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jhaek19
Community Member

Dispute / Mediation Help

Hi to the community,

 

I would need help and advice on my current case.

 

I have been involved in a dispute with an old Client. I provided work and log is saved in the weekly diary. I only see that under dispute, you can only review the past 30 days after last payment but my Client is asking for more than that. Is that possible?

 

Also, is it true that a Client can control or hold the limitation of a freelancers account? Like in this case, the Client mentioned that they won't lift the limitation unless they are paid full with the total amount of refund they wanted.

 

The Client already admitted their mistake and earlier mentioned to the mediator of "Refund whatever you can, if you can" but now the Client seem to control the situation and wants more than what is allowed under the policies.

 

Ironically, this also happened a week after the contract was closed and Mediator mentioned about the limitation and client wasn't even responding on the thread for almost three weeks. I even agreed for a refund based on this Mediator's review and under the 30-day policy.

 

I was also thinking how can the Client know about the limitation and even take control? Is it allowed for the mediator to metion the limitation on the thread that involves the dispute with client and freelancer? It seems there is a connection with the Mediator and the Client here.

 

Where else can I seek help on this?

Thanks!
Jacob

22 REPLIES 22
jhaek19
Community Member

Also, is there a chance anyone can see the private messages between the Client and Mediator? Might be interesting to find something there. Thank you!

petra_r
Community Member

Was this an hourly contract or a fixed rate one? On an hourly contract, were the hours tracked properly and with the Upwork tracker, and did you have decent activity levels and meaningful memos?

 


Jacob S wrote:

...client wasn't even responding on the thread for almost three weeks


Generally, if one party becomes unresponsive, they are given X days to respond, if they do not, the dispute is closed.


Under a fixed rate contract, the entire contract (everything that was ever paid) becomes disputable, but in an hourly contract that is not the case.

jhaek19
Community Member

Yes, this is an hourly project using the tracker app.

 

The Client responded just when the mediator mentioned on the thread about the limitation.

 

Once they knew about it, they changed things around and even seem to have control over the mediator and mentioned they WILL not lift the limitation of my account, is it possible they can control it?

 

It seems there is a connivance between the Client and Mediator. Though I really don't want to accuse anybody. I just want the rules to be applied.

petra_r
Community Member


Jacob S wrote:

and mentioned they WILL not lift the limitation of my account, is it possible they can control it?


Clients have no control over any limitation on your account, and I am surprised there is a limitation on your account over a simple dispute... There seems to be more to this than meets the eye?

jhaek19
Community Member

Hi Petra,

 

Yes, the Mediator seems to be hiding something between him and the Client, seems to favor the Client as well.

 

The Mediator ended the dispute and even closed the contract after my account was limited and said I would need to contact the Client directly in order to lift the limitation.

 

The Mediator already gave some recommendations for refund, initially based on the last 30 days of payment (which I preferred), a few days later after the Client sent private messages, the Mediator went beyond the 30-day period and went back around three months. I said to give the initial recommendation refund, but then the Client didn't sent any message. 

 

I said the Client wasn't responding on the thread so maybe the Mediator can lift my account limitation since the dispute was already closed and client isn't responding.

 

The Mediator even said he was the one who closed the contract, is that allowed?

 

A few days later, the Mediator said we have to wait for two more business days before he can lift the limitation, then suddenly after weeks that the Client isn't responding, finally sent a message, and now it was demanding more refund and even sounded like the Client had control on the limitation as they said "We will not lift the limitation" unless they get what they demanded which is beyond the policies.

 

Now my account is frozen and I can't work and even can't get my available funds which I badly need this holiday season.

 

Is there someone else that can help get this sorted out? Does my account really have to be limited? I can't continue working with my account limited. This is insane, they should know that we freelancers work to earn for a living, how can we support our family that is needing?

 

Badly need assistance here. I would appreciate any help.

 

Thanks!

Jacob

lysis10
Community Member


Jacob S wrote:

 

 

The Mediator ended the dispute and even closed the contract after my account was limited and said I would need to contact the Client directly in order to lift the limitation.

 


They do this when you ignore a dispute and don't respond. Did you respond to all of their emails within the given time frame?

jhaek19
Community Member

I did reply to the thread, but one was delayed and I explained the reason for it.

 

Also, what is the policy on this, betweem not replying and delayed reply.

 

I think there is also a policy of needing to send two successive messages before your account can be limited? Like serving a final message/notice. I asked this with the Mediator and he is sending me invalid dates like he said the final notice was sent earlier while we were still having conversations in the thread.

jhaek19
Community Member

Hi,

I am seeking for real support here.

It’s been two months and this dispute isn’t resolved yet.

