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ploychat1
Community Member

Is Upwork fees 20% TOO high?

Anyone think that Upwork fees 20% TOO high?

 

I've just backed to find a job on Upwork and I'm shocked that Upwork fees have increased to 20%! I don't know why, but 2 years ago was just 8-10% (I'm not sure). I think 20% is too high and it is unfair for freelancers because you work same as usual but you need to pay for Upwork fees more than doubled. I think Upwork should remain that the income is from freelancers, they would find another website in one day if their deserved earnings are not worthy as they worked. 

 

 

 

116 REPLIES 116
richard_angle
Community Member

Considering that actors' agents average 10%, I do believe that 20% from Upwork is rather costly.  An acotor's agent even does a lot of the leg work.  What does Upwork do besides acting as an online mediator and securing funds for SOME of the jobs.  And now Upwork has the gall to charge the freelancer a bidding fee on top of taking a 20% cut off the top.  They say that it is to cut down on the ammount of bids sent out.  In my case, there would be substantially less bids being sent out if clients weren't running away due to my rate that has been increased by 20% to compensate for Upwork's greediness.  I have no issue with paying Upwork a fair fee as they do provide a great service.  However,  20% plus bidding fees has just taken it too far in my humble opinion.  And let's face it.  The vast majority of contracts are below $500.00 for the type of clientel on the platform.


Richard A wrote:

Considering that actors' agents average 10%, I do believe that 20% from Upwork is rather costly.


That's like complaining that a banana can't drive a bus when even a pen can get ink on paper...

 

 


Petra R wrote:

Richard A wrote:

Considering that actors' agents average 10%, I do believe that 20% from Upwork is rather costly.


That's like complaining that a banana can't drive a bus when even a pen can get ink on paper...


I haven't had my coffee yet, so I ended up re-reading your comment about three times before I realised that it wasn't supposed to make sense! 🙂

 

And while comparing apples to bananas, my acting agent takes 25%.  So.


Mary W wrote:

And while comparing apples to bananas, my acting agent takes 25%.  So.


I suggest you go and whine about it on their page 😄

 

784aba84
Community Member

Thread populated by community gurus. No point to say anything here, that such fact is a clear signal about the answer to the question.


Richard A wrote:

Considering that actors' agents average 10%, I do believe that 20% from Upwork is rather costly.  An acotor's agent even does a lot of the leg work.  What does Upwork do besides acting as an online mediator and securing funds for SOME of the jobs.  And now Upwork has the gall to charge the freelancer a bidding fee on top of taking a 20% cut off the top.  They say that it is to cut down on the ammount of bids sent out.  In my case, there would be substantially less bids being sent out if clients weren't running away due to my rate that has been increased by 20% to compensate for Upwork's greediness.  I have no issue with paying Upwork a fair fee as they do provide a great service.  However,  20% plus bidding fees has just taken it too far in my humble opinion.  And let's face it.  The vast majority of contracts are below $500.00 for the type of clientel on the platform.


In my line of work there are third party recruiters and they typically charge a third on top of the rate you are presented to the client with.  The rate you get for your work is not of your choosing it is whatever is left over with what they negotiate to the client and the their third.  Sometimes you can wiggle a few extra bucks per hour out of it and the recruiter gets a little less cheese.  They get their cheese for finding you the customer.  They actually do a lot more legwork and sell you so they deserve a little more.

 

My example might be just as pointless as yours except for one little thing.  On Upwork you can choose your own rate, it is one of the things I very much like about it and one of the things I fear the most that they will mess with.  If 20% is too much for you, the charge 20% more, which means you are more likely to get to $500.00 faster, which means even more cheese for you.

 

A wise man with a big, green, bald head once said that mindset is important and I think the mindset people should have is they are running a business and as such they should consider their costs when considering the price of their offering.

analyticarts
Community Member

Upwork fees are extremely reasonable. You should see what my recruiter is making on my current contract.

Upwork fees are extremely unreasonable for what they do (or NOT do) to protect the freelancers.

jim_g
Community Member

A while back I was into pastel landscapes. I was able to show at a certain event at a gallery once.

My painting sold for $500!

The gallery's cut was 40%!!!

 

So 20% ain't too bad.

It just sucks when you see it on every proposal you make.

jim_g
Community Member

And for anyone who says "raise your rates to make up for it,' I lost 2 jobs in 10 days for doing that.
They were small jobs, <300, but I was looking at what I'm making rather than what they are paying.

tlsanders
Community Member


Jim G wrote:

And for anyone who says "raise your rates to make up for it,' I lost 2 jobs in 10 days for doing that.
They were small jobs, <300, but I was looking at what I'm making rather than what they are paying.


The idea of raising your rates "to make up for it" makes no sense to me. If using Upwork cost me money, I wouldn't be using it. I use Upwork because it SAVES me time and money when compared with cultivating client relationships on my own. 

 

It's super interesting and unusual, though, that two clients in that short period of time got back to you to let you know specifically that you'd not only lost out on the job because your rates were too high, but that the differential was within that 20% margin.


Brian C wrote:

Upwork fees are extremely unreasonable for what they do (or NOT do) to protect the freelancers.


 

It maybe more helpful to think of the fees you pay as advertising budget rather than payments for 'protection', certainly cheaper than most other methods of client aquisition! 

 

I think you will find you have far more protection here than if you aquired all your remote clients from traditional advertising techniques.

 

They provide 

escrow services,

hourly protection for those that follow the correct procedure for tracking time,

fixed price protection in combination with the escrow services.

They also verify client payment methods and offer assistance if you do end up in a dispute.

 

 

Are Upwork perfect? NO - BUT, i happen to think the fee's are quite reasonable when you consider the many advantages they offer over finding clients yourself.

