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gubernatis_kevin
Community Member

Fortune Cards?

I have a weird, random question; can a freelancer offer entertainment services? 

 

I read fortune cards from time to time and I wondered if that was something that I could offer as a service through UpWork.  Selling readings in most instances offline is considered an entertainment service, somewhat similar to how one sells their services as a massage therapist, party entertainer (clown, comedian), or crowd entertainer (musician, magician). 

 

Is this allowed on UpWork?  I can see how one could easily provide the service through Upwork's video chat service.  Even if it was allowed, would anyone even think to come to UpWork for that?  

 

Is this super weird or innapropriate?  Possibly, but that's why I put it into coffee break, so that you could all make fun of me and witness my strangeness.  

 

Thanks for your time, and have a wonderful day.  

ACCEPTED SOLUTION
astepanov83
Community Member

Prohibited uses of the site: https://www.upwork.com/legal#prohibitedsite

Nothing related to fortune cards. Would be fun to know if people are interested in this.

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17 REPLIES 17
petra_r
Community Member


Kevin G wrote:

 

Is this allowed on UpWork? 


I don't see why not? Whether there is much demand for it is another question.

That's the other thing I was wondering about, yeah.

astepanov83
Community Member

Prohibited uses of the site: https://www.upwork.com/legal#prohibitedsite

Nothing related to fortune cards. Would be fun to know if people are interested in this.

Thanks for the help, Aleksandr.  Yeah, I thought it would be kind of fun too.  

renata101
Community Member

Hey Kevin, 

I know there are astrologers and numerology specialists working on Upwork, so why not? The thing I can't tell you is how a bad prediction might affect your JSS.  

Hey Renata,

 

That's awesome to know, thanks for sharing it!  I guess I'll put it on my profile then, if I can.  Oh, I bet it would, if clients gave me a bad review after, but I also am pretty good at reading them, so I'm not so worried.  Haha!

gubernatis_kevin
Community Member

Oh, well, while it looks like there's nothing against it, there's also not a known skill for it, so I can't add it to my skills.  Might contact UW directly and see if they have a solution/suggestion.  

People do ask for readings - I've done them and that's the word they tend to use. Usually, they'll expect them to be written but that doesn't mean card readings in the way you describe aren't possible. 

 

However, it depends what you mean by 'fortune cards'. You can sell tarot readings (Rider Waite style for Americans and either RW or Marseilles style for Europeans), and you may get away with Le Normand style cards, but any bespoke deck would be a hard sell.

 

There's certainly a market for astrological interpretations (I do this quite regularly), but it's extremely competitive and you'd need at the minimum to be able to prepare a full natal chart.

First, thanks for the input.  It's very helpful.  I think it's just heartening to know that this kind of work has been done on Upwork at all, honestly.  I've done a reading over text chat before, but that one didn't go so well, as I feel like I need to have at least a visual connection with the person.  That being said, I bet I could do a reading for someone and then send them an image of the cards, along with an interperetation of the reading.

 

Oh no, I don't do straight up tarot cards.  Truth is, I purchased the deck I use (Madame Endora's) for their visual appeal.  I meant to use them as a physical aspect of a game that I play, but once I got them, I felt a kind of pull to try and actually use them.  I started reading for myself (which is kinda hard), but then I read them for my wife and some other folks (which was a lot easier), and I just kept on with it.  Couldn't imagine using them in a game now.  

 

I have no understanding of how to interperate astrology beyond understanding people's signs.  I don't even know what a natal chart is.  

 

I guess I'm entry level?  Maybe burgeoning on intermediate?  Haha.  I don't know.  I just know that my readings have been helpful to people I've done them for and that feels good.  Wouldn't feel bad at all to get paid for it, either.  

 

I tired adding it as a skill, but the interface won't let me.  I've seen how Astrology can be added as a skill, but what umbrella of skills does that fall under?


Kevin G wrote:

First, thanks for the input.  It's very helpful.  I think it's just heartening to know that this kind of work has been done on Upwork at all, honestly.  I've done a reading over text chat before, but that one didn't go so well, as I feel like I need to have at least a visual connection with the person.  That being said, I bet I could do a reading for someone and then send them an image of the cards, along with an interperetation of the reading.

