Cheater Clients: Manual Hours Scam

ankur0007 · ‎06-26-2022

Hi Team,

A very different kind of scams I am seeing these days on Upwork with manual hours contract.

If you are working with adding manual hours, Be aware!! And do not provide feedback to the client until you get the payment available for the same contract.

It will be until next Friday when you see if the hours got processed and client got charged or not.
A few cheaters scam using their cards with no amount in their account and at the time of manual hours payment, the card get declined and poor freelance can't even do anything as manual hours do not come under Upwork payment protection.

I faced this situation twice but because of manual hours contract, I couldn't do anything as Upwork doesn't support Manual Hours Payment Protection.

Even the second client I faced has a very good profile and still working with Upwork and keep cheating others.

Happy Freelancing, Safe Freelancing!

Ankur V.
WP Expert Full Time on Upwork

759e32fa · ‎06-26-2022

Hi Ankur,

While there is no means of knowing ahead of time whether or not a client's payment will be successful, ultimately that should not be a concern for you as a freelancer as long as you are protecting yourself. By reviewing the Hourly Protection for Freelancers guidelines, you can ensure that you are paid appropriately even when a client's payment fails. Time logged appropriately via ~~the Work Diary~~ Time Tracking will qualify for payment protection from Upwork. Unfortunately the hours in question were logged manually rather than via the ~~Work Diary~~ Time Tracking, and they do not qualify for payment protection.

I hope this information helps better your future experiences on the Upwork platform.

~ AJ

renata101 · ‎06-26-2022

Ankur,

~~This is not a scam.~~ Hours logged using the time tracker will be invoiced automatically. Hours logged manually need to be approved by the client. If you are logging manual hours, it is a good idea to alert the client that you are adding them.

Added: Sorry, Ankur, I think I'm misunderstanding the issue. As far as I'm aware, there is no such thing as a "manual hours-only contract." If a client is enouraging you believe this and to log only manual hours, it's probably a bad sign.

pgiambalvo · ‎06-26-2022

I think what he's saying, and what we're seeing more of here, is that this is a scam intended not to steal money from freelancers, but to get free work from them. They know that Upwork does not verify their identities or their ability to pay. Using manual hours gives them more lag time before their card will be rejected than using fixed priced contracts. And so what if they approve the manual hours? They will still get the work and know they will not have to pay for it. And as for the moderator's response, "While there is no means of knowing ahead of time whether or not a client's payment will be successful, ultimately that should not be a concern for you as a freelancer as long as you are protecting yourself." There is no bigger concern than knowing we are going to get paid. And we can't protect ourselves without using the time tracker. Using the time tracker is just not an option for many freelancers and for the type of work we do. Upwork needs to figure out a way verify clients in the same way they do freelancers, and also their ability to pay, WITHOUT that leading to raising our fees.

ankur0007 · ‎06-26-2022

Hi Peter,

You got my point. Thanks for your response. Yes, these days, verifying a profile as a freelancer is more complex than ever before, and this I heard from many newbies where on another side, no payment verified clients are adding a bunch of jobs from a long time without even hiring anyone? They treat as friends first and allow us to put in manual hours and get free work with scams?

If manual hours is vulnerable, why is there an option? Do you think it can be possible if Upwork also charges manual hours every hour from clients same as time tracking hours? And put the money in escrow until the client approves the work?

Freelancers like me are working with Upwork since it was named "Elance".

So, for anyone who is reliable and working with Upwork for a long time, there should be at least a process of checking the card or account of the client before providing the completed work or at least notify the freelancer that this client's card found suspicious next Monday if any way to detect.

If we are protecting clients from fraud freelancers then why not protect freelancers as well? Or, why keep opening a vulnerable option if we see many scams using it?

I love to work with Upwork and looking forward.

Best Regards

Ankur V.

prestonhunter · ‎06-26-2022

There is no such thing as a "manual hours only" contract.

It is possibe for a client to set up a contract so that manually-logged time is NOT allowed. This is a "time-tracker-only contract." That can be done.

But a client can not set up the contract to prevent a freelancer from logging time using the time-tracker. If a client tells a freelncer to NOT use the time-tracker, that is very suspicious.

Technically, there is no such thing as "approving hours" on an hourly contract.

Hours logged cause the freelancer to be AUTOMATICALLY paid.

But it is possible for a client to dispute hours and - if those hours were manually logged - Upwork will remove those hours from the time that a freelancer gets paid for.

So there is not really any way for a client to "approve hours."

But is possible for client to "un-approve" or "disapprove" hours.

ankur0007 · ‎06-26-2022

Hi Preston,

Thanks for your response. I understand the time tracker hourly contracts and fixed-priced contracts both are safe. But there is a third option that is there and being misused. The main concern is if there is a manual time-allowed option available, what is the point of using it and can we protect this method if someone would like to use it?

Otherwise, newbies will constantly get scammed with this as they would not be aware of how it works actually? Also, any type of client can do this as they only need to decline the manual hours, and they will have work, and there is nothing we can do.

Best Regards

Ankur V.

prestonhunter · ‎06-26-2022

re: "I understand the time tracker hourly contracts and fixed-priced contracts both are safe."

That is an interesting comment.

That is not something that I would say.

I think it is more accurate to say that ALL contract types are "safe," but it is also true (and more useful) to point out that ALL contract types are NOT SAFE.

There are potential pitfalls inherent in all contract types.

If a freelancer doesn't understand how the contract models work, the freelancer is likely to run into problems.

Having said all that:

I regard hourly contracts (using the desktop time-tracker and following the rules for Upwork Payment Protection) as VERY SAFE.

And I regard fixed-price contracts as NOT at all as safe as hourly contracts using the desktop time-tracker.

I believe that fixed-price contract are relatively RISKY for freelancers. They represent an "expert level" contract type, and beginning freelancers SHOULD NOT USE fixed-price contracts at all until they have carefully studied how they work and developed some personal strategies for using them effectively.