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taha-al-lawati
Community Member

Clients Hiring Based on Country

Hi all,
Do you think that clients care about the freelancer's country when making the hiring decision? Do they take that fact into consideration? Do you think that freelancers from Arab/Asian countries might get rejected just because they are from Arab/Asian countries?

15 REPLIES 15
jr-translation
Community Member


Taha A wrote:

Hi all,
Do you think that clients care about the freelancer's country when making the hiring decision? Do they take that fact into consideration? Do you think that freelancers from Arab/Asian countries might get rejected just because they are from Arab/Asian countries?


Taha,

the answer to all your questions is: Yes, but not all of them.

There are so many clients, so many situations that I would not try to be in the clients' minds.

They are mostly looking for someone to do their job properly, and it's easier if you are available when they are up. Apart from that, I would not expect all clients to avoid the same countries.

goriyaz
Community Member

Upwork is not different from real life and therefore, yeah some clients don't want to work with people depending on their origin, their country, their color, their s e x (...). Don't think about that, try to focus on clients needs and on what you could offer to them.

g_vasilevski
Retired Team Member
Retired Team Member

Hi Yazid,

 


Yazid M wrote:

Upwork is not different from real life and therefore, yeah some clients don't want to work with people depending on their origin, their country, their color, their s e x (...). Don't think about that, try to focus on clients needs and on what you could offer to them.


Just to confirm that the above is a violation of our TOS and we don't support any type of discrimination. If you see any jobs like this feel free to send us (Moderators) the job post link and our team will investigate it further. Thank you.

~ Goran
Upwork


Goran V wrote:

Hi Yazid,

 


Yazid M wrote:

Upwork is not different from real life and therefore, yeah some clients don't want to work with people depending on their origin, their country, their color, their s e x (...). Don't think about that, try to focus on clients needs and on what you could offer to them.


Just to confirm that the above is a violation of our TOS and we don't support any type of discrimination. If you see any jobs like this feel free to send us (Moderators) the job post link and our team will investigate it further. Thank you.


Hello Goran,

 

Yes I know that and trust me, I take no prisoners when it come with a discrimination (every types of discriminations). But, most of the time, you don't know if you're victim of the discrimination because you're just not being interviewed and that could be a reason among others and then, it's better to move on and not think about it.

Also sometimes, it's more subtle. For example, a client has already said to me that he would not rise my rate because it was his rate with his others freelancers... from Africa. And I'm a frenchman living in France. That's not for me a direct form of discrimination but a way to maintain low rates with the excuse to be a part of a global marketplace.
And btw, I have only seen one time a job offer with a discriminate element but it was removed really fast.

 

Have a nice day mate


Goran V wrote:

Hi Yazid,

 


Yazid M wrote:

Upwork is not different from real life and therefore, yeah some clients don't want to work with people depending on their origin, their country, their color, their s e x (...). Don't think about that, try to focus on clients needs and on what you could offer to them.


Just to confirm that the above is a violation of our TOS and we don't support any type of discrimination. If you see any jobs like this feel free to send us (Moderators) the job post link and our team will investigate it further. Thank you.


Does that mean all the jobs exclusive to people in the US violate the ToS?

Hi Jennifer,

 

Upwork does not allow discrimination against color, race or national origin. If a client expresses a preference in a job post that is discriminatory, they are in violation of our Terms of Service and we will take action and remove those job posts. We allow clients to search and hire based on the freelancer’s location because we recognize that some projects may require localized knowledge, work within certain time zones, or other factors that require the freelancer be in a specific location. Thank you.

~ Goran
Upwork


Goran V wrote:

Hi Jennifer,

 

Upwork does not allow discrimination against color, race or national origin. If a client expresses a preference in a job post that is discriminatory, they are in violation of our Terms of Service and we will take action and remove those job posts. We allow clients to search and hire based on the freelancer’s location because we recognize that some projects may require localized knowledge, work within certain time zones, or other factors that require the freelancer be in a specific location. Thank you.


So it is ok to write: I only want freelancers living in Europe. But it is against the Tos to write: I do not want freelancers living outside Europe.


Jennifer R wrote:


So it is ok to write: I only want freelancers living in Europe. But it is against the Tos to write: I do not want freelancers living outside Europe.


Terms of Use

4.1 EXAMPLES OF PROHIBITED USES OF THE SITE

(...)

Expressing an unlawful preference in a job post or proposal or otherwise unlawfully discriminating on a protected basis;

(...)

 

Unless unlawful in California, both are allowed.

-----------
"Where darkness shines like dazzling light"   —William Ashbless

Good question, Jennifer.

The Labor Department's take on this is that you are perfectly allowed to discriminate if you can link your preference to a task that is part of the job. So, you can say "Only aliens from Jupiter" if you are looking for a writer/web designer/man-eating globbulax tamer where knowing about Jupiter was a critical part of the job. That would include, say, writing about politics on Jupiter or speaking Jupiteroxy or something like that.

I'm inclined to suspect "only candidates from the United States" is a job requirement that would be pretty hard to prove is absolutely necessary. I'm from the United States and I have to research almost anything I write even if it's about something that's happening on the next block,. On the other hand, a publisher could claim that our culture includes many finely-tuned nuances only someone from America could understand, like why Elvis Presley was such a gun freak and things like that.

To me "only U.S. residents" is clearly a way of discriminating, but I have looked at jobs postings from England that inludes "must know how to write for an English audience," as part of the qualifications. And, it turns out, there are many slightly puggled expressions those dafties know that would baffle most of us Yanks. So, it's hard to say. I think any barrister worth two guineas could make the case pretty easily ... leaving us morality bobbies in the bloody bench-hole, so to speak.


For a start, we 'dafties' don't have the word 'puggled' in our dictionary - nor indeed dafties, I shouldn't think. 🙂 

 

amandamiwi
Community Member

The short answer is yes.

There are a lot of different situations as to why a client may not want to hire someone from a specific location. One important one that comes to mind is that clients are often held to local hiring laws within their own country and so it's more difficult for them to legally hire freelancers outside of certain zones (such as the EU).

There's also the concept of hiring in a global market. While many clients are looking for freelancers that can provide good service for cheap and are willing to hire the best person for the job with the best offered rate, some may find it unethical to hire freelancers for significantly less than competitors located in the same area as the client. 

I hope this helps and wish you all the luck in your job hunt.

There is a difference between "hiring" an employee and contracting with a freelancer, I believe, in terms of the US Dept. of Labor.

Another aspect to this question is freelancers refusing to work with clients from certain countries. I do, but for purely economic reasons. I live in a country where the cost of living is high and I could not work for the rates that would be considered normal in some countries. Nothing to do with prejudice.

Yeah, I think you're right, Mary.

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