Mar 1, 2022 12:17:17 PM Edited Mar 1, 2022 12:41:02 PM by Luiggi R
So I proposed to a simple job: to design an icon for a client. However, the client asks me to do this for free, as the company is non-profit.
As of now, I am new to freelancing on Upwork. This means that I am more on the look for good reviews than money. I would have no problem helping this client out, as long as we can co-operate properly. The client did make a few mistakes in typing, which makes me unsure if we should work together.
Does anyone have advice for me? Should I take this opportunity if I like it, or perhaps report them right away? Thank you for your help, have a nice day!
**Edited for Community Guidelines**
Solved! Go to Solution.
Mar 1, 2022 12:24:31 PM by Amanda L
No, you should not do this for free. First of all, if you don't get paid you don't get a review. 2nd, it's a violation of TOS for them to ask you to do it for free. 3rd, I have worked in the nonprofit sector for more than 20 years, nonprofit does not mean you should not be paid. People, especially employers/clients, like to try and play that tune, but it's false. If they can't pay you then you can't do the work.
Doing pro-bono work is to be lauded, when it's something you care about and volunteer for, not when you apply to a job and they disrespectfully ask you to do it for free. This is a job/gig board, not a volunteering board. If they need to find volunteers, there are other places to post volunteer jobs.
I would suggest letting the client know that no, you cannot do it for free, and also let them know asking for free work is a violation of Upwork's TOS. If they continue to bother you in this way, I would report them.
Mar 1, 2022 12:24:31 PM by Amanda L
No, you should not do this for free. First of all, if you don't get paid you don't get a review. 2nd, it's a violation of TOS for them to ask you to do it for free. 3rd, I have worked in the nonprofit sector for more than 20 years, nonprofit does not mean you should not be paid. People, especially employers/clients, like to try and play that tune, but it's false. If they can't pay you then you can't do the work.
Doing pro-bono work is to be lauded, when it's something you care about and volunteer for, not when you apply to a job and they disrespectfully ask you to do it for free. This is a job/gig board, not a volunteering board. If they need to find volunteers, there are other places to post volunteer jobs.
I would suggest letting the client know that no, you cannot do it for free, and also let them know asking for free work is a violation of Upwork's TOS. If they continue to bother you in this way, I would report them.
Mar 1, 2022 03:45:12 PM Edited Mar 1, 2022 03:47:01 PM by Jeremiah B
Alot of times people will ask you to perform work for free or "as a sample". Frequently, they will state something like "we are looking at numerous candidates and this will help us decide" or something similar. Sometimes this is a scam, sometimes its a harmless request. For example, with a scam, clients will ask a number of clients to all perform a certain portion of free sample work, assigning each "candidate" to a different section of the project. In the end, when all of the projects are complete, they client will collect each sample, combine them, and not hire anyone since they have a free, completed project.
I do understand where you are coming from however. Sometimes the value of a few good reviews is worth much more than the monetary value of your time. If this is the case, perform as much work as you are comfortable losing. Hopefully the client will leave you a good review - which is not gaurunteed and not covered under any sort of protection. Its a huge gamble, and you may lose out big time, but again I understand where you are coming from. Theres a disproportionate amount of freelancers to clients on this site and the sooner you can stand out, the better. Good luck and read the thread about scammers.
Edit: evidently free work is against ToS, which I did not know. Instead, charge a minimal fee if you feel the need in order to start building your reputation and portfolio.
Mar 1, 2022 04:10:18 PM by Eric H
Indeed, the market is saturated with desperate freelancers.
It sucks, but since the market is so fragmented and competitive I'm sure the clients get a good deal. At least that's what I tell myself lol.
Being serious though, I would recommend watching kamicash's videos on the "freeloading challenge" where he manages to make hundreds of dollars through nothing but free internet resources that require no amount of background.
Really motivates me to not take the market for advantage and to appreciate the massive gains we're making! Just gotta be patient, smart, and viciously opportunistic like animals!
