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gilbert-phyllis
Community Member

Incentivize newbies to do their homework

From time to time, I cut loose with a little tirade advocating a meaningful readiness test that new FLs would be required to pass before being permitted to submit proposals. UW hasn't yet taken my advice and meanwhile, we continue to see FLs and clients stumbling and bumbling and wasting each others' time and money because they don't take the time to learn how the platform works and often have no prior experience with independent contracting. Those of us who do have a handle on things wind up shaking our heads and thinking (or commenting to each other), "The real problem is that the deliverable wasn't clear before she accepted the offer," or "The problem is they didn't discuss how to handle revisions before setting up the contract," or "The problem is they didn't agree on an estimate of the time required," and so on and so forth.

 

When I yak about a Meaningful Readiness Test I envision a multi-part exam that includes scenarios and multiple-choice questions about the best action to take in response. There is endless raw material in the forum and I'm pretty sure some capable FLs would be willing to help design this if UW gave meaningful assurance it would be implemented. I would do it for two coffee mugs. (Because if you only give me one, I'll surely drop it. If you give me two, I'll have them for decades and promise to feature them prominently in my social media feeds on a monthly basis.)

 

Now, it's clear UW doesn't want to put this kind of hurdle in front of FLs joining the platform. (It's not clear why, but if it were gonna happen, it would've by now.) So, instead of making it a requirement to join, make it an option. Anyone who passes the MRT will be recognized and rewarded with their choice of a Big Bag O'Connects or a special Know What I'm Doing badge.

 

 

18 REPLIES 18
JoanneP
Moderator
Moderator

Hi Phyllis,

 

Thank you for sharing your feedback on how we can improve the process of helping new users. I'll surely pass this along to the rest of the team. 

~ Joanne
Upwork
reinierb
Community Member


Joanne Marie P wrote:

Hi Phyllis,

 

Thank you for sharing your feedback on how we can improve the process of helping new users. I'll surely pass this along to the rest of the team. 


Joanne Marie, please don't see this comment as anything other than me being idly curious, but why do moderators always offer to pass things, such as for instance, Phyllis' plan for a meaningful Readiness Test, along to the relevant team? Don't teams have members whose job it is to think of the things you guys are always offering to pass on to them?

 

Not trying to be nasty here, I'm just asking an innocent question...

I agree with Phyliss. 

And not only because it will help people learn how it works, but also because it will help weed out those freelancers who aren't willing to put in a little effort. 

I agree completely with Phyllis and I, too, have been suggesting this for years.  Several of us, some of whom are highly experienced in test creation, have offered to do this for free (or a t-shirt or mug).  I've spoken with higher-ups at Upwork about this and everyone nods and agrees it would be a good idea but there it sits. I think it's maybe even more important than initial ID verification. It would probably put some of the forum moderators out of business but I believe it would greatly cut the Customer Service overhead incurred by new freelancers who don't know the platform at all.

When Upwork was oDesk (way back then) new freelancers did not even get to first base without passing the readiness test. Then, of course, there were fewer cheats who told you how to pass it.  

 

Now, it could be set up to constantly change, so that cheating would not be quite so easy. 

 

Cheating systems, at whatever level (not necessarily on Upwork), seems to be the new norm in the world these days.  The old-fashioned word "honor/honour"  has fallen off the leader board of success.   

 

 


Nichola L wrote:

When Upwork was oDesk (way back then) new freelancers did not even get to first base without passing the readiness test. Then, of course, there were fewer cheats who told you how to pass it.  

 

Now, it could be set up to constantly change, so that cheating would not be quite so easy. 

 

Cheating systems, at whatever level (not necessarily on Upwork), seems to be the new norm in the world these days.  The old-fashioned word "honor/honour"  has fallen off the leader board of success.   

 

It used to be money that made the world go around. Now it's money and corruption that make the world go around, with corruption possibly a tad ahead of money alone. 


 

If a meaningful test were ever to be put in place, ideally there would be a large pool of questions which would rotate through.  This could help alleviate cheating on the answers.  You wouldn't know ahead of time which questions would be asked.


Mary W wrote:

If a meaningful test were ever to be put in place, ideally there would be a large pool of questions which would rotate through.  This could help alleviate cheating on the answers.  You wouldn't know ahead of time which questions would be asked.


That has always seemed to me the first principle of designing such a test. There must be a large library of questions from which each individual test case pulls randomly. If the library is large enough, and updated regularly, then it would become much more difficult to game the test. 

 

Frankly with the platform literally drowning in freelancers I fail to see the point in adding any more at all, test or no test.


Petra R wrote:

Frankly with the platform literally drowning in freelancers I fail to see the point in adding any more at all, test or no test.


Me, too. Since UW seems determined to keep the admission gate wide open, I fantasize about ways to sift and sort the hordes once they're aboard.

 

Well, if you make the test a requirement for profile approval, that would really cut out a lot of the **Edited for Community Guidelines**

.

Phyllis, Mary, I hate to mention, but your comments make it look like you're both a little too afraid of healthy competition. 😉

Global competition. 🤑

It's good. It keeps things improving.

