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e91667f8
Community Member

My proposals are archived!

Who can explain me why the half of my new proposals are archived? Today I posted a job to find a good freelancer for my project, but an hour later I discovered that the most of the proposals are in the archive list. What's going on? I even didn't have an opportunity to review the freelancers. Upwork promotes some freelancers and hides others?

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lenaellis
Community Member

Hi Everyone,

We apologize for the delay, but understand we may not always be able to address posts with urgency, especially over the weekend or holidays. We understand and have read your feedback and grievances. We are glad that many of you are pleased with the Talent Services decision to no longer archive proposals. At the same time, we will not be reimbursing connects. These proposals were archived, not deleted, which means clients still had full access to all submitted proposals and were able to see the total amount of proposals listed in each section.  

 

Rest assured, archiving will not be replaced by any new process. Proposals would only appear  in the Archived list if the client or freelancer took action on the proposal. Talent Specialists will only be shortlisting proposals, as they have done. The Shortlisted list highlights proposals that Talent Specialists want to share with clients, this separate list which does not affect or touch proposals in the All Proposals list.

 

ATS Navigation.png

The All Proposals tab includes all active proposals. Proposals withdrawn by freelancers or clients, and declined invites are not included in this active list, those would be found in the Archived list. The All Proposals list displays Best match as the default sorting order. However, clients can sort the proposal list as they see fit: Newest to Oldest, Highest to Lowest rate, etc. The total amount of proposals in a tab is always visible at the top alongside the navigation link.

 

 

ATS Sort.png

 

As for Talent Specialists in general, they will continue improving their services and training. We recognize the comments shared in the Community. Feedback about irrelevant invites is shared with their team and actioned when necessary. Obviously, we wouldn’t keep or push a program that wasn’t working or producing results. Currently, Talent Services assists with around 5% of all jobs on the platform and these jobs have a higher fill rate as well as end with high success rates and great feedback. And as mentioned before, both clients and freelancer are given an option to opt out of the service.

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328 REPLIES 328


@Steve H wrote:

 

 

There is not a legal concern here. The program is not in opposition of our ToS, Talent Specialists are here to help clients use Upwork, but ultimately a client will engage with any freelancer they’d like on the platform and is responsible to vet and select the freelancer they want. Clients have full access to all proposals sent, and the client still chooses who to interview and who to hire.

 

I would not be overly certain about this. UW's legal team did draft the updated Tos after all, and we all know how that turned out...


 


@Steve H wrote:

 

 

Since freelancers and clients alike have shared feedback on this thread about archiving, we’ve updated the messaging sent to a client when a proposal is archived. We've made it more clear that we've narrowed their list of active proposals and point them to where they can view the full list of proposals that were submitted for their job.


I think this is a good step.

 

I think you may also need to provide a better way for FLers to give feedback when they are invited by TS to jobs that are totally outside of what their profile is advertising. For sure, FLers can open a ticket in these cases, but it may be a good idea to add a satisfaction survey form to each invite sent by a TS, so FLers can provide some feedback when they decline the offer. So you know when the TS misread or misunderstood the profile.

-----------
"Where darkness shines like dazzling light"   —William Ashbless

Hi, Steve. The things you've written in this thread don't show the real picture which I have seen during last few weeks and here's why:

 

1) "Talent Specialists communicate with clients about the details of their job to help the clients find freelancers that meet the clients’ criteria." - It's not true. Nobody asked me about the details of my job. Talent Specialist started sorting the proposals without any knowledge of my requirements, just based on short description.

 

2) "Approximately 5% of job openings were serviced by Talent Specialists last year." - I had to post 2 more jobs to find the right candidate without any assistance. Talent Specialist spoiled the list of proposals in each of them.

 

3) "If you have a strong work history and reputation on Upwork, it is very unlikely that you will be impacted by this program, other than being highlighted as a great match for the client's post." - It's lies again. The shortlisted candidates to my job posts have at about 86% job success. And a lot of Top Rated freelancers with 90+% job success are archived. Why aren't these candidated highlited?

