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dhrobochaya
Member

Client starts disput after giving me 5 star on the contract!!

I have got a very interesting client. Done three hourly based contract (10hrs, 9hrs and 7hrs including some manual time which was added after getting his permission). For every contact he was satisfied with my work and provided 5 star, so do I. Just after finishig 3rd contract suddenly he blocked me and starts dispute for every contract. I was so surprised how a client do the such thing? I almost spent 30hrs and he wants the payment back? it's so frustrating. I reject the dispute, don't know what action upwork will take. I just hope upwork will ban such kind of people.

13 REPLIES 13
petra_r
Member


ABM M wrote:

 I reject the dispute, don't know what action upwork will take. 


They will look at your work diary and refund the client any time that was manual time, had no meaningful memos on the screenshots or low activity levels and / or non project related screenshots.

Hi Petra, Thanks for your response. That memos wasn't meaningful. But in chat he agreed about that manual timing. If upwork wants some proof I can show them. Still upwork refund the manual time to the client? If so can I still continue disputing for that time?

 

Btw the client was kind of forcing me to leave feedback as soon as possible. That means this was his intention from the begining after geeting good review he will start dispute.


ABM M wrote:

Hi Petra, Thanks for your response. That memos wasn't meaningful. But in chat he agreed about that manual timing. If upwork wants some proof I can show them. Still upwork refund the manual time to the client? If so can I still continue disputing for that time?

 

Btw the client was kind of forcing me to leave feedback as soon as possible. That means this was his intention from the begining after geeting good review he will start dispute.


Any manual time that is disputed will be resolved in favour of the client regardless of what you guys agreed to earlier. Manual time is not protected.

The second part seems like a fallacy: the client doesn't need to leave you a 5-star review in order to himself get a 5-star review since the feedback is double blind. It just seems like he changed his mind regarding the quality of the work (or decided to scam you).

He is surely deciding to scam me. The same project we continued in second and third contract. The result of 1st contract was good so he continued hiring me. I was always thinking why he hiring me again and again, why not we do the job in one contract and as a client why he is so worried about feedback (as I know rating amd feedback is very important to freelancer than client).


ABM M wrote:

That memos wasn't meaningful.


Sorry, what? No meaningful memos = refund.

 


ABM M wrote:

But in chat he agreed about that manual timing. If upwork wants some proof I can show them. Still upwork refund the manual time to the client?


It doesn't matter and yes, manual time will be refunded.

 


ABM M wrote:

 If so can I still continue disputing for that time?


No.

 

Any and all time without meaningful memos: will be refunded

Any and all manual time: will be refunded.

Same with low activity level hours and any screenshots showing anyything other than you working on the client's project.

 

 

Learn some lessons. Next time I will be more careful. Thanks for your response again.

Dear Petra,

Which one counting a low-quality activity? Some times we don't need to click the mouse or use the keyboard then how do you calculate it?

Joynul


Joynul A wrote:

 

Which one counting a low-quality activity? Some times we don't need to click the mouse or use the keyboard then how do you calculate it?


Nobody said "low quality"

 

It's "low activity" and defined as more than 2 segments with less than 5 bars per hour. In that case the whole hour goes, not just segments with less than 5 bars.

Hi Petra,

while we don't click an excessive amount of keyboard and mouse, it's will display low activity. My question is sometimes we have a process and we don't need to apply a keyboard or mouse frequently than how it is going to be calculated? Upwork counts keyboard and mouse activities. I have screen record there's an event I clicked mouse events 111 and keyboard activities 61. It's displaying my activity 6. There are many jobs in the Upwork platform they do not need to click too much then how it will likely be calculated? Can you give an explanation for the details, please?

Joynul


Joynul A wrote:

Can you give an explanation for the details, please?


I am not sure what there is to explain. It's not just clicking, it is also keyboard activity.

 

Look at your work diary. There are green bars at the bottom. Every green square is a minute during which there was activity.

If there are low activity levels (more than 2 10 minute segments with less than 5 little green squares in it per hour) then that hour is considered "low activity"

 

Upwork does not "calculate" activity that does not show in your work diary.

 


Joynul A wrote:

I have screen record there's an event I clicked mouse events 111 and keyboard activities 61. It's displaying my activity 6. 


That means that during that 10 minute segment, there were 4 full (entire) minutes with no tracked / trackable activity.

wlyonsatl
Member

At any rate, ABM, for time tracked by TimeTracker and judged by Upwork as valid, you should not issue a refund. You did the work and the client re-hired you twice - not exactly actions that tell me the client was not satisfied with the quality of your work.

 

Some clients know how to game the Upwork time-tracking system, which is not super accurate anyway. Manual time, even if "approved" by a client, is one of the areas most conducive to unfair client refusal to pay for work performed, so don't use it unless you absolutely have to AND you know and trust the client. (Yes, before anyone complains, there are valid uses of manual time. They are just less common than manual time's actual use by unsuspecting freelancers, judging by the stories we regularly see on this message board.)

 

Even if you are doing something for a client related to an hourly contract that doesn't absolutely require use of your keyboard or mouse, such as a phone call with the client, reading documents related to the project,, etc., take notes using your keyboard. Keep TimeTracker aware of your work for the client.


Will L wrote:

At any rate, ABM, for time tracked by TimeTracker and judged by Upwork as valid, you should not issue a refund. You did the work and the client re-hired you twice - not exactly actions that tell me the client was not satisfied with the quality of your work.

 

Some clients know how to game the Upwork time-tracking system, which is not super accurate anyway. Manual time, even if "approved" by a client, is one of the areas most conducive to unfair client refusal to pay for work performed, so don't use it unless you absolutely have to AND you know and trust the client. (Yes, before anyone complains, there are valid uses of manual time. They are just less common than manual time's actual use by unsuspecting freelancers, judging by the stories we regularly see on this message board.)

 

Even if you are doing something for a client related to an hourly contract that doesn't absolutely require use of your keyboard or mouse, such as a phone call with the client, reading documents related to the project,, etc., take notes using your keyboard. Keep TimeTracker aware of your work for the client.


Agreed, Will. Not all clients are scammers either. I have allowed freelancers I hire to use manual time and they've used it respectfully and there's never been a reason to dispute it. Clients who behave like this and raise disputes are clearly running a scam for free work. Professionals who hire freelancers are, of course, paying attention to budget, but they aren't going to scam someone like this.

I also worked with clients allowed me to add manual time and never get any problem with it. But this client!! He was so thankful to my work and time management, but just after he knew that i give him 5 star in the 3rd contract, he starts dispute for all of 3 contracts. He even blocked me, so i couldn't get chance to ask him anything.