How Do You Handle Vague Fixed Price Job Requests

[johnlamont]

I'm curious to hear how other freelancers handle vague fixed price job offers. "Do stuff.... $250". I am thinking specifically of two scenarios. The first is when one has been invited to submit a proposal on a job, and the other is where the job matches one's skill set closely. When I have been submitting a proposal I have generally proposed two or more milestones. The first being an exploratory phase for project discovery and the following milestone(s) to do the actual work. This approach hasn't been very successful so I'd appreciate hearing from anyone who has successfully negotiated this cul-de-sac.

Thanks,

John

[petra_r]

Personally I ignore budgets for the most part, unless they just so happen to align with what I would have charged anyway.

If the job post is vague I bid the budget and say that it's a placeholder and invite communication to properly scope the project.

---

John L wrote:

 The first being an exploratory phase for project discovery and the following milestone(s) to do the actual work. T

---

I like the full project funded and in Escrow, so I just set it up like that if it isn't hourly.

[tlsanders]

I make something up. I know this isn't applicable to every field, but as a writer, if I bid on a job that says "Need content for new law firm website," I use something that's a common starting bundle, price it, and then write "Bid price assumes 10 pages of 600-800 words each with one round of revisions as needed. If your needs differ, I will be happy to provide an updated quote once you provide additional details."

[petra_r]

---

Tiffany S wrote:

I make something up. I know this isn't applicable to every field, but as a writer, if I bid on a job that says "Need content for new law firm website," I use something that's a common starting bundle, price it, and then write "Bid price assumes 10 pages of 600-800 words each with one round of revisions as needed. If your needs differ, I will be happy to provide an updated quote once you provide additional details."

---

I used to do that, but found that if I keep it vague until I am actively talking to the client I can get them to warm to a higher rate more effectively, so I now keep it vague until they're on the hook 😉

[florydev]

I have been doing Tiffany’s estimate thing for a long time, I think I’m going to try this way.

[wescowley]

I use essentially the same method Petra describes: Unless the project description is crystal clear, including having all of the material attached to it, I state that the budget I'm giving is a placeholder for us to start a discussion. Often I'll use the budgeted amount for that, but that's lower than any reasonable project of that type would be, I'll put a swag number on it. Once I've reviewed the material, I tell them what my quote is and timeframe is and then update the amount on my proposal using the "change terms" option.

[grimesr]

Since I bid almost exculusively fixed price, I see this situation a lot.

My best advise is to "skip the project". In my experience, if the client says the project is to "build a house", then they probably really don't know what they want. If they can't articulate their requirements, they probably don't really know what they want and might not ever.

I realize sometimes discussion can lead to a full understanding of the job requirements, but I don't want to spend my connects on taking that chance.

I don't like submitting a proposal that starts with, "your requirements are vague and I will assume....".

It is up to you to decide if that client is the one you really want. I usually pass on them.

[a_lipsey]

---

Robert G wrote:

Since I bid almost exculusively fixed price, I see this situation a lot.

My best advise is to "skip the project". In my experience, if the client says the project is to "build a house", then they probably really don't know what they want. If they can't articulate their requirements, they probably don't really know what they want and might not ever.

I realize sometimes discussion can lead to a full understanding of the job requirements, but I don't want to spend my connects on taking that chance.

I don't like submitting a proposal that starts with, "your requirements are vague and I will assume....".

It is up to you to decide if that client is the one you really want. I usually pass on them.

---

I concur. I also work exclusively fixed price, and if they can't articulate enough in the job post, it's likely that's how working with them will be. So I just skip it. That does mean I take fewer jobs on Upwork, but for me it's about quality clients not the quantity of clients. 

[mtngigi]

For some categories, skipping vague RFPs maybe makes sense, for others it is somewhat understandable if a client is unsure about what to ask for, especially if they're starting a new business and have never worked with freelancers and certain skillsets before. It doesn't necessarily mean the client is a flake.

This was one of the arguments against when U came up with "specialized profiles". I work with a lot of new clients, and many do not know the terminology for what they want/need. Some of my favorite clients/jobs started out this way. I just ask questions, and like others, include a caveat to my bid, pending further discussion at the interview stage.

@ John L. ... In my opinion, you should do the "exploratory stage" during the interview process, rather than using a milestone. My 2¢.

[florydev]

Would you say that your clients though generally know their need?

All of my clients needs are vague, confused, or just plain wrong.

[susanwinlowmedia]

Just butting in here ... I learn so much on this forum. I'm glad this question was posed, because I usually leave rates alone and only bid if it matches my criteria. The vague ones, I usually avoid, too. "Write content for our ... (insert whatever here)." That's hardly informative. Or, my favorite, "We want 10 stories for our website." Then, they put a price of $50. Well, is this for all 10 or is $50 per story. I've learned that this could be anything, including a placeholder. 

Anyhow, this has given me the impetus to send in a proposal and discuss rates/price/expectations right within the proposal. I was treating the proposals as a true cover letter, where this is not socially accepted, for the most part. 

[florydev]

I consider a proposal a way to get a clients attention and everything is subject to further negotiation.
Do stuff is ridiculously vague but I personally would prefer it to an 8 page requirements dissertation with a $50 price tag. I expect that, you could even say prefer, clients don’t really know what they want, and don’t know what it will take. That’s my job.
But I also don’t care about connects one bit. I know that if I spend enough of them with a little time I will someone with a real problem I can smash.