as you found out.

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