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f2ad26fe
Community Member

This Techno Neanderthal Needs your Help

Actually, I am not new to Upwork, but given my deficient computer skills, and lack of knowledge regarding basic functions on Upwork, I might as well say I am new.

 

I will be VERY APPRECIATIVE if someone were to respond to these questions::

 

1)  I want to send e mails to various freelancers.  But I find I only have the option of either inviting them to consider my project or hiring them for my project.   Where can I find a button or icon to click to send the freelancer a message.

 

2) I have a job posted on here.  If I recall corrrectly, it is entitled "Web advisor and Guru"  (The use of the word Guru was intended to provide a little levity).  I have only gotten 1 response.  Please give me constructive criticism, tell me why my ad might dissuade people from applying, tell me if I make assertions which are off-putting or disturbing.  Please be honest and blunt -- but please refrain from gratuitous mockery or derision.   

 

I thank you for your response

22 REPLIES 22
versailles
Community Member



> 1)  I want to send e mails to various freelancers.  But I find I only have the option of either inviting them to consider my project or hiring them for my project.   Where can I find a button or icon to click to send the freelancer a message.

 

The only way of doing this is to invite specific freelancers to send a proposal to one of your job postings. Once they do that, you can open a messaging channel with each of them.

 

> 2) I have a job posted on here.  If I recall corrrectly, it is entitled "Web advisor and Guru"  (The use of the word Guru was intended to provide a little levity).  I have only gotten 1 response.  Please give me constructive criticism, tell me why my ad might dissuade people from applying, tell me if I make assertions which are off-putting or disturbing.  Please be honest and blunt -- but please refrain from gratuitous mockery or derision.   

 

This community has no access to your job posting and linking to it here is not allowed. As a consequence you may want to spend some time and read the clients section of this message:

 

Getting Started on Upwork

-----------
"Where darkness shines like dazzling light"   —William Ashbless
prestonhunter
Community Member

re: "I have a job posted on here. If I recall corrrectly, it is entitled 'Web advisor and Guru'"

 

David:

I actually think that the title is okay. I would not find it off-putting.

 

Here are some things to check:

- Did you make sure that you posted the job as an hourly contract (not fixed-price)?

- Did you use the words "consultation" or "consultant"?

- Did you specifically mention that at this stage you are just trying to get some ideas and you want to talk to a few different people for a short period of time?

re: "I want to send e mails to various freelancers. But I find I only have the option of either inviting them to consider my project or hiring them for my project. Where can I find a button or icon to click to send the freelancer a message."

 

As Rene described, it is very easy for you to accomplish your goals using Upwork.

 

Just post a job and either let freelancers apply to it, or you can send out invitations to freelancers of your choice.

 

One a freelancer sends a proposal or replies to your invite, there are no limits on how much you can communicate with her. You may continue to use Upwork messenger, or email, or Skype, or whatever form of communication you want to use.

 

Posting a job does NOT cost anything and it does NOT commit you to actually hiring any body.

 

Obviously, because you're are a responsible professional, you'll use the "Hire" button to put any freelancer under contract who starts working for you, either by doing hands-on work or by providing information to you in a consultative basis via whatever form of communication you choose.

I thank you very much for your help.

 

I don't want to impose, and if this is too much to ask just ignore this, but I want to know what might be wrong with my ad.  Please don't be afraid to hurt my feelings.  People appear to avoid it like the plague.  Accordingly, I will post the ad in this reply:

 

Job details

**Edited for Community Guidelines**

 

 
I want to hire someone who can teach me how to

A) Create videos (Yes, I know this is pretty basic);

B)  Help me get the greatest number of hits for these videos; and

C) Teach me how to manage my material on the web sites where these videos are posted

WHAT I AM DOING:  At the risk of sounding grandiose, I want to publicize and disseminate ideas which I think are provocative, deviate dramatically from social and political norms and really delver some punch.  These ideas are expressed in essays I have written.  (Yes, I know the idea of reading essays sounds dull, but keep reading)

Since a constant drumbeat of ideas might be intellectually taxing, I offer a change  of pace  with what might be called "the urbane man's rap."  These are highly rhythmic, rhyming poems which take shots at various sacred cows.  