 

You could photograph a spread, but you can't simply send someone images of the cards without breaching copyright. And card designers come down heavily on this.

 

Oh no, I don't do straight up tarot cards. 

 

If you want to make money from card readings, then you need to learn. Because not only are people much more likely to ask for tarot, 'fortune' cards like you mention are based on the same symbolism and methodology as tarot (yours are from the same school of thought as RW tarot cards), but miss a lot of possibilities out. And once you can do tarot it's really easy to adapt to any 'fortune' cards.  

 

I have no understanding of how to interperate astrology beyond understanding people's signs.  I don't even know what a natal chart is.  

 

A full chart cast for an individual's time, date and place of birth.

And people won't necessarily want predictions.

 

The posts I've seen asking for readings and the type of projects I've done tend to be from people who can at least understand the basics themselves. And they've often had readings done elsewhere.  So expectations can be high. Plus it can be more difficult than dealing with people sitting in front of you as it's impossible to use any cold reading tricks or misdirection if you go slightly off course. But it can be done...

 

 

Thanks for the heads up about copyright, I wouldn't have expected that to be a thing, but of course it is.  I might even just send a description.  

 

I guess this is less about trying to specifically focus on earning money through reading cards, and more about being able to diversify my portfolio by adding the more esoteric skills that I possess.  I don't want to learn the tarot.  I have a lot of personal reasons for why I don't, that I'm happy to share, but that might not be appropriate for an open forum.  I do understand that learning the tarot might be beneficial to me with respect to this endeavor, but I'm happy with my knowledge base. 

 

I'm far more keen on increasing my memorization of the meanings of the cards that I have, then in learning anything new.  I'm very good at inperpreting someone's spread in referrence to their question, but I have trouble remembering the nuanced meanings of certain cards, and often have to reference them.  So, even if I were keen on learning a new set, I'd still want to master the deck I know best now.  

 

Oh yes!  I used to own a book that was a huge reference for all of that kind of information.  I remember that my star was Gamma Draconis.  It was incredibly fascinating how accurate that infomation was about people.  I gave the book to a...well a kind of protege who was fascinated by it.  I kind f grew up around a lot of this kind of stuff and will randomly have a wealth of knowledge, or paraphenalia regarding it, because of this.  

 

Huh, well if they don't want predictions and their expectations are so high, what exactly are they looking for, or expecting?  Insight into their inner selves, or connection to other entities, or spirits?  I'm not sure I'd know how to do a reading beyond that.  Usually when I've done readings it's been with respect to a specific issue, problem or question someone has that they want insight regarding.  

 

Not really sure how to take that last bit, but I kind of feel jabbed?  If that wasn't your intention, cool, but I don't use cold reading tricks and I NEVER misdirect anyone.  I don't even know how to do cold reading.  I mentioned wanting to at least see someone, because I've always felt that the cards are actually meaningless and that the reading has more to do with the spiritual and empathic connection I make with the person I am doing a reading for.  The cards are simply a way to focus and interpret that connection.  I'm honestly not even sure that it would be possible over video chat, and that's made me more and more hesitant to attempt this type of work, but I wanted to give it a try.  I've honestly only very recently thought that it would be ok to accept money for doing a reading at all, because I've always had an aversion to doing so.

 

I've also been hesitant to speak plainly about these kinds of things, because I wasn't sure how open the Upwork community was to it, but you are obviously versed in it, so I see no reason to tip toe around the subject with you.  I don't claim to know whether the guidance comes from within me, or whtehr I am a conduit for other spirits who want to help, though somewhere between the two feels like the truth, as I often feel like I am looking within, but I am also being guided by a friendly hand.  When I do a reading, I have the person think of a question, or issue that they want guidance on.  I have found that the more specific the question, the more insightful the reading will be.  I then come to an agreement with the person about the specific wording of the query, and then ask it aloud.  That's when the actual manipulation of the cards begins and I do a variation of the given instructions, involving waiting for specific mental images as ques for how to shuffle, because all magic should be done with one's own personal touch.  

 

Sorry, I know that was a lot of text, but my point is - I don't do cold readings and I don't trick anyone.  I really do appreciate your insights though.