 

4) "This program helps clients by simplifying the process - and it works. Clients who receive assistance are more likely to move forward with their projects than clients who do not.  That is a win for the freelancers and clients." - It doesn't. In my case I only wasted time for interviewing low-skilled candidates.

 

5) "Proposals are not always archived, but when they are, clients are now clearly notified. " - Lies again. Personally I wasn't notified about archiving. I saw in this thread one more lady, @Sarah H., she even didn't see the archived list because she used the mobile device and this list is not obvious there.

 

As I can not know how to add a comment without having to answer anyone, I reply to @Steve H.

A few minutes ago, at the end of this thread there was an answer from @Dan R. (the client who started this thread) and HAS DISAPPEARED !!

Has he deleted it (the unwise)? Or has it been censored?

Has anyone else seen it or is it what I dreamed (I think Virginia kuoded)?


@Maria T wrote:

@As I can not know how to add a comment without having to answer anyone, I reply to @Steve H.

@A few minutes ago, at the end of this thread there was an answer from @Dan R. (the client who started this thread) and HAS DISAPPEARED !!

Has he deleted it (the unwise)? Or has it been censored?

Has anyone else seen it or is it what I dreamed (I think Virginia kuoded)?


Yes, I read it and gave it a kudo. Upwork ... seriously - you're really going to censor clients now? Do you really think the fact that your "talent specialist" program DOES NOT WORK  is a big secret? Please give Dan the consideration he deserves and restore his post. Hearing a client's perspective has been the most illuminating thing about this whole miserable thread.

Hahaha ohhhh yes! They deleted my reply.YEsterday was the same situation. And They deleted my reply to you, Maria. What a nonsense!

Hi Dan,

 

I see two of your responses posted within the last hour, with the same content, have been automatically marked as spam and removed. I see you posted one response yesterday and it's still available on the third page of this thread when using the Newest First sorting option and wasn't removed from the thread. I've restored one of the two removed posts, which are duplicates, and see the others posts you've posted in the last hour are also available on the thread. Looking at Wendy's post, is it possible that you were looking at the thread in a logged out view, which might affect the sorting order depending on your settings and move your posts to a different page? According to Wendy's comment, your posts have been available on your Community page, which wouldn't be the case if they were removed as spam. 

 

We apologize for the confusion and can reiterate that we don't remove posts unless they are in violation of our Community Guidelines, which you can see by looking at comments posted in this discussion thread.

~ Vladimir
Upwork

I don't suppose we can realistically expect the Director of the Talent Solutions team to acknowledge that the scheme is a fiasco. We can only hope that this issue comes to the attention of someone more senior who is more concerned with the profitability of the company than with covering his own backside.

Hello, Vladimir! Of course I posted the same text for the second time because my first reply to Steve was marked as Spam and deleted. I have a screenshot of it. Several people have seen my first reply and even kudoed it. When I posted it for the second time, it was deleted at once. So please don't make fools of us saying that my messages were posted several times and that's why were consiedered to be the spam. If you didn't delete my first reply, I hadn't posted the same info for the second and the third times. There wasn't any violation it true facts about the Program. You just don't want people to know the truth about non-professional attitude of the stuff to Upwork users. 

The real picture of the situation:

 

1) "Talent Specialists communicate with clients about the details of their job to help the clients find freelancers that meet the clients’ criteria." - Nobody asked me about the details of my job. Talent Specialist started sorting the proposals without any knowledge of my requirements, just based on short description.

 

2) "Approximately 5% of job openings were serviced by Talent Specialists last year." - I had to post 2 more jobs to find the right candidate without any assistance. Talent Specialist spoiled the list of proposals in each of them.

 

3) "If you have a strong work history and reputation on Upwork, it is very unlikely that you will be impacted by this program, other than being highlighted as a great match for the client's post." -The shortlisted candidates to my job posts have at about 86% job success. And a lot of Top Rated freelancers with 90+% job success are archived. Why aren't these candidated highlited?

 

4) "This program helps clients by simplifying the process - and it works. Clients who receive assistance are more likely to move forward with their projects than clients who do not. That is a win for the freelancers and clients." - It doesn't. In my case I only wasted time for interviewing low-skilled candidates.

