Forced to Return Funds Already Disbursed?

samvincent1096 · ‎12-08-2020

An hourly client has disputed time from several weeks ago. I entered the time manually, the client approved and paid for it, and Upwork disbursed the funds to me. Could Upwork require that I return the funds, or else garnish earnings from my other contracts and apply them to the disputed balance?

JoanneP · ‎12-08-2020

Hi Samuel,

I checked your account, and I can see that you already have an open ticket regarding this issue. One of our agents has updated your ticket providing further assistance. Please check your ticket number: 30389408.

~ Joanne

petra_r · ‎12-08-2020

Samuel V wrote:
An hourly client has disputed time from several weeks ago. I entered the time manually, the client approved and paid for it, and Upwork disbursed the funds to me. Could Upwork require that I return the funds, or else garnish earnings from my other contracts and apply them to the disputed balance?

Theoretically, if the hours were entered during the last 30 days from the dispute.

In praxis, that doesn't seem to happen often.

You'll find it in the ToS under 7.2 of Hourly, Bonus, and Expense Payment Agreement with Escrow Instructions

Upwork reserves the right to review the Freelancer’s work for 30 days prior to the date of the request for Dispute Assistance for compliance with Hourly Payment Protection requirements, and in its sole discretion, to make adjustments to invoices, and to direct Upwork Escrow to make appropriate releases to Client if it finds work that clearly does not relate Hourly Contract requirements or Client instructions in the Work Diaries or violations of the Terms of Service during its review of the work.

samvincent1096 · ‎12-08-2020

But how would that even work? Upwork would pay the client the disputed amount, then leave me with a negative balance?

petra_r · ‎12-09-2020

Samuel V wrote:
But how would that even work? Upwork would pay the client the disputed amount, then leave me with a negative balance?

If they did that, yes.

They don't often do it though.

That said, every time you use manual time, you are warned that there is no protection.

samvincent1096 · ‎12-09-2020

Upwork needs to me MUCH clearer about what hourly protection means. I thought it applied to funds disputed DURING THE REVIEW PERIOD---i.e., BEFORE DISBURSEMENT. They should be able to claw back funds ONLY with CLEAR evidence of fraud.

petra_r · ‎12-09-2020

Samuel V wrote:
Upwork needs to me MUCH clearer about what hourly protection means.

Read the terms of service. When you add annual time, it is pointed out to you. It's there. You're a lawyer for crying out loud. Surely you of all people know to read the terms under which you do business?

Samuel V wrote:
I thought it applied to funds disputed DURING THE REVIEW PERIOD---i.e., BEFORE DISBURSEMENT.

It usually does. I only know of one case where Upwork actually forced a freelancer refund more than the previous week. Usually the only time that's taken away is only for that period. Upwork don't say the WILL refund the 30 days up to the date of the mediation being requested, they say that they reserve the right to do so at their own discretion. Usually they don't

Except if the client goes to their bank and files a chargeback... Then the whole lot can be gone (but the client would be suspended)

deep_shome · ‎08-03-2021

I have been subjected to a forces refund against Invoice 400362657 for $49.50 without any previous intimation and without even being told the reason. It is principle of natural justice that both parties are heard and I am allowed to present my viewpoint/clarify.
This kind of unilateral action is unjust. Please help me.

deep_shome · ‎08-03-2021

contract of the client was suspended before this action. So I think Upwork is trying to recover from me what is due to Upwork from the client. Unfair!

petra_r · ‎08-03-2021

Ashok G wrote:
I have been subjected to a forces refund against Invoice 400362657 for $49.50 without any previous intimation and without even being told the reason.

That likely mens your client never paid for your hours and your hours did not qualify for payment protection

Ashok G wrote:
It is principle of natural justice that both parties are heard and I am allowed to present my viewpoint/clarify.

There is nothing "to hear" - if the client didn't pay, Upwork would only pay you out of their own pocket if your hours qualified for payment protection: No manual time, meaningful memos, decent activity levels.

The party who is not being just is the client if they didn't pay for your hours.

Ashok G wrote:
contract of the client was suspended before this action. So I think Upwork is trying to recover from me what is due to Upwork from the client. Unfair!

There is nothing "unfair" about it. The client didn't pay for your hours. *THAT* is unfair! Upwork offers very good payment protection for hourly contracts. **ALL** you have to do is track your time with the tracker, write memos and have decent activity levels.

Was it manual time?

wlyonsatl · ‎12-09-2020

Samuel,

Almost all the work I do on Upwork is under hourly contracts. I have found that Upwork's hourly protection is very reliable as long as I use the TimeTracker properly to keep track of all my work time.

Manual hours are a completely different story. There is no protection for the freelancer and Upwork will return to the client all contested funds upon request and under certain conditions.

If you want to be certain of receiving full payment for all of your hourly work, use TimeTracker correctly. Don't use manual time for any client you don't know well and trust completely.

Good luck!

prestonhunter · ‎12-09-2020

re: "Upwork needs to me MUCH clearer about what hourly protection means."

I don't blame you for being disappointed.

The good thing is that now you know.

As Petra pointed out, this kind of thing IS very rare.

But it CAN happen. You experienced it firsthand.
This sort of thing is just another reason why experienced, knowledgeable freelancers strongly recommend avoiding manually-logged time unless it is absolutely necessary.

Will, in particular, is a real champion when it comes to providing that advice here in the Forum.

I think Samuel is correct that it would be preferable if the ways that hourly earnings CAN be clawed back were communicated more clearly. How much difference would that actually make? I'm not sure. I think there is a limit to how much the typical Upwork user actually reads before using the tool. A lot of the way all of us learn is by doing, not by reading information beforehand.