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7e8d2f16
Community Member

fixed price escrow refund disputed by freelancer

Hello! I deleted all freelencer login permissinos from my website last week, because he did not finished the job, was over deadline and I had to restore my older version of my webpage.

Now he desputed the contract cancelling, that he finished. - I only can show now the dialoge to the Arbitration.

- What if the freelancer can not prove, that the site works - because it is not done?

17 REPLIES 17
prestonhunter
Community Member

Laszlo:

The proper thing for the freelancer to do is to agree to your refund request and allow you to retrieve all of the escrow funds.

 

The fastest way for you to handle this is for you to release all of the escrow funds to the freelancer and then close the contract.

 

So you need to make a decision: How much money is this, really? How much is my time worth?

 

You may still be able to avoid arbitration by agreeing to release all the funds to him.


If you want to go to arbitration, which will cost you $291, you might "win". You might not.


@Preston H wrote:

Laszlo:

The proper thing for the freelancer to do is to agree to your refund request and allow you to retrieve all of the escrow funds.


 Really? You have a crystal ball and know exactly what the freelancer did and didn't do?

 

No?

 

So how can you state, as if it was a fact, that it would be "the proper thing" for the freelancer to do?

 


@Preston H wrote:

If you want to go to arbitration, which will cost you $291, you might "win". You might not.


 Arbitration comes after dispute mediation. Dispute mediation costs nothing (other than minimal time)

 

 

re: "You have a crystal ball and know exactly what the freelancer did and didn't do?"

 

I have no idea what the freelancer did or didn't do.

 

The client initiated a request for a full refund. So from the client's perspective, the proper thing for the freelancer to do was to refund all the money in escrow.

 

Keep in mind that I also advised the client to release all the payment to the freelancer.


Both of these actions would have eliminated the need to go to a dispute or arbitration.

Because obviously I believe in avoiding going to the Upwork dispute or arbitration process.

 

I believe the situation described in the original post is one in which a client and freelancer are NOT on the same page and are not communicating effectively with each other.

 

If what happened as that the freelancer worked hard on this project but the client was completely unsatisfied with the results, then what probably should have happened is this:

 

The client should have briefly explained that he can't use the freelancer's work and will need to hire somebody else. The client would then offer to release half of the escrow funds immediately, while pointing out that if this is not acceptable to the freelancer, the client could instead pay him nothing.

Are You serious? Half of it for just nothing?

I got nothing! The website became worse, than at start.

That is why I had to restore the old version. Not because of play and joke.

7e8d2f16
Community Member

Probably freelancer will show soon exactly, what he did, otherwise there is nothing to see.

What I am sure in: when I canceled the contract, It was a nightmare page and it was +4 days over deadline.

Hi Laszlo,

So sorry to hear you are in this unpleasant situation. However you are not at the arbitration stage. The mediation team will review the information you've provided and assist with the dispute according to the Escrow policy. We won't however be able to advise as to what would be the outcome of arbitration should the situation progress to that stage.

~Nina

We'll see, if it goes to arbitration.

If it goes to, do You know, or heard about any extra costs used to occur

regarding the arbitration process above the 291 $ ?

Do they used to demand from the loser to pay off the other 291 $, what the opponent paid for his part?

Thanks for Your answer in advance.

Laszlo,

Each of the Dispute Parties and Upwork will share the cost equally ($291 each). You will not be responsible for the other party's arbitration fee in this scenario.

~Nina

re: "Are You serious? Half of it for just nothing?"

 

You are not offering to pay half for "nothing."

 

You are offering to pay half so that you do not need to deal with this person any longer. So that the matter is closed and he stops trying to get ALL of it.

 

Keep in mind that if you go to an official Upwork dispute, Upwork does NOT look at the work a freelancer does and decide who is wrong or right.

 

If you go to a dispute, it means that Upwork encourages you to work out your differences.

 

It is only when you go to arbitration (for which there is a cost) that an independent third-party person will consider who is "wrong" and who is "right" and who should get the money.

Thank You for the viewpoint, altough I pretty much protesting against the offer of half, because the whole price was only 600 $.

Even so I know 100% sure I am right, because it was not done at all, when I cancelled the contract.

