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fda70b38
Community Member

Client cancel the order after 4 days delivered.

Hello Guys.

 

One of my clients and I came to an agreement on a fixed price project on Sunday (+5.30 GMT) morning and I delivered the project that day evening.

 

Before we started the project, I submitted a sample edit and he was very happy and very excited about my edit and so eager to go with a fixed price project. 

 

So as usual I finished the project with my best effort and followed the same methods to get similar results to other materials as well. and I delivered it in a google drive folder. because it is more than 25MBs. 

 

All suddenly today (Thursday), the client canceled the order by saying he is not happy with the results. 

 

I worked on it sooo hard and now I have to refund the money because he is not impressed anymore. 

 

I am so frustrated, if I give a refund it will affect my JSS and my account will affect by it. 

 

Is there anything to do about this matter?  I only followed the same process to all the materials. which he was super excited about in the beginning.

 

Please help me. ๐Ÿ˜•

 

-Dil

ACCEPTED SOLUTION
petra_r
Community Member


Dilhara P wrote:

the escrow amount is less than $50. so, I decided to stop with meditate step. because I don't wanna pay an extra $291 for that. 


Leave the mediation running, you may get some money out of it or the client may give in. Just don't proceed to arbitration at the end. It's worth a try.

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18 REPLIES 18
tagrendy
Community Member

Refunds don't effect JSS, but feedbacks do. If he already closed the project, he has already left the feedback. If you received the order from project catalog, you can request Upwork to remove 1 feedback per month. Whether you should agree to refund or not is up to you, but it won't have any effect on your JSS. I personally wouldn't.

Hi..

 

Thank you very much for your reply, dear. I attached a screenshot, can you tell me whether he gave me feedback or not? 

Unfortunately, Upwork has a 'policy' of not letting you SEE a client's feedback until YOU leave feedback or after 14 days after the contract ends. 

 

https://support.upwork.com/hc/en-us/articles/211062188-Leave-Feedback-on-a-Contract

 

This means you might not know if they left feedback for 14 days. 

 

Personally, I would DECLINE the request for the Refund and go ahead and contact Upwork Support to get in front of the possible 'bad feedback', especially if you have proof in the chat or other places that the client was happy with the samples and the work you submitted met the REQUIREMENTS he stated in the contract.

 

Example:

A client issues a requirement "Please draw me a picture of Cat".

You draw a "Cat" and send it to the client.

The client then says "This is not correct. I wanted a Brown Cat with Blue Eyes. I want a refund."

 

Nope! No good! If he didn't SAY the Cat had to be Brown with Blue Eyes in the requirements he issued, he is not ENTITLED to that.  He is entitled to exactly what he requested when he issued the contract: A picture of a Cat.  Nothing more.

 

I wouldn't refund him a DIME and would DISPUTE it with Upwork who can try to force him to EXPLAIN how the work you submitted does not meet the REQUIREMENTS he issued.   "Requirements" does not mean a client asking a freelancer for a one thing and then deciding they really "wanted" something "different" after the work is delivered.   A client can't just change requirements and expectations after the work is delivered and just keep "moving the goal post".

 

Thank you very much Cj A.

 

As you suggested, I filed a dispute case and the client declined it. 

 

Yes, exactly that's what happened in the contract. I just did what he asked and that's it. yes, I have all the chats as screenshots, in case he deleted them from the chatbox.

 

let's see how it goes. thank you very much for being with me. I really appreciate it. Now I feel safe on this platform because of you guys'  guidance.

 


CJ A wrote:

... contact Upwork Support to get in front of the possible 'bad feedback


She isn't top rated so can't remove any feedback.

fda70b38
Community Member

If this dispute is solved for my side, will upwork remove that negative feedback? because I did all he asked from me and nothing else. Gave very similar results. he didn't even ask for a revision. he just canceled the project. 

petra_r
Community Member


Dilhara P wrote:

If this dispute is solved for my side, 


The dispute won't be decided by Upwork. The dispute mediator can only try and mediate. They will not make a binding decision. To get a binding decision (if the mediation fails to get you and the client to agree on a mutually acceptable solution) you would have to go to arbitration. Arbitration costs each party $ 291, which, if arbitration goes ahead, is non-refundable.

 

How much money is in escrow?

 


Dilhara P wrote: will upwork remove that negative feedback?

No, they will not.

But if ultimately nothing is paid, nothing will show on your profile anyway. The contract outcome (private feedback) will, however, still count towards your metrics.