I am not asking for your advice as to what messages I will convey.  I know exactly what I want to convey; I just don't know how to use the myriad tools of digital persuasion.

WHAT I SEEK IN SOMEONE I MIGHT HIRE:  Above all, I value intelligence and honesty.  Please don't tell me you know how to do something if you don't know how to do it.   Don't be afraid to say that you don't know how to do something; hell, I am a complete and total Neanderthal in this digital world. 

You should be well versed in making videos and the more difficult task of creating a buzz and the excitement which might yield many visits to my sites.  I want to maximize the number of hits my stuff gets. 

Also, please have good communication skills.  I understand things best when they are clearly explained in English.  I am not a visual person. 

To WIN ME OVER:  Give me examples of projects, you came up with or administered, in which a web site, which had only gotten one hundred hits, soon got 500,000 hits.  Okay, maybe half a million is a fanciful dream, but the idea is to push that number up as high as possible
  • Less than 30 hrs/weekHourly
  • 1 to 3 monthsProject Length
  • IntermediateI am looking for a mix of experience and value
  • Project Type:Ongoing project

You will be asked to answer the following questions when submitting a proposal:

  1. Have you taken any Upwork tests and done well on them that you think are relevant to this job?
  2. Do you have any degrees or certifications which might be relevant to this job

Skills and expertiseEnglish Search Engine Optimization (SEO) Website Development

Preferred qualifications
  • Job Success Score: At least 90%
  • Include Rising Talent: Yes
  • English level:  Fluent
  • Upwork hours:  At least 1 hour
  • Location: Eastern Time Zone
Activity on this job
  • Proposals:  Less than 5
  • Last viewed by client:  19 hours ago
  • Interviewing: 0
  • Invites sent: 4
  • Unanswered invites: 1

 

 

hodgesh
Community Member

I would avoid the term "guru." Some people associate it with cheap, demanding clients. "Expert" is a good alternative.

 

Better yet, make sure you choose the appropriate skill level and describe your job and budget in a way that will attract whomever you consider to be a "guru." In most cases, avoid fancy, humorous, or ambiguous wording or slang in your job posts because you never know how it will be interpreted.

What Heaven said. I am 99% certain to ignore/decline posts that include any of the following: guru, rock star, ninja. Just tell me what you need and what budget ballpark you're in, and I can tell whether or not it's worthwhile for us to have a conversation. (I'm in a different field, but I think the general principle holds.)

Dear Phyllis G:

 

I thank you for your wise comments.

 

I fear that there must be many flaws in my ad.  I beseech someone to please tell me what dissaudes people from responding to this ad.  I am tendering a copy of the ad to you.  If this is too much to ask, feel free to ignore this request.  If you do respond, please be blunt and honest in your criticism:

 

Job details

  1. **Edited for Community Guidelines**

 
I want to hire someone who can teach me how to

A) Create videos (Yes, I know this is pretty basic);

B)  Help me get the greatest number of hits for these videos; and

C) Teach me how to manage my material on the web sites where these videos are posted

WHAT I AM DOING:  At the risk of sounding grandiose, I want to publicize and disseminate ideas which I think are provocative, deviate dramatically from social and political norms and really delver some punch.  These ideas are expressed in essays I have written.  (Yes, I know the idea of reading essays sounds dull, but keep reading)

Since a constant drumbeat of ideas might be intellectually taxing, I offer a change  of pace  with what might be called "the urbane man's rap."  These are highly rhythmic, rhyming poems which take shots at various sacred cows.  

I am not asking for your advice as to what messages I will convey.  I know exactly what I want to convey; I just don't know how to use the myriad tools of digital persuasion.

WHAT I SEEK IN SOMEONE I MIGHT HIRE:  Above all, I value intelligence and honesty.  Please don't tell me you know how to do something if you don't know how to do it.   Don't be afraid to say that you don't know how to do something; hell, I am a complete and total Neanderthal in this digital world. 