 

5) "Proposals are not always archived, but when they are, clients are now clearly notified. " - Personally I wasn't notified abour archiving. I saw in this thread one more lady, @Sarah H., she even didn't seenthe archived list because she used the mobile device and this list is not obvious there.

image (1).png

petra_r
Community Member


@Steve H wrote:

We recognize the expressed negative perception of this program and appreciate the conversations that have taken place thus far.  


 And you are? Normally employees introduce themselves before jumping into a conversation. Ah. A bit of research identifies you as Steve Holm, the Director of the Talent Solutions team.

 


@Steve H wrote:

We recognize the expressed negative perception of this program and appreciate the conversations that have taken place thus far.  High quality talent, like many of you on this thread, is what this program highlights to clients on Upwork.


 So you are calling the clients who have spoken about the program "liars" and are telling me I deserved the TS removing my proposal for a job I applied to and therefor forcing the client on a lengthy wild-goose chase to find me again so she can hire me... Obviously I am not "High Quality Talent," with my measerly 100% JSS, 14k hours and 5 star average and so on.

 


@Steve H wrote:

We understand that many of you here have voiced concerns with the archiving of proposals. We have no plans to change this process.


How much clearer can you say "We do not care what you think and what you say, your voice is irrelevant, we will continue to do exactly as we please." Thank you for putting it so very clearly.  Insulting as it is, at least it is clear and honest.

I appreciate that at last someone comes out and says "We could not care less what you guys think or say. We don't think your concerns have any merit, and will discard and ignore them, because we can"

 


@Steve H wrote:. Archiving proposals is done so clients can easily review and access a list of freelancers who are relevant to their job criteria - however, the client is free at all times to review all the proposals.

 No. Only if the client 1) knows that those people archive half their poroposals and 2) isn't working from a mobile device, where there is NO ACCESS to the hidden proposals at all because the archived folder is not accessible from mobile devices.

 


Steve H wrote: 

There is not a legal concern here. The program is not in opposition of our ToS.


 I am not sure. Upwork sells Connects and then removes the proposals those connects were used for. That is like selling a lottery ticket and then removing the ticket from the draw. Even if it is not outright illegal, (and I am not a lawyer so can't say for sure but it should be) it isn't "right" either. 

The ToS say Upwork do not interfere in the selecting and hiring and etc process. But Upwork does exactly that.

 

By the way, you said "we’ve updated the messaging sent to a client when a proposal is archived."

 

You will, of course, in that case, also email all freelancers whose proposals your people have removed and chucked in the "archived-trashcan", informing them that this has happened and why? After all, we're all about transparency here, aren't we?

 

 

 

Upwork's business and customer relations model:

  • Automate everything.
  • If a task requires more sophisticated computing than you're wlling to invest in, too bad: Automate with the resources you have.
  • If automating a task is a manifest failure, hire cheap labor to do the task. Keep labor cheap by hiring the underskilled and undertraining them.
  • When that fails, say "it's a great program that we're going to keep in place forever, but don't worry, it doesn't affect you anyway."

Steve H wrote:

"Clients who receive assistance are more likely to move forward with their projects than clients who do not.  That is a win for the freelancers and clients."


It's a win for Upwork's assembly-line model of freelancing. It's easy to say even a marginal return on investment is good when the investment itself is laughably constrained. For serious providers and serious buyers of professional services, this pinchpenny approach offers little return—if not indeed offering tortious (wrongful) interference with our business relationships. 

One can only hope the platform survives long enough to remain attractive—or for its customer base to remain attractive—as an acquisition target for some entitity willing to invest enough in infrastructure and oversight to make the platform work for professionals.


Steve H wrote:

We recognize the expressed negative perception of this program and appreciate the conversations that have taken place thus far.  High quality talent, like many of you on this thread, is what this program highlights to clients on Upwork.

 

Well, no.

 

That may be what Upwork INTENDS, but it isn't what happens. Did you see Petra's story about how the client had already decided to hire her--a vastly experienced freelancer with an excellent Upwork track record and skills a perfect match for the job--when the "talent specialist" helpfully hid her proposal?

 

Perhaps you'll think that's an anomaly, but it bears noting that talent specialists regularly reach out and invite freelancers to jobs that aren't even in their fields. 