Client failed the “Dispute Period” policy which states: "It is Client’s responsibility to review the Hourly Invoice of every Hourly Contract on a weekly basis..."

We’ve been through mediator and all through that but still the client doesn’t understand the policy.

Under “Dispute Assistance” policy, “Upwork will only review the 30 days of work performed prior to the date a User requests Dispute Assistance.” – So I would allow to refund what the mediator suggested of 14 hours based on his review.

Initially, the client mentioned to the Mediator to refund whatever they can, but the Client would not accept what the Mediator suggested (14 hours) now that they know my account is on hold.

I’ve already contacted the client as the UpWork support tells me to do. Everything has been said but still no definite answer if my account can be restored and I can continue working. Under the policy, it states that "If Client or Freelancer rejects Upwork's proposed, non-binding resolution then Client and/or Freelancer must pursue the Dispute independently" but it seems the favor is with this client as it controls how the limitation of account can be uplifted.

If you would keep my account on hold for this one client that doesn’t understand and follow the policy what would my other clients say about UpWork? I’ve brought several clients here in UpWork to keep the work flow smooth but it seems not in this case. My work is stalled with the result of lost earnings not only for me but also for my clients.

It is a pity that I brought my clients here in UpWork but we can’t continue to work. It is hard to see that my other clients would want to leave UpWork because of one client that doesn’t understand and follow the policy. What is the use of having those policies and going through mediation if it is not implemented correctly?

I would need a definite answer how this can be resolved immediately, what should I do or what can be done here to I know what is the next step so I can inform my clients.

Thank you,

Jacob

lysis10
Community Member


Jacob S wrote:

Hi,

I am seeking for real support here.

It’s been two months and this dispute isn’t resolved yet.

Client failed the “Dispute Period” policy which states: "It is Client’s responsibility to review the Hourly Invoice of every Hourly Contract on a weekly basis..."

We’ve been through mediator and all through that but still the client doesn’t understand the policy.

Under “Dispute Assistance” policy, “Upwork will only review the 30 days of work performed prior to the date a User requests Dispute Assistance.” – So I would allow to refund what the mediator suggested of 14 hours based on his review.

Initially, the client mentioned to the Mediator to refund whatever they can, but the Client would not accept what the Mediator suggested (14 hours) now that they know my account is on hold.

I’ve already contacted the client as the UpWork support tells me to do. Everything has been said but still no definite answer if my account can be restored and I can continue working. Under the policy, it states that "If Client or Freelancer rejects Upwork's proposed, non-binding resolution then Client and/or Freelancer must pursue the Dispute independently" but it seems the favor is with this client as it controls how the limitation of account can be uplifted.

If you would keep my account on hold for this one client that doesn’t understand and follow the policy what would my other clients say about UpWork? I’ve brought several clients here in UpWork to keep the work flow smooth but it seems not in this case. My work is stalled with the result of lost earnings not only for me but also for my clients.

It is a pity that I brought my clients here in UpWork but we can’t continue to work. It is hard to see that my other clients would want to leave UpWork because of one client that doesn’t understand and follow the policy. What is the use of having those policies and going through mediation if it is not implemented correctly?

I would need a definite answer how this can be resolved immediately, what should I do or what can be done here to I know what is the next step so I can inform my clients.

Thank you,

Jacob


I don't know why you keep saying the client controls your limitation. It was pointed out before that you ignored the mediator and that will get your account suspended: https://community.upwork.com/t5/Freelancers/Dispute-Mediation-Help/m-p/684855/highlight/true#M415770

jhaek19
Community Member

I didn't ignored the mediator, I just got late to reply...

 

Like what they say here and the Mediator said, I need to contact the Client directly in order to lift the limitation, so what does that mean?

 

So the there is no further instrutions in the dispute and is currently closed, and I cannot respond niether.

 

The Mediator doesn't reply to my message, so how can I proceed here?

lysis10
Community Member


Jacob S wrote:

I didn't ignored the mediator, I just got late to reply...

 

Like what they say here and the Mediator said, I need to contact the Client directly in order to lift the limitation, so what does that mean?

 

So the there is no further instrutions in the dispute and is currently closed, and I cannot respond niether.

 

The Mediator doesn't reply to my message, so how can I proceed here?


They tell you in the documentation that failure to respond could lead to suspension. They give you three days to respond. I've never ignored a mediator, but I've had plenty of clients fail to reply. They then give the client 2 more days to reply, so it's a total of 5 business days to reply. I imagine they sent a reminder that you need to reply.

 

When they say to contact the client, they mean that you have to work it out with the client and get the client to respond that it's been corrected.

 

This is why I respond in an email and then I will go to the ticket to make sure that the response is logged on Upwork's side.

