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thompson_karen
Community Member

Ended a long-term contract,- but one of their employees is reaching out on Messenger

I ended a long-term contract when it became unacceptable and toxic to me to work with a client - who had a day job, and had me do all the heavy lifting the last 2 months - 3rd time working for him .His cousin, whom I coached for 7 months, is now reaching out to me on Messenger, despite the contract ended, and me forced to block him on Facebook, as well as poached a photo of mine to a Company website without my consent.  Which I told him twice when working - was unacceptable.  I was unable to say goodbye to the cousin properly because at a final session with the CEO, his cousin, as he got a large new bump in revenue I brought him, asked my advice again for marketing, sales, pricing and legal matters,  he continued to mock me, denigrate and verbally insult me, rather than ending it professionally as I had hoped.  I am not replying to his cousin on Messenger, since he is very close to his cousin, the ceo, and must certainly be aware I ended the contract.  I was given "No feedback" on Upwork- another further slap in the face from this CEO, who made a mocked veiled threat of doing this - at the last session, when I had finally had enough of his denigration while profiting from my work. And he did this as he was realizing new company revenues from my efforts/sales and negotiations with a marquis client I brought in. . So I have a digital trail that his manipulating timeline of when I worked for him on Upwork - is fabricated.  Not sure what to do about the cousin and his messengering me.  Of greater concern also, is that the ceo has gone in, and changed up the dates I worked for him on his Upwork profile (he boasted he is smarter than Upwork tech and algorithms),  which is of concern for me using Upwork as a true reflection of my work dates for clients.    I wrote Upwork about this matter and asked for resolution this evening.  What to do? I feel that if the cousin truly wants me to coach him further - he should make that offer through the Upwork platform, and also feel that Upwork should address the dates I actually worked for this client - to reflect the reality - and not allow this client to manipulate them on the Upwork platform?  Any input/resolution is appreciated so I can move on.  Thank you

 

ACCEPTED SOLUTION

Thank you 
Shaun!  I should have paid heed to your good advice - because over a week after I ended the contract, I was dismayed to just see he he is still reaching out, (unbelievably), badmouthing me online, flat out lying re his fabricated assertions over a week after I exited for cause ,  and which have no basis in fact.  When he should be thanking me for helping him  grow exponentially in every possible way - and after going so much above and beyond - often unpaid for this guy.  The sum total of my hard work input was crucial to growth for his fledgling start-up, way over and above the basic  Upwork designation he originally contracted me for,  and at a rate far below market norm for the scope of my work.    So  I am sorry I did not heed your advice right away.  However I did just finally block him.  Lesson learned and thank you.

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petra_r
Community Member


Karen T wrote:

I feel that if the cousin truly wants me to coach him further - he should make that offer through the Upwork platform


Why would you be prepared to work with the cousin again? Just block them and be done with it. That said, the cousin is not violating any terms of service, provided you previously agreed to communicate via Messenger. Once you have worked with a client you can communicate however you like, even when the contract ends.

 

If you feel stalked, unfriend them and tighten your Facebook privacy settings.

 


Karen T wrote:

  Of greater concern also, is that the ceo has gone in, and changed up the dates I worked for him on his Upwork profile (he boasted he is smarter than Upwork tech and algorithms),

 

Upwork should address the dates I actually worked for this client - to reflect the reality - and not allow this client to manipulate them on the Upwork platform?


Clients can't change or manipulate the dates. It is impossible. On client profiles it just shows as from "month" to "month", whereas on freelancer profiles it shows as exact dates. Nobody has "gone in and changed" anything. That is normal and how all contract durations are shown on the entire platform.

 

All three contracts are showing on your profile and the client's profile. The dates are exactly as expected: Exact dates on your profile, corresponding month durations of all 3 contracts on the client's. Nothing has been changed or manipulated.

 


Karen T wrote:

 I was given "No feedback" on Upwork- another further slap in the face from this CEO, who made a mocked veiled threat of doing this


You want to be grateful for that. If the relationship has gone sour the last thing you want is feedback from that client. Such feedback wouldn't be great, would it? There is no problem with "No feedback", but a real problem with poor feedback which you couldn't get rid of. "No feedback" means "no negative effect on your JSS or your profile", which in the case of a broken down relationship is about as good as you can hope for.

 


Karen T wrote:

 Any input/resolution is appreciated so I can move on.  Thank you


Block them and move on.

I’m not debating the dates here. He changed the dates. Period. This client had Upwork shut him down for a bit (and notify me too about safety tech concerns) early on.

The dates showed same as on my profile last week. They do not show actual 3 times I worked fir him on his Upwork account now. I did not start work for him in October. My 3rd time working for him started in February (not hjanuary) snd ended June 3.