 

Thanks, at least, for directly stating that you have no intention of making it right so that qualified freelancers can make an informed decision about phasing Upwork out. 

 

Thanks, too, for the various admissions by Upwork personnel here that Upwork moderators have repeatedly and over a long period of time misled freelancers about how proposals were handled. That will come in handy should any of those unfortunate enough to have invested in paying for connects choose to pursue legal action.

iaabraham
Community Member

I've been going through the link that Mary posted (https://community.upwork.com/t5/Freelancers/Why-Employers-do-NOT-see-your-Proposal/td-p/115079), which is somewhat similar to the situation we have here. 

 

A moderator's response to that thread (https://community.upwork.com/t5/Freelancers/Why-Employers-do-NOT-see-your-Proposal/m-p/116520/highli...) was extremely unsatisfactory from start to finish:

 

"I can confirm, and this is after speaking with our Legal team, that we are in compliance with our Terms of Service ...

 

... Regardless of all of our efforts to make the process easier, freelancers remain completely responsible for finding their own clients and choosing and submitting proposals for projects in which they are interested. Likewise, clients remain completely responsible for vetting, screening, and choosing their own freelancers. We’re honored to provide the platform to make this happen."

 

Should we expect a similarly disappointing response to this thread (if we ever get a response)?

 

The thread that Mary posted received a lot of responses and attention, but in the end it just died ... like I suspect this one might. How many times do we (freelancers AND clients) have to complain about serious issues like these before we receive a proper response and resolution? How hard is it to admit that you've made a mistake and that what you're doing isn't working, and then finally do something to make your users happy?

 

Maybe that will be more productive than wading through threads of complaints and crafting responses that are not only insulting but that also never really address the issues that we're bringing up.

 

(Echoing what Petra said: "To be clear, I am NOT blaming the mods because they have been gagged by corporate and are allowed to only spin the party line."

 

I'm sure they're tired of going back and forth with us. Maybe we could get someone who's actually in charge to come to the forums and talk to us directly??)

 


@Isabelle Anne A wrote:

Maybe we could get someone who's actually in charge to come to the forums and talk to us directly??)

 


Lol Isabelle 😀! You mean somebody from corporate coming here to talk with users?

 

Megalol!

-----------
"Where darkness shines like dazzling light"   —William Ashbless

I have been (uncharacteristically for me) staying out of this thicket. (Guess that, based on my past experience, I cynically and pessimistically figure that once I post, the likelihood of the whole thread going "poof" increases dramatically, anyway.) But I can no longer stay out of this section of the sandbox.

 

Quoting from Isabelle:  "A moderator's response to that thread (https://community.upwork.com/t5/Freelancers/Why-Employers-do-NOT-see-your-Proposal/m-p/116520/highli...) was extremely unsatisfactory from start to finish:

 "I can confirm, and this is after speaking with our Legal team, that we are in compliance with our Terms of Service ...

 

... Regardless of all of our efforts to make the process easier, freelancers remain completely responsible for finding their own clients and choosing and submitting proposals for projects in which they are interested. Likewise, clients remain completely responsible for vetting, screening, and choosing their own freelancers. We’re honored to provide the platform to make this happen."  (End Quote.)

 

Excellent point! I tend to suspect that previous written assurances, such as that quoted  above, are a primary reason for the lack of written response here, from Upwork, to this Forum Tempest. (And, of course, please do not rest easy, Upwork: We may not be adequately kicking posteriors, but we ARE taking names. And we are taking screenshots.) There are potential legal ramifications to such assurances -- assurances that are always implicit in a professional relationship, and certainly when money for services is involved -- and this issue become even more problematic for Upwork when these assurances are confirmed and made specific by its agents, in writing. (In fact, could monies paid be subject to reimbursement? Could there be legal liability for lost opportunities?)