It's a global market out here. We MUST have a mechanism where newcomers have a chance of topping the game. Quickly, I'd hope! Upwork is giving at least some chance to newbies... and even to complete noobs. 👍

Otherwise it would be a first-in-last-out kind of system that doesn't work in any kind of practical arrangement. The experienced once would win, the green ones would always lose. With that arrangement, we would deny entire generations from success! 😬

That being said, may the best coconut-lover win! 😉:desert_island:😆 (Old or new, that doesn't really matter. But love for coconuts is a must.)

I have no problems with competition.  I can hold my own against anyone out there. 

 

My problem is with the "freelancers" who come to the platform, learn nothing about how it works, break every term in the TOS, plead ignorance, tie up customer service reps with their stuff and then go on to do it again.  If Upwork is ever going to run smoothly and professionally, better informed new freelancers will be a big part of the solution. 

 

I don't care if they are newbies in their field or newbies to freelancing.  I DO care if they are running up platform expenses because of their ignorance of the rules.

 

petra_r
Community Member


Mikko R wrote:
Phyllis, Mary, I hate to mention, but your comments make it look like you're both a little too afraid of healthy competition. 😉

No, it does no such thing, what a ridiculous and absurd thing to accuse them of!

The people in question are not their competition. They are the type of freelancers who give Upwork a bad name and upset clients, which then hurts the good freelancers and the platform.


Mikko R wrote:
Phyllis, Mary, I hate to mention, but your comments make it look like you're both a little too afraid of healthy competition. 😉

Global competition. 🤑

It's good. It keeps things improving.

It's a global market out here. We MUST have a mechanism where newcomers have a chance of topping the game. Quickly, I'd hope! Upwork is giving at least some chance to newbies... and even to complete noobs. 👍

Otherwise it would be a first-in-last-out kind of system that doesn't work in any kind of practical arrangement. The experienced once would win, the green ones would always lose. With that arrangement, we would deny entire generations from success! 😬

That being said, may the best coconut-lover win! 😉:desert_island:😆 (Old or new, that doesn't really matter. But love for coconuts is a must.)

The FLs who need readiness orientation are not my competition, nor would I advocate obstructing them if they were. That's not how I roll. In any case, you seem to have missed the point which is not to penalize or exclude the inexperienced but simply to ensure they understand the platform and the fundamentals of contracting before plunging into the UW marketplace. IMO not making sure new members are minimally ready does every one of them a disservice. It's bad for them, bad for clients, bad for the platform, bad for the rest of us. 

 

A meaningful readiness test of what? There are three distinct areas where one needs to be ready:

1. Ready to use the platform. It includes knowledge of where to find answers, knowedge of ToS, knowledge of how to respond, knowledge of how to invoice and collect money, and another half dozen things.

2. Ready to perform work as a freelancer. What are the client's responsibilities?  What is the nature of the client-provider relationship? How do you handle the relationship depending on what variables apply? How to tell UW to stay out, when to ask UW to step in. When to walk away. The difference between what the client believes he needs and what he actually needs. This is almost endless.

3. How to do the work. Know the standards for your domain. Honest self-assessment. How to handle the technical side of the job. Know when you're in over your head. Know when to call for help. Know when to subcontract part of the work someone else can do better. Again, this is almost endless.

Passing the "platform" readiness test basically means only that you're not going to drink from the toilet. The rest of it is much more difficult.

kochubei_valeria
Community Member

Hi All,

 

Thanks for the discussion and sharing your thoughts. I'd like to take some time and address a few points brought up here.

The moderators do have a formal process to share feedback discussed among Community members with Upwork teams. We aren’t always able to give you a detailed response about actions being taken related to your feedback, so we at least like to acknowledge to you that we hear you and we are sharing your ideas with the right teams. 

I’d also like to address some points about the topic of the Upwork Readiness Test. The Upwork Readiness Test is one of the requirements for talent to earn the Rising Talent badge, ensuring that these new users do understand best practices and how to stay safe on Upwork. It is also available for talent to take at any time and we are considering different points to surface it, so they can take it even earlier in the onboarding experience. While I don’t think there are immediate plans to make the Readiness Test required for all new talent, these ongoing conversations about the implications of not doing so are valuable pieces of feedback for our teams to keep in consideration. I have shared this thread with the appropriate teams. 

Lastly, I will not discuss moderated and removed content in detail here. However, I'd like to ask the participants of this thread to comply with our Community Guidelines and refrain from describing other Upwork users, or even entire groups of users, in a disrespectful or disparaging way. The experience and knowledge of others in their field, freelancing in general and freelancing on Upwork in particular varies, and while it may not meet your standard, referring to others in a negative and dehumanizing way will not be tolerated. Let's keep discussions in our corner of the Internet professional and respectful.

~ Valeria
Upwork
f1ad4923
Community Member

Thank you for your insights. I'm a newbie and want to learn the right way to freelance. I'll begin educating myself to ensure proposals submitted spell out the deliverable and expectations. 

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