Yes, he gave you feedback. When client closes contract, he has to give feedback first. Private feedback he gave you is what will effect your JSS, and you can never know what his private feedback was. So the decision whether you should request removal of feedback or not is based on your expectation of what the feedback was. I do think it's likely he left negative feedback worth removing. You can see what public feedback he left after you leave feedback for him too.

petra_r
Community Member


Tatevik G wrote:

 You can see what public feedback he left after you leave feedback for him too.


No, she can't because none can have been left when a client cancels without payment, only private feedback is left in that case at that stage.

 


Tatevik G wrote: So the decision whether you should request removal of feedback or not is based on your expectation of what the feedback was. I do think it's likely he left negative feedback worth removing.

She can't remove the feedback. She's not top-rated.

fda70b38
Community Member

Yes! it's my 5th week of 16 weeks. ๐Ÿ˜ญ I can wait for another couple of months for my JSS to pass the 90%. but I am really afraid that this cancelation's effect to my new clients. Normally I get around 10-20 new invitations per day. I am afraid that this cancelation and negative feedback will cause to sink my profile to the bottom. ๐Ÿ˜ข

 

If somehow, the final decision is favorable for my side, will upwork remove the feedback including his Pvt feedback because of all faults from his side?

tagrendy
Community Member

If she received the order via project catalog, I believe she can remove one per month without top rated status.

Thank you very much for your guidance. i really appreciate it. that client declined the dispute and now I am waiting for the Upwork dispute team's decision. I strongly believe that they will make a fair judgment after reviewing the case and checking the inbox of that client's chat. 

petra_r
Community Member


Dilhara P wrote:

I am waiting for the Upwork dispute team's decision. I strongly believe that they will make a fair judgment 


How much money is actually in escrow? 

 


Dilhara P wrote:

Normally I get around 10-20 new invitations per day.


What do you mean? You've had 307 invites in the last 90 days which is between 3 and 4 a day. Still a LOT, but nowhere near 10 to 20!

 


Dilhara P wrote:

I am afraid that this cancelation and negative feedback will cause to sink my profile to the bottom


The cancellation as such has no effect on anything. The private feedback does, but with as many completed contracts as you have, it won't be a catastrophic impact. It certainly won't cause your profile to "sink to the bottom".

 


Dilhara P wrote:

will upwork remove the feedback including his Pvt feedback


No, they won't.

 

 

fda70b38
Community Member

Thank you very much for the clarifications.

 

I just wanted to say per week. not per day. I was mistaken. beg your pardon for that. 

 

the escrow amount is less than $50. so, I decided to stop with meditate step. because I don't wanna pay an extra $291 for that. 

 

This is my first time in this kind of situation. All my 100+ clients were super genuine. 

 

Thanks again! really appreciate your help. 

petra_r
Community Member


Dilhara P wrote:

the escrow amount is less than $50. so, I decided to stop with meditate step. because I don't wanna pay an extra $291 for that. 


Leave the mediation running, you may get some money out of it or the client may give in. Just don't proceed to arbitration at the end. It's worth a try.

fda70b38
Community Member

Thank you very much, Petra. I will do as you said. ๐Ÿ˜Š๐Ÿ˜Š

ericaandrews
Community Member

I wouldn't refund him because it sounds like he's trying to get work for free.  Meaning, he's actually happy with it but doesn't want to PAY.  He was happy with the samples you sent, so if he didn't like the final work you submitted, he could have sent it back to you to ask for REVISIONS / changes and let you re-submit a new work deliverable.  The fact that he didn't do that suggests he probably LIKES the work  as-is but had no intention of actually paying for it.  Suddenly screaming "I don't like it, I want a refund" after raving about the samples you sent sounds suspicious to me.  I call it the "constantly unhappy client" scam:  There are some clients that will call all work they receive from anybody "bad" just to get out of paying or to be able to demand a refund, then they'll end up USING this work they called "bad" anyway.  It's a scam to get something for free.   If the work you sent met the written requirements he sent over, then he is owed no refund.  If he truly believes the work doesn't meet the requirements, let him 'dispute' it with Upwork.

Thank you very much, CJ.

 

This is my first experience with this kind of matter. The chatbox has all the evidence that he liked my sample edit in the first place and wants to arrange a contract with me.

 

Yes, dear, I want justice for this. can you please guide me through opening a dispute and how to remove a band review if he posted on my wall. ๐Ÿ˜ญ

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