 

There are also, in my informed opinion, possible serious problems with Upwork's potential violations of its own ToS, as has been underscored previously in this thread. (cf. Section 2.1 RELATIONSHIP WITH UPWORK, in which UW states that it will NOT actively interfere with the selection process (the "find[ing]" or "introduc[ing]" of freelancers by or to clients). This process is warranted (probably not quite the right word; I am not an attorney -- but if it's not the right word, it's pretty damned close!) to occur "directly.")  (The exact word "directly" is used twice in Section 2.1. Ain't no nuthin' 'bout no "Talent Specialists." For sure, for certain. No intervening middle persons, competent or otherwise.)

 

For now, it may be that Upwork's legal team is advising that silence, although neither a desirable nor a very publicly attractive position, provides less opportunity for UW to confirm its own legal liability than does any type of comment -- even denial.

"I'm sure they're tired of going back and forth with us. ..."

 

The moderators are no doubt tired of the back and forth. Then again, it's what they get paid to do and might even make a nice change, sometimes, from explaining to FLs how to set up their bank account information and why their profiles aren't approved yet. The suits are not tired of it because they are hiding behind the moderators.

 

**edited for Community Guidelines**. But what does that look like? I haven't been submitting proposals anyway because I'm booked to capacity for the next few months. I can't stop active projects in mid-stream and can't move them off the platform yet, so UW gets to keep claiming its percentage.

 

I wasn't kidding the other day when I said I hope somebody is building a new startup. Given a viable alternative, there will be a stampede to board the evacuation shuttles.

But, Phyllis, if we (the competent) stop submitting proposals, then that simply leaves a vacuum into which the incompetent will rush. And there seems to be, for all practical purposes, an infinite supply of incompetent freelancers available through UW.

 

(ETA:  "stampede to board the evacuation shuttles" -- grim LOL... heheheheheheheeheh!)


@Janean L wrote:

But, Phyllis, if we (the competent) stop submitting proposals, then that simply leaves a vacuum into which the incompetent will rush. And there seems to be, for all practical purposes, an infinite supply of incompetent freelancers available through UW.

 

(ETA:  "stampede to board the evacuation shuttles" -- grim LOL... heheheheheheheeheh!)


 Oh, I completely agree. 

Due to the lack of good job posts, fraudulent people and "improved features" among other things in Upwork I have been thinking for some time already what it's that Upwork really want. I started to think that Upwork don't want to be a freelancers platform anymore. It seems to me they are overwhelmed with too many freelancers and few good clients. And trashing proposals might as well be one strategy to get rid of users. That's too bad. I guess, bit by bit, good freelancers will go somewhere else and the unprofessional people will probably stay, taking Upwork to a bad reputation ground. I agree with Phyllis, this seemed to be a good place years ago but nothing lasts forever, maybe it's time to look somewhere else. 😞

 

Using those bots to trash proposals is a serious matter. Good I have never paid for connects. I would feel even worse.

Every. Single. Word that Janean wrote. Times 10.

 

Upwork - this thread will stay alive - albeit unresponded to at this time.

 

Screenshots and such can not be nuked.

Just chiming in to say that this is still super gross, Upwork.

Super slimy.

Can we get someone higher on the food chain than the poor mods who are out here ignoring the flak for you guys?

Gross.

Oh yes they can! Also PM's can be nuked. All can be nuked if UW decides that you need to be quiet.

I am unable to post on this thread?

Oh yes they can.

EDITED...because the code went all wonky. I have no idea why. Sorry!

 

*


Not to play devil's advocate, because I'm not loving this either, but I doubt it's the competent people who will be leaving in droves. "Talent specialist" and auto-rejection nonsense notwithstanding, we obviously will, over a period of time, have the better chance at landing the good jobs than someone so far out of his/her league that s/he is shooting into the dark.

Or that's my optimistic view, anyway.

I still don't agree with this, mind you. I think it's very wrong to claim you're giving someone a chance when you might not be. (The "you" here being UW, of course.) I'm fuzzy on whether it might be illegal as some are claiming but either way, yes, I'm against it. BUT I really don't think threatening that all the great people will leave (ETA: sorry, or stop submitting proposals) is what's going to change UW's mind on this. It never does. UW lets people who are angry flounce off - or say they're going to, anyway - and if they do there are always a bajillion more right behind the deserters, and some of those will be great. It's just the way things are.