Even the guy called me, who offered this freelancer to ask if I should not write negative feedback on him and he told to this guy, that He is going to finish it very soon.


@7e8d2f16wrote:

Thank You for the viewpoint, altough I pretty much protesting against the offer of half, because the whole price was only 600 $.

Even so I know 100% sure I am right, because it was not done at all, when I cancelled the contract.

Even the guy called me, who offered this freelancer to ask if I should not write negative feedback on him and he told to this guy, that He is going to finish it very soon.

____________________________________

 

 

You said in your first post that the freelancer had "not finished" the work, which suggests that he did some work on it. 

 

If  the freelancer completed part of the job, perhaps you could come to some kind of agreement and pay him part and he can agree to refund the rest to you. 


For me, He did not done anything, what I can use.

I restored the old version, because it is better, than the "new" was.

I hope, this upwork platform not intended to create jacking people by developers, who did something for themselves, but worth nothing for the clients.


@Laszlo S wrote:

Thank You for the viewpoint, altough I pretty much protesting against the offer of half, because the whole price was only 600 $.

Even so I know 100% sure I am right, because it was not done at all, when I cancelled the contract.

Even the guy called me, who offered this freelancer to ask if I should not write negative feedback on him and he told to this guy, that He is going to finish it very soon.


So you hired somebody who handed the work down to another freelancer? I am a bit confused about the last bit.

 

Did the freelancer you hired communicate the delay?

Did he or somebody else completed the job after you cancelled the contract?

Did you reach out to the freelancer before cancelling the contract?

 

Is it an option to check the (according to the freelancer) now completed work to see if it is what you asked for? It might be the easiest solution to use it in the end. You can start a new contract (maybe at a lowr rate?) and give an honest feedback (deadline, communication).

No

No

No

Yes

Not completed none of it's parts.

kat303
Community Member


@Laszlo S wrote:

Thank You for the viewpoint, altough I pretty much protesting against the offer of half, because the whole price was only 600 $.

Even so I know 100% sure I am right, because it was not done at all, when I cancelled the contract.

Even the guy called me, who offered this freelancer to ask if I should not write negative feedback on him and he told to this guy, that He is going to finish it very soon.


I'm a bit confused with your last statement (italicized)

 Even the guy called me? --- what guy?

who offered this freelancer --- what freelancer?

not write negative feedback on him --- who's him?

he told to this guy --- again, what guy?

 

Having said that, When a dispute is filed this is what happens.

1 A mediator will tell you and the freelancer to come to some sort of agreement. To negotiate between yourselves  Such as X% of the funds in escrow will go to the freelancer (because they did do some work) and X% of the funds in escrow will be returned to the client (because work was not completed or not completed correctly). No ruling is made, just an Upwork mediator telling both of you to work it out. There is NO charge for this.

If no agreement can be made between client/freelancer then the next step is arbitration.

2. During arbitration the client and the freelancer EACH pay the arbitration fee of $291. During this phase an arbitrator will listen to each party, look at work, look at all communication and make a Binding decision on who should get the funds in escrow.

Now - If BOTH parties pay the arbitration fee, no matter who is determined to receive the funds in escrow, NEITHER party gets the arbitration fee back and neither party has to pay the other party's fee. BUT, if , let's say, you the client, pay the fee, and the freelancer doesn't pay it, then you get the fee back and you will get all the funds in escrow.  But, that's a gamble 50/50 chance of the other party not paying the fee because it's too high, or not worth it.

So at this point of the process, it's your decision on how you want to proceed.

 


@Laszlo S wrote:

We'll see, if it goes to arbitration.

If it goes to, do You know, or heard about any extra costs used to occur

regarding the arbitration process above the 295 $ ?

Thanks for Your answer in advance.


 ___________________________________

If the freelancer has disputed, then you will probably have to take it to arbitration.  If the freelancer refuses to engage in the arbitration then I think his or her account is suspended and any money in escrow is returned to you.If the freelancer agrees to arbitration and you win, then whatever money is in escrow is returned to you.If you lose the arbitration then the money is released to the freelancer. There shouldn't be any further charges, whatever happens.

 

ETA: Before going to arbitration, I think Upwork mediates and tries to get both client and freelancer to agree. However, Upwork does not make judgement calls on quality of work etc.   

 

 

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