 

If they are ignoring you, then the only solution is probably contact the client and get them to contact Upwork to say the problem is resolved.

jhaek19
Community Member


Jennifer M wrote:

When they say to contact the client, they mean that you have to work it out with the client and get the client to respond that it's been corrected.

 

This is why I respond in an email and then I will go to the ticket to make sure that the response is logged on Upwork's side.

 

If they are ignoring you, then the only solution is probably contact the client and get them to contact Upwork to say the problem is resolved.


I am trying to work it out with the Client but they just won't abide by the policy. So what if the Client won't agree? And it seems they are doing it on purpose.

 

I can't even reply to the dispute tickets.

 

If they disagree, then they won't contact UpWork. UpWork should have a consideration here, or another option. They should get the Client to understand and follow the policy.

 

Still, I don't see in the policy why my account would still be put on hold with a particular client while I have other clients waiting for me to work for them.

 

Do freelancers have an option to re-open a dispute for re-consideration or re-evaluation?

lysis10
Community Member


Jacob S wrote:


I am trying to work it out with the Client but they just won't abide by the policy. So what if the Client won't agree? And it seems they are doing it on purpose.

 

I can't even reply to the dispute tickets.

 

If they disagree, then they won't contact UpWork. UpWork should have a consideration here, or another option. They should get the Client to understand and follow the policy.

 

Still, I don't see in the policy why my account would still be put on hold with a particular client while I have other clients waiting for me to work for them.

 

Do freelancers have an option to re-open a dispute for re-consideration or re-evaluation?


The client *did* follow policy, right? You were the one who ignored the mediator and they tell you don't do that or you risk suspension. There is a policy about ignoring the mediator. Read up on the process and you'll see it in there. Also, I believe they warn you when the dispute starts not to go silent.

 

If the client is ignoring you, it might be time to get creative. I find $$$$ speaks to people.

Hi Jacob,

 

I'd like to clarify that the dispute was closed and the team informed you about the reasons for your account limitation. Please, refer to your dispute tickets and follow the instructions provided there to address your account limitation.

 

Thanks!

~ Valeria
Upwork
AveryO
Community Manager
Community Manager

Hi Jacob, 

I checked the ticket and can see that the Mediation Specialist explained to you in detail why your account was put on a temporary hold. You may refer to the ticket thread for more information about your account, but please note that this will be processed in business days. As such, the holidays may affect how soon this issue can be resolved. 


~ Avery
Upwork
jhaek19
Community Member

Hi Avery,

 

I see that, but I asked him about why I didn't get a final notice before it. He said he gave it, but shows a wrong date, which was earlier.

 

Beside from that, why the Client would now be more demanding when we all know the rules and we already discussed what can be done. The Mediator should insist to follow the rules and policies which we already talked about.

 

Thanks!
Jacob

VladimirG
Community Manager
Community Manager

Hi Jacob,

 

I followed up on the information you shared, reviewed your communication with our dispute agent on the direct and group ticket, and can confirm the conversation was managed and subsequent action taken in line with Dispute guidelines and procedures. I do see our agent communicated clearly with you on a few occasions regarding responding on your ticket in a timely manner and the dispute was closed for the reasons our agent shared with you.

 

Please refer to the information our agent shared with you on your dispute ticket. The outcome of the dispute is unfortunate but we do hope you'll be able to proceed with building a successful career on Upwork and enjoy the holidays.

~ Vladimir
Upwork

Thank you  Vladimir.

 

I appreciate the explanation. But it seems unfair if the limitation removal would now depend on the Client. Whereas the limitation should be removed as I did gave a response, though it was late, and I gave my reasons why. The Mediator mentioned about having a good reason to be able to remove the limitation, but then it would now depend on the Client.

 

How can I proceed working with UpWork if my account is limited?

AveryO
Community Manager
Community Manager

Hi Jacob, 

As noted in your ticket, please resolve this issue directly with your client. Once resolved, please update your ticket thread so that the team can review your concern further.


~ Avery
Upwork
jhaek19
Community Member

Hi Avery,

 

Yes I am trying to resolve this with the client, do they control the limitation now? I thought they don't.

 

So what happens if the Client would not agree?

 

My account is limited as per policy, but the Client won't follow the policy. I can't see where is the policy on Dispute/Mediation but I can see that for the Client.

 

Thanks!
Jacob

g_vasilevski
Retired Team Member
Retired Team Member

Hi Jacob,

 

If you have any additional questions feel free to post them directly on your ticket/email thread, our team will assist you further as soon as possible. Thank you.

~ Goran
Upwork

Yes, but the Mediator won't answer yet. Hasn't repond to my messages as well.

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