Sorry, LOL, that's a little too practical, to the point of almost being depressing. But yes, I do believe that no matter how much this system may mess things up, it won't be eliminating, say, me more than Fred Whomever from Wherever with the awful grammar bidding on $600/500-word articles. Not as a general rule.

We'll see how this all shakes out and like everyone else here, I'm definitely watching this thread to see whether we get some real answers.

Stopping submitting proposals is only going to hurt the freelancers who stop submitting. There are hundreds of other freelancers either creating accounts here or waiting to. On this discussion site, there are... what, 10, 20, maybe 30 freelancers who know about this, That is not even going to make a dent in fixing this, Not when there are Thousands of freelancers who don't know about this. Those need to be told about this and add there voices with ours. 

 

10 people protesting or pickiting does nothing, Thousands make their voices heard. 

e91667f8
Community Member

The thing is that Upwork deletes messeges here in this thread. They delete messages with true facts. I wrote here yesterday, I've senta reply to Steve a few minutes ago, but Upwork marked it as Spam and deleted. They don't want people to know the  real picture which is going on at Upwork. I attached the screenshot which proves my words.

 

tlsanders
Community Member


Kathy T wrote:

Stopping submitting proposals is only going to hurt the freelancers who stop submitting. There are hundreds of other freelancers either creating accounts here or waiting to. On this discussion site, there are... what, 10, 20, maybe 30 freelancers who know about this, That is not even going to make a dent in fixing this, Not when there are Thousands of freelancers who don't know about this. Those need to be told about this and add there voices with ours. 

 

10 people protesting or pickiting does nothing, Thousands make their voices heard. 


 I don't think the numbers are nearly as important as who those freelancers are. There are several freelancers in this thread whose average monthly Upwork fees are equal to those paid by 10 or even 20 lower-end freelancers. 100 freelancers who average $100/month in earnings and pay $20 in fees equal 10 freelancers who average $1500/month in earnings and pay $200 in fees...but, 10 higher-paying freelancers are much lower maintenance, and do more to attract clients to the site.

They are waiting for the period of this trial to end to see if it will make more money or not. After they see that, they will give an explanation. (or not) At the end of the day Upwork is a closed box and they don't have the first intention to be fair or anything like the outsourcing sites that started this business. Just one new site with half (or even quarter) the number of clients here and they are in trouble. I'd really prefer to stay here and work as usual without anybody meddling with my applications but I wouldn't be afraid of starting over.

It seems I have found the reason why my earnings have decreased several times. I constantly receive mail messages that my offers are archived and I spent almost all of my connections this month and nobody wrote to me, although I had high-quality examples in my portfolio, similar to the projects that customers needed. When I started freelancing, I thought I could work here, but as it turned out, the problem is not only the lack of stability, but also incomprehensible actions on the part of the exchange, which further aggravate the situation. If in 1 month I earned 840 dollars, then for this only 32. If nothing changes, I and many other talented freelancers will have to look for another job, and only newbies will remain at UW.
Everything is very sad.


@Baris A wrote:

They are waiting for the period of this trial to end to see if it will make more money or not. After they see that, they will give an explanation. (or not) At the end of the day Upwork is a closed box and they don't have the first intention to be fair or anything like the outsourcing sites that started this business. Just one new site with half (or even quarter) the number of clients here and they are in trouble. I'd really prefer to stay here and work as usual without anybody meddling with my applications but I wouldn't be afraid of starting over.


 This says it for me.

 

I wonder if management realizes it isn't only forum regulars who are seething, up in arms, and seeing red over this.  There are more than a few new names ... and that indicates a lot more FLers are aware of this than originally thought.

 

Good for all of you who have spoken up and shared your opinions on this subterfuge.

Maybe we should not write about the problem here. Perhaps the information just does not reach the right people. Maybe we should write about this issue in "Feedback" ? I recently wrote to them about my problems and for some reason they took away the title “Top Rated” from me and installed “Rising Talent”. At first I did not know whether this was good or bad. But now it seems to me that this is even better, because at least my clients will be able to see my proposals.

I had asked for an SMS when the issue was resolved; I received said message, but issue is not resolved. Yay.