You should be well versed in making videos and the more difficult task of creating a buzz and the excitement which might yield many visits to my sites.  I want to maximize the number of hits my stuff gets. 

Also, please have good communication skills.  I understand things best when they are clearly explained in English.  I am not a visual person. 

To WIN ME OVER:  Give me examples of projects, you came up with or administered, in which a web site, which had only gotten one hundred hits, soon got 500,000 hits.  Okay, maybe half a million is a fanciful dream, but the idea is to push that number up as high as possible
  • Less than 30 hrs/weekHourly
  • 1 to 3 monthsProject Length
  • IntermediateI am looking for a mix of experience and value
  • Project Type:Ongoing project

You will be asked to answer the following questions when submitting a proposal:

  1. Have you taken any Upwork tests and done well on them that you think are relevant to this job?
  2. Do you have any degrees or certifications which might be relevant to this job

Skills and expertiseEnglish Search Engine Optimization (SEO) Website Development

Preferred qualifications
  • Job Success Score: At least 90%
  • Include Rising Talent: Yes
  • English level:  Fluent
  • Upwork hours:  At least 1 hour
  • Location: Eastern Time Zone
Activity on this job
  • Proposals:  Less than 5
  • Last viewed by client:  19 hours ago
  • Interviewing: 0
  • Invites sent: 4
  • Unanswered invites: 1
hodgesh
Community Member

The ad is too long. Don't go into detail about your vision for the video content. Just explain how you want to be taught to make videos (screenshare? written tutorials? etc.) and roughly what level you are at (complete beginner, etc.).

 

And I agree with Preston: you should hire two or three people instead of one, probably not all at the same time. You should probably learn how to make the videos before you try to promote them.

f2ad26fe
Community Member

Dear Heaven H,

 

Your advice seems really good.

 

Thank you.

 

 

First I apologize if this message is strikingly similar to a prior message I left recently.  (I am posting this message because of numerous flaws with the prior message)

 

A guy on here named Heaven gave me apparently good advice, but I want to hear as much constructive criticism as possible.

 

My Question:  Why are so few people interested in my job offer:

THIS IS THE AD:

Job details

  1. **Edited for Community Guidelines**
Posted 20 days ago
 
 
I want to hire someone who can teach me how to

A) Create videos (Yes, I know this is pretty basic);

B)  Help me get the greatest number of hits for these videos; and

C) Teach me how to manage my material on the web sites where these videos are posted

WHAT I AM DOING:  At the risk of sounding grandiose, I want to publicize and disseminate ideas which I think are provocative, deviate dramatically from social and political norms and really delver some punch.  These ideas are expressed in essays I have written.  (Yes, I know the idea of reading essays sounds dull, but keep reading)

Since a constant drumbeat of ideas might be intellectually taxing, I offer a change  of pace  with what might be called "the urbane man's rap."  These are highly rhythmic, rhyming poems which take shots at various sacred cows.  

I am not asking for your advice as to what messages I will convey.  I know exactly what I want to convey; I just don't know how to use the myriad tools of digital persuasion.

WHAT I SEEK IN SOMEONE I MIGHT HIRE:  Above all, I value intelligence and honesty.  Please don't tell me you know how to do something if you don't know how to do it.   Don't be afraid to say that you don't know how to do something; hell, I am a complete and total Neanderthal in this digital world. 

You should be well versed in making videos and the more difficult task of creating a buzz and the excitement which might yield many visits to my sites.  I want to maximize the number of hits my stuff gets. 

Also, please have good communication skills.  I understand things best when they are clearly explained in English.  I am not a visual person. 