Karen T wrote:
My 3rd time working for him started in February (not hjanuary) snd ended June 3.


That's exactly what it says on the client's profile. February 2021 to June 2021

 

3rd contract.png

 


Karen T wrote:
The dates showed same as on my profile last week. They do not show actual 3 times I worked fir him on his Upwork account now. I did not start work for him in October. 

 

It doesn't say October. It says November. The same as on your profile, where it says the exact date, In November. The contracts display exactly the same on your profile and the client's just in date range on yours and month-to-month range on the client's

 

2nd and 1st contracts.png

So this corresponds with what is on your profile.

Last contract Feb 16, 2021 - Jun 3, 2021 on your profile and February 2021 - June 2021 on the client's.

2nd contract Feb 9, 2021 - Feb 16, 2021 on your profile and February 2021 - February 2021 on the client's

1st contract Nov 9, 2020 - Feb 1, 2021 on your profile and November 2020 - February 2021 on the client's

 


Karen T wrote:
 He changed the dates. Period. 

The client did no such thing because it is impossible.

Petra,

 

With all due respect, freelancers like me make Upwork Money.  Not just clients of any shape and form.  I am truly sorry that I did not end this contract 2 months ago, as commenting poorly about women which this client couched as "funny" and denigrating a freelancer's  work - allowing them to get revenues which they never had - is not okay.

 

Moving on.

 

I hope upwork eventually gets the bandwidth to have mini trained HR people on its' platform.

 

Thanks,

 

Karen


Karen wrote:

With all due respect, freelancers like me make Upwork Money.  


What is your point? With all due respect, it is freelancers like me who make Upwork (considerably more) money... 

 



Karen T wrote:

I am truly sorry that I did not end this contract 2 months ago, as commenting poorly about women which this client couched as "funny" and denigrating a freelancer's  work - allowing them to get revenues which they never had - is not okay.


Yes, that's on you though.

 


Karen T wrote:

I hope upwork eventually gets the bandwidth to have mini trained HR people on its' platform.


What in the world do you mean by "mini trained HR people"? 

 


Karen T wrote:

Moving on.


Very good idea.

Trained HR. You need to consider a tad of empathy. Or considering less dogmatic replies. That’s what I mean. I’m expressing my opinion.

And no need to reply.


Karen T wrote:
Trained HR. You need to consider a tad of empathy. Or considering less dogmatic replies. That’s what I mean. I’m expressing my opinion.

And no need to reply.

Upwork doesn't have a trained HR department because they're not our employers. We are self-employed, and that means that we need to manage our clients ourselves. I hope you don't think that I'm lacking in empathy to point that out - we've all had bad clients at one time or another - but the only thing that you can do is chalk it up as a learning experience. One of the best things about being a freelancer is that you don't have to work with any client that you don't like, and you can walk away at any time.


Karen T wrote:
Trained HR. You need to consider a tad of empathy. Or considering less dogmatic replies. That’s what I mean. I’m expressing my opinion.

And no need to reply.

Petra doesn't work for Upwork. She can employ whatever style she wants when participating in a public forum. 

 

Upwork doesn't monitor or police private off-platform activities between client and independent contractors except to the extend those activities violate the Upwork TOS. Business owners find clients here, they manage their relationships with those clients and Upwork handles the payments. Anything else is up to the individual to manage. If you feel that your client is commiting computer crimes, that's an issue for the FBI. 

shaunkahler
Community Member

What I've learned is that you will often encounter toxic people if you work as a freelancer. Case and point, my last company who was bought out by private equity, fired all the executives and then tasked people with training their replacements. It can get crazy sometimes.

The best thing you can do is to gauge those potentials early. I screen all of my clients very thoroughly to ensure that they are engaging in work that I believe is morally sound and that their business is grown in good soil. You will gain nothing by engaging with toxic clients and you should never feel pressured to do so.

Especially if they aren't paying you anymore, such as in this case.

My advice? Block, block, block, and move, move, move on.

Also keep in mind that "No Feedback" no longer affects your JSS.

Thank you 
Shaun!  I should have paid heed to your good advice - because over a week after I ended the contract, I was dismayed to just see he he is still reaching out, (unbelievably), badmouthing me online, flat out lying re his fabricated assertions over a week after I exited for cause ,  and which have no basis in fact.  When he should be thanking me for helping him  grow exponentially in every possible way - and after going so much above and beyond - often unpaid for this guy.  The sum total of my hard work input was crucial to growth for his fledgling start-up, way over and above the basic  Upwork designation he originally contracted me for,  and at a rate far below market norm for the scope of my work.    So  I am sorry I did not heed your advice right away.  However I did just finally block him.  Lesson learned and thank you.

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