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emilyanncr
Community Member

20% for the first $500 on EACH new client? Seriously? Wow. Disgraceful

When I signed up I thought UpWork charged 20% for the first $500 I made on the site and 10% on the money I made after that.  I thought that was even steep.  I had no idea it was PER client!  Unbelievable.  Have you no shame?  How do you even justify that?  And then you have the audacity to CHARGE for extra connects.  Speechless.  Deleting my profile.  You've lost an amazing talent with your grotesque greed.   Hope you go bankrupt- although that's impossible considering you're making more $ than all the freelancers on here combined times 1000 Fellow freelancers: we deserve way better than this.  Find somewhere else to go, these pple don't deserve a dime from us when it's so blatant they don't value us or our hard work!!!

15 REPLIES 15
hardorff
Community Member

Don't use Upwork then. Find your own clients. It's simple as that.

abinadab-agbo
Community Member

Hey!
I understand your outrage.
However, Upwork has asssured us we'll make a killing when you leave.

I think I believe them, in fact it's already started showing in my job feed.
Also, most freelancers reckon that in total the Upwork fees average at way less than 15% (maybe 12.5%) when they've gotten several clients.
Goodluck with spending just that for overheads bringing in business the traditional way.


It starts at 10% if client is an Enterprise client or it’s a featured job and the freelancer is Top Rated or Rising Talent like you, Emily. Robot Very Happy

__________________________________________________
"No good deed goes unpunished." -- Clare Boothe Luce
lysis10
Community Member

She's a ray of sunshine on a cloudy day.

 

I'm debating if I should let her know about the 5% but she said she's leaving so I'm sure she'll stick to her decision and never be back.

yitwail
Community Member


Jennifer M wrote:

 

I'm debating if I should let her know about the 5% but she said she's leaving so I'm sure she'll stick to her decision and never be back.


Nice thing about Upwork is, you ever change your mind about closing an account, they seem to reinstate it instantly. Robot wink

__________________________________________________
"No good deed goes unpunished." -- Clare Boothe Luce
tlsanders
Community Member


Emily C wrote:

When I signed up I thought UpWork charged 20% for the first $500 I made on the site and 10% on the money I made after that. 

That wouldn't make any sense at all for Upwork, since Upwork spends most of its time and money recruiting new clients. And, of course, each new gig present potential issues and use of resources that ongoing relationships don't. Upwork charges less for the relationships that cost it less. Makes perfect sense.

 

I thought that was even steep.  I had no idea it was PER client!  Unbelievable.  Have you no shame?  How do you even justify that? 

The justification is fairly obvious, but irrelevant. As with anything else that is offered for sale, the seller needn't justify the price. You make the decision as to whether it's worth the price to you or not and buy or don't accordingly.

 

And then you have the audacity to CHARGE for extra connects.  Speechless.  Deleting my profile. 

A lot of us believe that one key reason Upwork is charging for connects is to get rid of a lot of freelancers. Looks like it's working.

You've lost an amazing talent with your grotesque greed.   Hope you go bankrupt- although that's impossible considering you're making more $ than all the freelancers on here combined times 1000

 

Actually, working freelancers make a profit and Upwork never has, so I guess every one of us is making more money than the company is (though it's obviously generating more revenues)

 

Fellow freelancers: we deserve way better than this.  Find somewhere else to go, these pple don't deserve a dime from us when it's so blatant they don't value us or our hard work!!!


I'm confused about why you would expect a platform to value your work, or to care whether it did. My computer doesn't value my work, but it's still a useful tool that helps me make money. Ditto my payment processor, my Facebook page, and Upwork.

Most of us are in freelancing to make money, and so the analysis for us is "is it more profitable to use Upwork or not?" If it is, it makes sense to use it. If not, it doesn't. 

gilbert-phyllis
Community Member

You obviously didn't pay very close attention to what you were getting into. No wonder you're riled up. Given how you feel, you should up stakes as fast as you can.

 

Me, I'm not going anywhere. I've made lotsa money here working with clients I would never, in a million years, have connected with on my own. I don't mind the 20% fee one bit, even on smaller one-off projects, because those have helped me build a strong track record and attract longer term, bigger ticket clients. It's pretty sweet when you hit the 5% threshold with a client who keeps spending.

 

joansands
Community Member

Greed? How come Upwork is actually losing money instead of making it?

michael_skaggs
Community Member


Emily C wrote:

When I signed up I thought UpWork charged 20% for the first $500 I made on the site and 10% on the money I made after that.  I thought that was even steep.  I had no idea it was PER client!  Unbelievable.  


If that's the impression you got, you clearly failed to read the Terms of Service, as well as the easily available information that spells out in very clear terms how the fee structure works. It's been that way for quite a while, and you seem to have only joined recently, so it's not like you were used to a previous fee structure.

 


Have you no shame?  How do you even justify that?

It's clearly spelled out, and it's your choice whether to accept the terms or to look elswhere. And knowing the way the fee structure works, most people simply include that calculation into their pricing.

 


And then you have the audacity to CHARGE for extra connects.  Speechless.  

I'm not the biggest fan of the new connects policy, but I do at least see the rationale behind it. I'm waiting to see how everything pans out before deciding if I need a torch and pitchfork, though. And you can always simplify things by purchasing them with an existing account balance.

 


Deleting my profile.  

I hope you're not expecting a pat on the back, a "way to go" or to have people beg you to stay.

 


You've lost an amazing talent with your grotesque greed.   

