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Inherent bias or PC [political correctness] meddling

Moderator
Valeria K Moderator Member Since: Mar 6, 2014
21 of 34

Hi All,

 

I moved all the posts but the OP to Coffee Break. It's a very interesting discussion and it's been interesting to follow it but it didn't directly relate to the original topic. Also, we need a new title for this new thread. Ramon, could you please suggest a new title for it if you don't mind? I appreciate your help.

~ Valeria
Untitled
Community Guru
Ramon B Member Since: Jan 11, 2015
22 of 34

Ok, how about 'Inherant bias or PC [political correctness] meddling?

Moderator
Valeria K Moderator Member Since: Mar 6, 2014
23 of 34

Here you go. Thank you!

~ Valeria
Untitled
Community Guru
Robert James R Member Since: Apr 17, 2015
24 of 34

I once used "he" before I realized how important gender neutrality is. Now I use they. 

 

Perhaps he used "he" because he is a man by sex and gender.

 

And wow, I wonder if the guy would berate us for not discussing his topic. I wonder if he's aware at how overused it was to complain about the new system.

 

P.S. Sex is biological, gender is psychological. "the more you know..."

Community Guru
Ramon B Member Since: Jan 11, 2015
25 of 34

Wow, even by my standards, that's a lot of deletion! Wonder what we were supposed to have done wrong this time?

Community Guru
Robert James R Member Since: Apr 17, 2015
26 of 34

I believe we went offtopic. We got carried away.

Community Guru
Stephen B Member Since: Dec 4, 2012
27 of 34

A quick two cents from me. Google it and you'll get lots of discussion. as someone who faces this kind of stuff very often, it's a pain. There are badsically four options:

 

a) choose a gender and stick to it - not good for the main reason laid out above.

 

b) alternate between male and female - Ok now and then but with any density is quite distracting. tends to be seen in fluffy wuffy right-on stuff.

 

c) He/she, or s/he, or "he or she". Again if it's only once or twice, maybe Ok - except then you come across his/her as well, and it just gets messy

 

which leaves...

 

The dreaded "singular they"

 

A quick look at Wiki nails it really:

 

"Some people object to the use of plural pronouns in this type of situation on the grounds that it’s ungrammatical. In fact, the use of plural pronouns to refer back to a singular subject isn’t new: it represents a revival of a practice dating from the 16th century. It’s increasingly common in current English and is now widely accepted both in speech and in writing."

 

I tend to agree. It often sounds ugly, but it's the best of a bad lot, and I don't consider it ungrammatical - just counter-intuitive. So, I suggest playing around with word order/sentence construction  to avoid any of the first three - but if there's really no way round it, then the singular they will do just fine.

 

I wish I'd seen the start of this, and what all the reported deletion is about. I also wonder why something should get moved to the coffee break because it's strayed off-topic? Is the subject too uncomfortable for someone?

 

A suggestion - maybe it could be brought up on the top-rated forum, and top-rated editors could discuss it in depth.....

 

or maybe it's a bit too serious for that. Best keep out of the way in coffee break, eh?

Community Guru
David G Member Since: Oct 6, 2011
28 of 34

Actually, the singular they is well on its way to becoming standard English and in fact, a number of sources now claim that it is standard.

 

For example, Merriam Webster states: The use of they, their, them, and themselves as pronouns of indefinite gender and indefinite number is well established in speech and writing, even in literary and formal contexts. This gives you the option of using the plural pronouns where you think they sound best, and of using the singular pronouns (as he, she, he or she, and their inflected forms) where you think they sound best.

 

Oxford English Dictionary also recognizes that singular they is now standard.

 

  • You can use the plural pronouns ‘they’, ‘them’, ‘their’ etc., despite the fact that, technically, they are referring back to a singular noun:

If your child is thinking about a gap year, they can get good advice from this website.

A researcher has to be completely objective in their findings.

 

Some people object to the use of plural pronouns in this type of situation on the grounds that it’s ungrammatical. In fact, the use of plural pronouns to refer back to a singular subject isn’t new: it represents a revival of a practice dating from the 16th century. It’s increasingly common in current English and is now widely accepted both in speech and in writing.

 

 

 

Community Guru
Robert James R Member Since: Apr 17, 2015
29 of 34

tl;dr version: No deletions happened. All posts were just transferred here.

 

LOL no. Actually, the OP posted a complaint on the Freelancers section. It was unnoticed (perhaps due to the nature of it being the same as every other complaint) but then Ramon mentioned something about use of gender-specific pronouns which eventually lead to users discussing that one topic which was way, way off the thread's original intent.

 

So Valeria transferred all posts about the topic here in CB. It just so happened that every post after the OP was OT so yeah, that's why we're all here.

 

 

Community Guru
Ramon B Member Since: Jan 11, 2015
30 of 34

The most obvious way of avoiding this problem is, well, avoiding it in the first place. Since my degree subjects only used concrete, rather than hypothetical, examples,  I avoided it completely without even knowing.  

 

P.S I think there were some cultural/religious reasons why the fairly innocuous subject-matter was consigned to the dungeon. The poster appeared to take genuine offense to it all, particularly my remark about sex changes. However, since it was the standard, wall of text:

 

'Why the Upworks treats honnest frelancer and steal his wagges, if the Upworks treat him so baddly he will find new plattfom and takes his...'

 

...that nobody bothers to comment on now, I thought nobody would mind if it was used to discuss something less derivative.

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