To WIN ME OVER:  Give me examples of projects, you came up with or administered, in which a web site, which had only gotten one hundred hits, soon got 500,000 hits.  Okay, maybe half a million is a fanciful dream, but the idea is to push that number up as high as possible
  • Less than 30 hrs/weekHourly
  • 1 to 3 monthsProject Length
  • IntermediateI am looking for a mix of experience and value
  • Project Type:Ongoing project

You will be asked to answer the following questions when submitting a proposal:

  1. Have you taken any Upwork tests and done well on them that you think are relevant to this job?
  2. Do you have any degrees or certifications which might be relevant to this job

Skills and expertiseEnglish Search Engine Optimization (SEO) Website Development

Preferred qualifications
  • Job Success Score: At least 90%
  • Include Rising Talent: Yes
  • English level:  Fluent
  • Upwork hours:  At least 1 hour
  • Location: Eastern Time Zone
Activity on this job
  • Proposals:  Less than 5
  • Last viewed by client:  6 days ago
  • Interviewing: 0
  • Invites sent: 4
  • Unanswered invites: 1

 

 

 


David G wrote:
 
 
I want to hire someone who can teach me how to

A) Create videos (Yes, I know this is pretty basic);

B)  Help me get the greatest number of hits for these videos; and

C) Teach me how to manage my material on the web sites where these videos are posted

This is where you cut the wall-of-text BS and post your job. Nobody cares if you think you have invented the cure for cancer or poverty. You want people to teach you stuff and that's it. No need to talk about your dreams.

 

And you need two job posts, because you're looking for two different things. You want someone to teach you how to make a video, which is something people who deal with videos know. Then, you need someone to guide you through the marketing steps. A marketing person. These are two different people.

 

Also, if you want people from the US only, for some reason that you only know, and not Canada, the UK, the Netherlands, and if you pay close to nothing, you'll get close to nobody. Not saying this is what you do, just mentioning.

 

 

 

 

-----------
"Where darkness shines like dazzling light"   —William Ashbless


David G wrote:

Dear Phyllis G:

 

I thank you for your wise comments.

 

I fear that there must be many flaws in my ad.  I beseech someone to please tell me what dissaudes people from responding to this ad.  I am tendering a copy of the ad to you.  If this is too much to ask, feel free to ignore this request.  If you do respond, please be blunt and honest in your criticism:

...


It is TOO LONG. I would never even read the whole thing. And I am unlikely to respond to posts that use UW's canned questions. Finally--since you asked for plain talk--your writing style as indicated in the post is somewhat overblown and not easy to read. I would think seriously about investing in an ghostwriter and/or editor, to make sure your content is as accessible as it can be, before worrying too much about promoting it.

 

(Also, you don't need to keep pasting it into replies to various people here. Everyone can see the whole thread.)

yitwail
Community Member


Heaven H wrote:

I would avoid the term "guru." Some people associate it with cheap, demanding clients. "Expert" is a good alternative.

 


Being a community guru, I'd have to disagree. Besides, in software development and system administration, the term guru has a long history, unlike pop references like ninja and rockstar, but that's not to say there's anything wrong with expert.

__________________________________________________
"No good deed goes unpunished." -- Clare Boothe Luce

re: "guru"

 

For me, a key factor in whether this would make me consider applying to a job post with this word in the title...

 

...is whether the client is actually looking for a consultant, or somebody to do some hands-on work.

 

I think "guru" is quite appropriate as a word to describe somebody who you want to hire just to talk to and provide guidance.

f2ad26fe
Community Member

TO: Heaven H

Thank you for your help.  I don't want to impose, and if this is too much to ask you can just ignore this, but I was wondering if you could look at the whole of my ad and if you would be so kind as to tell me what is wrong with it.  I am trying to post my ad in this response.  Some of it might not appear because of formatting problems, etc.  

 

This is the ad (Please don't worry about offending me; I want the truth):

 

Job details

 

**Edited for Community Guidelines**

 
 
I want to hire someone who can teach me how to

A) Create videos (Yes, I know this is pretty basic);

B)  Help me get the greatest number of hits for these videos; and

C) Teach me how to manage my material on the web sites where these videos are posted

WHAT I AM DOING:  At the risk of sounding grandiose, I want to publicize and disseminate ideas which I think are provocative, deviate dramatically from social and political norms and really delver some punch.  These ideas are expressed in essays I have written.  (Yes, I know the idea of reading essays sounds dull, but keep reading)

Since a constant drumbeat of ideas might be intellectually taxing, I offer a change  of pace  with what might be called "the urbane man's rap."  These are highly rhythmic, rhyming poems which take shots at various sacred cows.  