@Valeria K wrote:

Petra,

 

That is part of the services that Talent Services offer to clients and Dan is currently in contact with one of the Talent Specialists. This is a service that clients can choose to receive or opt out of.

 

 I think that Talent Services may be somewhat of an exaggeration.

 

Among the "Talent Services" I have been at the receiving end of, is a job interview for a Czech Translator w/SEO Skills. OK, fair enough, I speak a few languages, and Danish could perhaps sound (phonetically) a bit like Czech, to a complete outsider that is, couldn't it?... Another requirement for the job, apart from being and speaking Czech, was Location: United States, Czech Republic. Perhaps UK is somewhat interchangable with US on this occasion? I mean, we sorta speak English in a similar way, don't we?...

 

I contacted customer service and asked them to let the Talent Specialist know that Danish and Czech are not the same language. And, that US/Czech Republic is not the same as UK.

 

I just now revisited the job listing for the above job. 22 invites were sent. I wonder just how many of them went to people like myself who:

1. don't speak Czech

2. aren't located in the right country/countries

 

Another Talent Specialist invited me for a job to translate from Norwegian to Danish. On a good day, I can probably understand some 60-80% Norwegian, but that certainly doesn't mean that I will put my name on a translation from Norwegian to Danish! While Danish, Swedish and Norwegian are indeed similar and many Scandinavians understand all 3 languages to some or even large extent, as a professional translator I do not translate from a language I am not fluent in - period! Nowhere on my profile is Norwegian mentioned, but Upwork seems to be under the impression that Danish/Swedish/Norwegian are pretty much interchangable (and freelancers who translate between the three without proper knowledge of all three languages tend to mix up the grammar, vocabulary and syntax and the results are questionable to say the least).

 

I have contacted Upwork's customer service to suggest that they regard Danish, Swedish and Norwegian as 3 separate languages. That has yet to happen though.

 

I am sorry that clients making use of Talent Specialists, voluntarily or involuntarily, receive such utter disservice and I am absolutely apalled to learn that proposals are auto-archived based on the same lack of competence as described above.

 

I would like to encourage someone, anyone, to start a thread compiling examples of just how useless the Talent Specialist "service" is, how poor assessments they make when inviting unqualified freelancers to apply for jobs where they don't meet the basic requirements. I don't think it will make much impact until clients become aware of what disservice they are (unknowingly) being subjected to and start taking their business elsewhere. I can't imagine Upwork listening to reason, but perhaps Upwork will listen to money going elsewhere!

 

 

I am horrified that Upwork is censoring - as in deleting - client comments to backup his experience.

I urge you all to to go to the start of this thread and click on Dan R.'s name. You will see all his posts.  Read them.  

Amongst Steve Holmes (U. management) words (somewhere around pg 3 I think; the post was inserted out of sequence) is this:

 

"Archiving proposals is done so clients can easily review and access a list of freelancers who are relevant to their job criteria - however, the client is free at all times to review all the proposals. That said, your concerns surrounding the perception that Connects are 'wasted' when a proposal is archived because you feel a client may not see it, is a valid point. Proposals are not always archived, but when they are, clients are now clearly notified. Since freelancers and clients alike have shared feedback on this thread about archiving, we’ve updated the messaging sent to a client when a proposal is archived. We've made it more clear that we've narrowed their list of active proposals and point them to where they can view the full list of proposals that were submitted for their job."

 

1. Please share the exact new wording in use

 

2. Please attach screenshots prior to and post changes "making it easier" for buyers to spot archived proposals

 

 

I have a doubt, one more among all that this thread generates to me.
Sometimes I have received some of those recommendations of work of TS (not very successful).
I answered some of them, and the TS appeared "floating" around. So I knew that one of them was involved.
But, from what Dan has said, it is not very clear to me whether whenever there is a TS involved in the client's choices (whether or not he wanted it to be as Dan says), there is some evidence that there is a TS "messing up" over there.
Because if it is not like that, just as they will warn customers that there may be "archived" proposals, they should somehow warn freelancers as well.

We all know that, for now, the TS program is a disaster, although Steve does not want to admit it.
With a warning to the freelancer that it is a job "managed" by TS, at least we will know what to expect (little or nothing?)

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