Mar 1, 2022 05:12:24 PM Edited Mar 1, 2022 05:14:18 PM by Jeremiah B
One of the things I have noticed about freelancing is that there is a huge number of writers. That said, you are going to have a higher concentration of competition for obvious reasons. On this site you really can't take any job posting for granted, thats why its important to write a good proposal and not waste your time doing sample or free work. Personally, I have been tricked into "sample" work, but, I also slapped a "copyright" watermark right through the middle. In a recent instance, I offered to provide a sample for a client for a minimum 1 hour fee. The client was fishing for free source files and becuase I anticipated this may happen, I submitted images of the sample instead. I still got burned, but I did get paid.
As with anything in life, if it seems to good to be true, it probably is. Make sure you properly vet your clients as best you can.
As far as clients getting a good deal - they get a great deal. Upwork, as with any oversaturated market, is nothing but a race to the bottom. Unfortunately for freelancers this race to the bottom is caused by people doing poor quality work for cheap. The clients who look for price over quality drive this market hard - but, in all fairness, they get burned too. I have had plenty of prospective clients come back to hire and tell me their low price freelancer messed everything up. You just treat them as if they never told you, charge for your time, and provide them a reason to come back.
Mar 2, 2022 01:41:31 AM by Christine A
Eric H wrote:Really motivates me to not take the market for advantage and to appreciate the massive gains we're making! Just gotta be patient, smart, and viciously opportunistic like animals!
OR look for good clients, do your best work for them and provide excellent customer service, and you'll be fine.
Mar 1, 2022 06:09:32 PM by Amanda L
I don't think you understand. No pay = no review. So doing free work doesn't help get reviews. Also offering free work isn't against TOS, it's against TOS for the client to ASK for it, which happened in this case.
Mar 1, 2022 03:58:57 PM by Eric H
They're either trying to scam you or manipulate you into free work. And Non-Profits still pay their employees (the managers make quite a lot actually) so this arguement doesn't stand to reason.
And as a newer freelancer (I'm almost as new as you are and this helped me) I would recommend you read through upworks scam prevention services (and really a lot of their free advice) and take their test. It might seem like a pain in the butt at first, but it beats the feeling of wearing a dunce cap as a client laughs their way to the bank with either free work or your private details.
In regards to a freelancer working pro bono, that never really works at least long term. It's okay to take jobs that pay not so good, but you aren't an intern you're a freelancer. People don't respect you when you give them free stuff all the time. You'll just become the freelancer with cheap work. At least according to what other people have told me.
In general though I would recommend against desperation. You aren't starving (hopefully, if so there's resources to help you) so you can afford to reject clients and therefore pursue better options.
In conclusion desperation is a negative feed back loop and you're worth more than getting scammed. Hope you have a good one. 🙂
Mar 2, 2022 03:03:26 AM Edited Mar 2, 2022 03:53:42 AM by Goran V
This handy infographic should tell you everything you need to know. I recommend committing this particular part to memory: "Just because a business isn't profitable, that doesn't make them a non-profit."
**Edited for Community Guidelines**
Mar 2, 2022 04:16:31 AM by Christine A
I have no idea why my link was deleted - it was a link to an infographic about working for free, not trying to sell anything and as far as I know, didn't violate any community guidelines. Can someone please enlighten me?
Mar 2, 2022 03:44:05 AM by Nichola L
And talking of infographics - where's Petra's handy infographic?
Mar 2, 2022 04:26:44 AM by Deborah P
If I was in your place, I would remove any rush to get a job quickly from the table, focus on serious clients and stick to my boundaries. You will see plenty of those "non-profit" or other charitable / ideals-based excuses utilised by unprofessional and manipulative job posters. I even got enquiries to work for peanuts based on a "women's-only mutual support" argument. Don't mess with the desperate and lower-end crowd. Let someone else be scammed and underpaid if they wish to do so. Just move on, spend your time on fine-tuning your value proposition and a good portfolio and emerging from the crowd. Over time, you will develop a nice portfolio of valuable clients and fair earnings. My two cents.
Mar 2, 2022 05:29:09 AM by Preston H
It is silly for a non-profit to come to Upwork and ask a freelancer to work for free.
You should charge them double.
This will help to ensure that they do not make a profit.