 

I'm also really just trying to figure out how to put the skill into my profile honestly, and whether that will effect my job feed at all.  I don't want to put down astrology, because I don't know it, really.  It's also a vastly different skill from cartomancy.  

 

 

You obviously don’t have to do anything you don’t want to do, but the point about learning tarot is that once you understand the logic of how the card meanings work, it isn’t necessary to memorise anything.

 

Huh, well if they don't want predictions and their expectations are so high, what exactly are they looking for, or expecting? Insight into their inner selves, or connection to other entities, or spirits? 

 

Maybe. But nine times out of ten the questions are relationship-based. How to get along with X, what to look out for, how to improve the relationship… Plus in most places you can’t legally predict or offer advice in relation to law, medicine or finance (unless you have additional qualifications in the relevant field).

 

I'm not sure I'd know how to do a reading beyond that. Usually when I've done readings it's been with respect to a specific issue, problem or question someone has that they want insight regarding.  

 

And that isn’t a prediction. You’re not saying ‘Your husband will leave you next Wednesday.’

 

Not really sure how to take that last bit, but I kind of feel jabbed? 

 

There’s no jab. You specifically described the type of reading you were seeking to do as somewhat similar to how one sells their services as a massage therapist, party entertainer (clown, comedian), or crowd entertainer (musician, magician). In those contexts, certain techniques are used to add to the entertainment value. And you may need to misdirect from time to time to keep people’s attention. You’re now describing something different.

 

On balance, it matters much less how you view what you’re doing and more how people view what they get.

 

The easiest option when it comes to highlighting it on your profile is to upload a written-up sample reading.

 

Hmmm...well that is food for thought then.  I'll definitely give it some.

 

Ooooh....ok yeah - I mean, it's kind of semantics, but you're right, that isn't a prediction.  It IS exactly the kind of thing people ask me with respect to a reading.  Yeah, I am very careful to tell people what the cards are telling ME and to expressly not give them advice for those very good reasons, amongst others.  

 

Right, it IS an important distinction that I hadn't thought about until just now, so thanks for that insite.  

 

I understand, and apologize for visiting your intentions.  I put it that way, because that is how people that I've known who do it bill for it, because...it's kind of the only way you can?  The business world doesn't exactly give allowances for actual magical application.  That's also why I phrased it that way too, I wasn't sure how open, or receptive the Upwork community would be to the idea.  I guess I did mean something different, but I guess I did from point go and was misrepresenting myself.  Thanks for pointing that out.  

 

I am actually pretty firm about my readings.  I've even recast for some people, because they didn't like what they were hearing, but if that's what the cards say, that's what they say and they usually give me the same or similar answers.  

 

Hmmm...I suppose.  It's all about helping people, right?  I guess if they feel comforted, or bouyed then I've done what I set out to do.  I often feel like a lot of it is psychological - only in that most of what happens is people talking out their problems.  If they are paying for the service, I also don't ever want anyone to feel cheated, or that they weren't getting their money's worth.  I'll definitely keep that it mind as well.

 

THAT is exactly what I was looking for, thank you.  I did start one of those, but stopped when I realized that you have to start one of those projects off at $50 minimum and I feel like that's kinda high.  Is that high?  I always figured I'd charge like $20 for a half hour of reading or so.  

 

Thanks a lot for your input again.  

 

gubernatis_kevin
Community Member

lol, aaaand I just figured out how to suggest a skill.  Guess we'll see what happens.  

I do reiki for a few (un)fortunate souls 😉

 

But not on UP, obviously.

Interesting topic. Apparently there's no divination skill you can add to your profile. That would cover not only Tarot, but also I Ching, and even classical practices like haruspication and augury.

__________________________________________________
"No good deed goes unpunished." -- Clare Boothe Luce

Yes, it would be nice to have a sort of blanket category that covered a number of things.  As it stands, Astrology is something that I can put as a skill, but I don't actually know too much about Astrology.  As I was discussing with Kim F above, my journey into reading fortune cards is somewhat happenstance.  She helpfully suggested I create a smple project that people could look at on my profile, but I'm having trouble figuring out how to frame it - especially on which category of work it falls into.  Thanks for your comment!

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