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renata101
Community Member

Contract cheating just made the New York Times

NYT recently published article that discusses the complexity of the issue:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/07/us/college-cheating-papers.html

 

Unfortunately, some of the details of this aren't really news to anyone who works in writing or editing on UpWork. Two years ago, I found the profile of an FL (or most likely a farmer) who had made 20K taking care of other people's homework. I've seen client pages that clearly show people initiating multiple contracts for school assignments, complete with rubrics and assignment sheets. 


23 REPLIES 23
shefen
Community Member

I've seen programming assignments posted, and flagged them.I haven't seen any lately but then I don't read as many job posts as when I first started on Upwork.

 

renata101
Community Member


Sheila F wrote:

I've seen programming assignments posted, and flagged them.I haven't seen any lately but then I don't read as many job posts as when I first started on Upwork.

 


I've also seen clients looking to hire freelancers to handle aeronautics engineering problem sets, prepare papers on architectural safety assessment methods (this one included a course rubric), and complete nursing assignments. I've also received invites for homework assignments.

gilbert-phyllis
Community Member

I always flag academic fraud when I see it, which is pretty much every time I look at job posts. Often, I find more than one in a single session. If it's so easy for us to recognize these frauds, why is it so difficult for UW?

I hope UW takes action when you flag this type of offers?


Luce N wrote:

I hope UW takes action when you flag this type of offers?


Luce, I don't know whether or not they do. I get an automated message thanking me for flagging it. I don't follow up to see because I'm not willing to spend my time and energy that way AND it's not a problem that will ever be resolved by following up individual instances. They need a systemic remedy. I flag individual instances as a civic duty.

I know all about the "thanks for flagging" message, I regularly do my civic duty too!

Upwork could offer a bounty for reporting fraud. Payment could be in connects. The first person to flag a post gets the bounty. New freelancers would learn to spot fraud, earning a few connects and it wouldn't cost Upwork anything beyond the time it takes to review the post. But then there needs to be something in place to keep people from reporting posts just for the connects and wasting Upwork employee time. What do they do now? Do they review every report or wait for multiple reports for a given post?

 


Sheila F wrote:

Upwork could offer a bounty for reporting fraud. Payment could be in connects. The first person to flag a post gets the bounty. New freelancers would learn to spot fraud, earning a few connects and it wouldn't cost Upwork anything beyond the time it takes to review the post. But then there needs to be something in place to keep people from reporting posts just for the connects and wasting Upwork employee time. What do they do now? Do they review every report or wait for multiple reports for a given post?

 


Sheila, at first the connects bounty sounds fine, but some smart scammer would organise some system by which a "client" would offer a "job" just for his friend to flag it and get free connects!

re: "If it's so easy for us to recognize these frauds, why is it so difficult for UW?"

 

Don't underestimate the superiority of human intelligence relative to computers.

 

Ultimately, the only thing inside a computer is zeros and ones.

What you may think is easy can be quite difficult to do using only zeroes and ones.

 

Just look at how difficult it is for Upwork to implement automated systems that identify the locations of users, or automatically recognize information on driver's licenses.

 

And that is if we assume that significant effort is being put into this.


Preston H wrote:

re: "If it's so easy for us to recognize these frauds, why is it so difficult for UW?"

 

Don't underestimate the superiority of human intelligence relative to computers.

 


Yes, but we flag and ticket them for human consideration on UW and nothing happens.  You can see obvious instances of clients continually asking for projects where they've attached their assignment sheets.


Renata S wrote:

Preston H wrote:

re: "If it's so easy for us to recognize these frauds, why is it so difficult for UW?"

 

Don't underestimate the superiority of human intelligence relative to computers.

 


Yes, but we flag and ticket them for human consideration on UW and nothing happens.  You can see obvious instances of clients continually asking for projects where they've attached their assignment sheets.

_____________________________________


It would seem that human consideration on Upwork condones academic fraud despite the lip service paid to fraud in the ToS which is ambiguous to say the least. It is possible to weed out the fraudsters,the farmers and the essay mills. Unfortunately many of these people are generating doubtful income for this company and so at the risk of rocking the corporate boat - nothing whatsoever is done to stop this. 


Nichola L wrote:

Renata S wrote:

Preston H wrote:

re: "If it's so easy for us to recognize these frauds, why is it so difficult for UW?"

 

Don't underestimate the superiority of human intelligence relative to computers.

 


Yes, but we flag and ticket them for human consideration on UW and nothing happens.  You can see obvious instances of clients continually asking for projects where they've attached their assignment sheets.

_____________________________________


It would seem that human consideration on Upwork condones academic fraud despite the lip service paid to fraud in the ToS which is ambiguous to say the least. It is possible to weed out the fraudsters,the farmers and the essay mills. Unfortunately many of these people are generating doubtful income for this company and so at the risk of rocking the corporate boat - nothing whatsoever is done to stop this. 


I will say that the posts sometimes get shut down, at least temporarily. This normally provies the clients with enough information about what not to say that they can successfully repost their requests moments later with less obvious wording. Clients aren't shut down for posting them and nothing happens to the FLs who take them. 



It would seem that human consideration on Upwork condones academic fraud despite the lip service paid to fraud in the ToS which is ambiguous to say the least. It is possible to weed out the fraudsters,the farmers and the essay mills. Unfortunately many of these people are generating doubtful income for this company and so at the risk of rocking the corporate boat - nothing whatsoever is done to stop this. 