I am not asking for your advice as to what messages I will convey.  I know exactly what I want to convey; I just don't know how to use the myriad tools of digital persuasion.

WHAT I SEEK IN SOMEONE I MIGHT HIRE:  Above all, I value intelligence and honesty.  Please don't tell me you know how to do something if you don't know how to do it.   Don't be afraid to say that you don't know how to do something; hell, I am a complete and total Neanderthal in this digital world. 

You should be well versed in making videos and the more difficult task of creating a buzz and the excitement which might yield many visits to my sites.  I want to maximize the number of hits my stuff gets. 

Also, please have good communication skills.  I understand things best when they are clearly explained in English.  I am not a visual person. 

To WIN ME OVER:  Give me examples of projects, you came up with or administered, in which a web site, which had only gotten one hundred hits, soon got 500,000 hits.  Okay, maybe half a million is a fanciful dream, but the idea is to push that number up as high as possible
 
  • Less than 30 hrs/weekHourly
  • 1 to 3 monthsProject Length
  • IntermediateI am looking for a mix of experience and value
  • Project Type:Ongoing project

You will be asked to answer the following questions when submitting a proposal:

  1. Have you taken any Upwork tests and done well on them that you think are relevant to this job?
  2. Do you have any degrees or certifications which might be relevant to this job

Skills and expertiseEnglish Search Engine Optimization (SEO) Website Development

Preferred qualifications
  • Job Success Score: At least 90%
  • Include Rising Talent: Yes
  • English level:  Fluent
  • Upwork hours:  At least 1 hour
  • Location: Eastern Time Zone
Activity on this job
  • Proposals:  Less than 5
  • Last viewed by client:  19 hours ago
  • Interviewing: 0
  • Invites sent: 4
  • Unanswered invites: 1

 

re: "I want to hire someone who can teach me how to

A) Create videos

B) Help me get the greatest number of hits for these videos; and

C) Teach me how to manage my material on the web sites where these videos are posted"

 

David:
Why did you post one job posting for 3 different jobs?

 

It looks like you should be hiring multiple people.

I will divide the ad into its components.  Good advice. 

By restricting your job to US only you miss out on thousands of talented people. 

But aside from that, the posting is too long, rambling, and the skill sets require more than one person. Hire consultants on an hourly basis, they will discuss with you for as long as you like. 

David,  adding on to Martina's comment ... some of the highest skilled video folk are in Eastern Europe, their English is excellent, and they don't charge LA or NYC prices.  

Martina:

 

I don't want to prematurely exclude most of the people on this globe, but it occurred to me that creating videos (I have decided to do that first) might require the sort of hands on work in which someone would make a housecall to my residence.  Making videos may require installing hardware and configuring software, fabricating a background, creating the proper lighting, etc. etc. etc.  Actually, I was thinking of limiting freelancers to New York City, where I live, and its environs.   

David: I hired people to help me create videos, including the introduction video that is featured on my Upwork profile page.

 

Obviously I had to hire somebody local. In my own town. Because I'm in the video, along with local talent.

 

As a client, most of my job posts are open to any freelancer anywhere. But not all.

 

There's nothing wrong with limiting your hiring to local people and there are many good reasons for doing so.

abinadab-agbo
Community Member


David G wrote:

1)Where can I find a button or icon to click to send the freelancer a message.

2) I have only gotten 1 response.  Please give me constructive criticism, tell me why my ad might dissuade people from applying, tell me if I make assertions which are off-putting or disturbing.


1) On Upwork, there is no button to directly message a freelancer until they've accepted your invitation. This is how Upwork is designed, to limit spam for freelancers.

 

2) Historically, overly long job posts tend to attract fewer applicants. While clients are encouraged to create meaningful job posts, Upwork has never encouraged clients to ramble in the Job description section. Your job post should be as short as it can be.

When a job post is overly long, it sends a message (probably unwittingly), that the client will be too demanding and difficult to work with. Try condensing to 160 characters and reposting and see whether magic does not happen on that same job post.

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