It's been my experience that those who speak the loudest and boldest about their talents are compensating for a lack thereof. You may be the most amazing cybersecurity guru known to man, but your profile shows only two jobs (that appear to be below your listed hourly rate) and little else that's easily verifiable.

 

Not to be rude, but having done time in the retail trenches in a previous life, I've become accustomed to the fact that people who loudly proclaim to be leaving and never coming back either don't leave, or if they do, are the kind that won't be missed.

 


Hope you go bankrupt- although that's impossible considering you're making more $ than all the freelancers on here combined times 1000 

Are you privy to all of Upwork's financials? Do you know this figure to be certain? I'm definitely one to be critical of Upwork at times, but at the end of the day they have a business to run, overhead to pay, lights to keep on, servers to maintain, lawyers to retain, etc. While I often question some of their decisions, they're not running a charity. And I don't think they're in any danger of going bankrupt any time soon.

 


Fellow freelancers: we deserve way better than this.  Find somewhere else to go, these pple don't deserve a dime from us when it's so blatant they don't value us or our hard work!!!

You also previously claimed that Upwork should either force clients to hire someone if they merely post a job, or for Upwork to provide notification when/if a proposal is looked at. That doesn't happen when applying for a "regular" job, why would it happen here? Upwork is a tool, and you only get out of it what you put into it as far as effort goes.

 

In the end, making dramatic, grandiose statements isn't going to earn you many allies or cause a major company to make changes to suit your whims. Freelancing is a business, and a business doesn't run on entitlement and what someone feels they "deserve." The only thing any of us are entitled to is the compensation we earn, according to the terms of the contracts we agree to. Nothing more, nothing less. That's both the curse and the freedom in making a living in this manner.

 

If you want to continue to be mired in making demands and being dramatic, rather than delivering results that speak for themselves, then perhaps being a freelancer isn't for you just yet.

Upwork went public last fall (Oct 2018) and is a publicly traded stock. As such, their financials are also public. Upwork has yet to make a profit. It is my hope that Upwork will become profitable as that will be a benefit to all of us -  if they manage to stay in business.

So long as all obligations are met (overhead, salary, various expenses, etc.) are met, a company can remain in business indefinitely without turning a profit, as that's just what's left over after you subtract expenses from revenue.

 

Going public can definitely harm a company, however, because then making a profit is required. And, as is sadly the case anymore, investors increasingly demand that profits go up every quarter, rather than look at long-term viability. They want short-term gain at the expense of possibly higher future earnings. This can lead a business to cut corners in order to satisfy those demands, and that's where things get really dicey and cause a lot of companies to fail after their IPO.

Upwork has actually been losing money.

I hate the 20% fee. Because of the kind of job I do, I barely have projects that reach the first 500 USD. It is awful, I hate it.

 

There was a 10% fee when I start on Upwork 4 years ago, and I don't understand why they raise it to 20% beyond the reason of making more money. I mean... this 20% fee is quite recent, in order to "stimulate getting larger contracts" Why not raise that fee on clients, then? they are the ones who contract us anyway. "Client: more benefits if you hire freelancers for larger projects of 500 USD and up". You would say: yes, the enterprise clients! But guess what? you can't reach the 5% fee with them, it is 10% always. To me, it seems Upwork calculated pretty well to get always the best money on any transaction.

 

Sorry guys, I agree with her, I just keep using Upwork because is better than being jobless.


Valentina D wrote:

I hate the 20% fee. Because of the kind of job I do, I barely have projects that reach the first 500 USD. It is awful, I hate it.

 

There was a 10% fee when I start on Upwork 4 years ago, and I don't understand why they raise it to 20% beyond the reason of making more money. I mean... this 20% fee is quite recent, in order to "stimulate getting larger contracts" Why not raise that fee on clients, then? they are the ones who contract us anyway. "Client: more benefits if you hire freelancers for larger projects of 500 USD and up". You would say: yes, the enterprise clients! But guess what? you can't reach the 5% fee with them, it is 10% always. To me, it seems Upwork calculated pretty well to get always the best money on any transaction.

 

Sorry guys, I agree with her, I just keep using Upwork because is better than being jobless.


I find it hard to square your having been here four years with somehow still thinking of the 20% fee on smaller contracts as "quite recent." As explained at the time, it was not so much about making more money as about losing less: smaller jobs are more expensive for Upwork. The higher fee was instituted as a stop-loss measure long before Upwork officially announced deemphasizing smaller jobs and (re)emphasizing Enterprise clients.

You are of course correct that if our niche attracts smaller contracts, we are pinched more by the temporary 20% commission. If we cannot find and work our way into larger contracts (or even if we can), it may be helpful to think of the extra (maximum) $50 on each contract as a finder's fee. Certainly if we can find comparable work on our own without that upfront marketing expenditure, and without our general overhead being higher than 10%, that would be the sensible thing to do.


Valentina D wrote:

Why not raise that fee on clients, then? they are the ones who contract us anyway.


If you think that your clients would pay more, then why not just charge more yourself? If you put your fee at $100 and Upwork charges the client 10%, then the client pays $110. Just charge $110 up front. It would make no difference to the client whether Upwork is charging them or whether you're charging them. 

 


Valentina D wrote:

Sorry guys, I agree with her, I just keep using Upwork because is better than being jobless.


It's a shame that you think these are your only options. There's nothing stopping you from doing your own marketing and advertising to find clients off of the platform. I do this myself but it does take time, so if time is money, then I'm still paying at least a 20% fee, in a sense.

 

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