I have recently become more and more vexed at the farmer outsourcing issue that has been going on forever but is getting perpetually worse.

The algorithms favor the farmers whose profiles are showcased or highlighted to new clients both via direct email and in search.

I know the ToS allows for outsourcing in Fixed Price contracts, but I found this clause which might be able to stop them:

1.3 ACCOUNT PROFILE
To register for an Account to join the Site, you must complete a User profile (“Profile”), which you consent to be shown to other Users and, unless you change your privacy settings, to be shown to the public. You agree to provide true, accurate, and complete information on your Profile and all registration and other forms you access on the Site or provide to us and to update your information to maintain its truthfulness, accuracy, and completeness. You agree not to provide any false or misleading information about your identity or location, your business, your skills, or the services your business provides and to correct any such information that is or becomes false or misleading.
 
Surely claiming to have done thousands of hourly jobs without having actually done them yourself is enough evidence to prove that you're a farmer?
 
I've brought this up with the Trust and Safety team, but only using a CS rep as an intermediary and although he is brilliant and perseveres, there's still the second language English barrier in the way.
 
This same team refuse to communicate with me directly.
 
I've got 3 profiles on the platform who have been doing this for many years and are simply allowed to get away with it because they're making so much money.
 
Why is it that they can keep both the clients and the other FLs whom they employ in the dark, at the detriment to others who stick to the rules?
 
I've even traced one of these farmers who at one stage worked for another farmer and then clicked, hey, why don't I also do this, it's so easy, I can make all the money without actually doing any of the work?
 
How is it that they're amazing polyglots who can speak and translate 13 languages somehow, but continue to post jobs looking for other freelancers who speak those same languages?
 
Why are these farmers not forced to become agencies?
 
Is it because the clients wouldn't hire them and want to work with FLs directly?
 
Is it not the client's right to know their work is being outsourced and they're effectively working through several middle men?
 
I wish this problem was restricted to only India/Pakistan/Bangladesh/Philipphines, but unfortunately it's not, as I have evidence of FL's hiding behind their fake profiles.
 
Any suggestions on how we as a community can collectively complain and find a solution to these farmers?
 
Evidence is pretty hard to obtain as most of it is hidden behind PTCs (private talent clouds).
 
Any negative feedback due to poor work is simply removed by the farmer as they have that privilege due to their extensive history and earnings.
 
I'm not looking for Kudos here, I want to here from others who have done anything more than simply flagging a farmers profile or post.
 
Perhaps the newbies can be informed about their actual worth and to avoid working for farmers.
 
How this can be done without bringing the platform into disrepute is a difficult one to navigate.
 
Naming and shaming isn't allowed.
 
I cannot mention anything about the posts or profiles of these farmers.
 
Upwork will not take the matter further.
 
I feel as hopeless as telling the COVIDIOTS to stay the f. home and wear a mask when they're out to protect others - it's like wasting your breath and getting annoyed without any chance of fixing anything!
 
Deep sigh after getting that off my chest, now back to my feed to find/flag job postings...

This seems like an awful waste of time.


Mark F wrote:
This seems like an awful waste of time.

I agree, it is a waste of time especially if it doesn't affect one personally.

 

I'm hoping to see some responses from those who it does affect and any feedback towards a solution going forward.

 

In other words I don't simply want to ignore the issue as it's not going to go away, it's only getting worse...


David M wrote:

Mark F wrote:
This seems like an awful waste of time.

I agree, it is a waste of time especially if it doesn't affect one personally.

 

I'm hoping to see some responses from those who it does affect and any feedback towards a solution going forward.

 

In other words I don't simply want to ignore the issue as it's not going to go away, it's only getting worse...


Sounds like an interesting hobby.

 

I don't see how it affects you.  I can see how you might think it does but my guess is that anyone willing to hire them wouldn't hire you and, most likely, you wouldn't want to work with someone who would hire them.  It is easy to imagine you are losing clients but are they really clients if they never would work with you in the first place.


David M wrote:


How is it that they're amazing polyglots who can speak and translate 13 languages somehow, but continue to post jobs looking for other freelancers who speak those same languages?
13 languages is nothing, try 31.
Deep sigh after getting that off my chest, now back to my feed to find/flag job postings...
Don't waste your time on that.
The clients get what they pay for.

 

I need to understand the issue further. What is a "farmer" and a "Private Talent Cloud"?

 

TY.


Preston H wrote:

re: "If it's so easy for us to recognize these frauds, why is it so difficult for UW?"

 

Don't underestimate the superiority of human intelligence relative to computers.

 

Ultimately, the only thing inside a computer is zeros and ones.

What you may think is easy can be quite difficult to do using only zeroes and ones.


Ultimately, the only thing inside a brain is protons, neutrons and electrons. What you may think is easy can be quite difficult to do using only protons, neutrons and electrons. It's a good thing that natural selection is smarter than Upwork.

Especially when the job posting literally says "I need someone to write an academic paper" in the title................

It would be a simple thing to scan, find 'academic paper' and **bleep**can that job offer. No?

I need an assistant from you 

jokerette
Community Member

Talk about senseless outsourcing. The nerve!

 

We can cheat just as well, if not better, in the good ole US.  😉

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