"It maybe more helpful to think of the fees you pay as advertising budget rather than payments for 'protection',"

That's what I was referring to. Negative publicity with unfair rating system.  Low JSS due to unresponsive client or unfair client by unknown client.  It actually hurts your "advertising"

I agree that the rating system may not be the best system, but it is OK. Sure there is a couple of elements that seem completly unjustified and even downright stupid. But, its not the be all and end all. 

 

If you are **Edited for Community Guidelines** about 20% fees then you must be getting work, and if you are getting work then the 'advertising fees' are clearly working, so i really dont understand why you have an issue. 

 

 

"If you are whining about 20% fees then you must be getting work, and if you are getting work then the 'advertising fees' are clearly working, so i really dont understand why you have an issue. "

 

Maybe I should be getting MORE work than I should be and Upwork "ADVERTISING" is working against me.

I'm simply stating my "OPINION" as that's what this thread was for.  I don't know why every "Community Guru" have to turn every opinion into arguement with assumptions.  Well... maybe that's why they're Guru's.  I didn't make an issue out of your opinion.  Just read and move on.

Perhaps it is because you have presented you opinion as 'fact' which it certainly is not. Remember this is a discussion forum, so you should expect people to reply if you post - its the very nature of a forum.

 

I'm also unsure on the 'assumptions' you think i have made? I offered some advice in my first reply to help you think of the fees in a different way (since you are inferring you are not happy with them).

 

I am unsure why you appear to feel 'entitled' to get jobs - you only pay the 20% fee on the jobs you get, so if the advertising isnt working you dont pay it! 

 

Sometimes it is helpful to look at yourself for the reason things are not working the way you want.

I for one dont get 'enough' work, but i am taking steps to try and improve both my 'job skills' and  client communication skills in order to improve that fact. I feel this is likely a better method than blaming other people/upwork ect. 

"Perhaps it is because you have presented you opinion as 'fact' which it certainly is not."

 

Let's see, the post asked "Is Upwork fees 20% TOO high?"  Clearly asking for opinions.

The answer above me by JohnD said "Upwork fees are extremely reasonable."

And I said "Upwork fees are extremely unreasonable"

 

So was JohnD stating fact or opinion?

 

Your statements are just **Edited for Community Guidelines**.

All, 

 

A few posts have been removed from this thread as they were in violation of the Community Guidelines.

Please, be mindful of the Guidelines, respectful toward other Community members and avoid personal attacks.

~ Valeria
Upwork


Brian C wrote:

 

Maybe I should be getting MORE work than I should be and Upwork "ADVERTISING" is working against me.

 


I'm genuinely curious as to why someone who thinks their business is being negatively impacted would want to keep using Upwork?

 


Brian C wrote:

 

 

Maybe I should be getting MORE work than I should be and Upwork "ADVERTISING" is working against me.

 

Upwork's advertising is working against you? So, the millions of dollars Upwork spends drawing clients to the site is making it HARDER for you to connect with prospective clients rather than easier? If that is somehow true, then obviously you should go to the places where it is easier for you to connect with clients. The fact that you haven't done that suggests that in fact you think the clients are here, and that Upwork's advertising is working.

I think the fees are way to high. I used to work with real work agency and they cost less than Upwork, this is the model in wich the freelancers are getting more precarious with time. This said, I am thinking about to leave the platform for good.


Brian C wrote:

Upwork fees are extremely unreasonable for what they do (or NOT do) to protect the freelancers.


I suppose you might feel that way if your motivation for paying Upwork is so that they will protect you from your clients. The primary value of the site for most freelancers is the large selection of clients that gathers here due to the millions of dollars Upwork spends each month promoting the site to prospective clients. 

49c24f0f
Community Member

It is too high.
Everyone feels safer to work over this platform, but when you see 20% fee , you get tempted to go outside platform,
So lower fee's would mean more freelancers and clients actually stayng on platform(since it is safer)

kamalanand25290
Community Member

To be honest, 20% is way high for individual part time freelancers.

Actually it is not 20%

For last project I earned $30. Upwork deducted $6 searvice charges. 5% of $30 tax which is $1.5. I transfered my money to my bank account, it deducted $1 for transaction. So at the end I got $21.5 from $30 that my client paid.

For individual with low price per hour, this 20% deduction + transaction charges + tax is way high. In my journey with upwork there are only 3 clients which crossed $500. Rest all are below $500. So I paid 20% for all my jobs.

And now connects are paid.

Upwork says they are deducting this amount for security of our payments. Why don't you create different plan for it as well. Make a subscription for security. Anyone who think they need it will subscribe for security and pay 20% of their earning and the one who think they don't need it will not subscribe and will get least deduction say 5% or 8%.


Kamal A wrote:

Upwork says they are deducting this amount for security of our payments. 


No, they don't say anything of the sort.

Moderator Avery O Says,"providing services like payment protection outweigh the fees currently charged for small projects"

The one who don't need payment protection should have option to opt it out 🙂

I know my friend. I have worked 3 months and half till now. Made 28 jobs which costed about 3000K and with Fees I have just 1400 EUR. That’s much fee ikr. They say after 500$ WITH ONE CLIENT you have then 10% fees and after 10.000 5% 😂. Something that you never can make just with one client 10k and up. Imagine. I have worked with different clients. All of them. And never saw the 10% fee. Imagine...


Kamal A wrote:

The one who don't need payment protection should have option to opt it out 🙂


"services like" is no the same thing. And you are free to "opt out" by using a different platform if you don't find the ROI high enough for you here.

trishlambert
Community Member

I view Upwork as my sales representative who brings me leads 24/7/365. As is common with such a relationship, I pay them a base (my monthly subscription) and commission (20% on the first $500 I earn per client, and down from there). I have no problem at all with that arrangement.

 

There is no way that I could find leads comparable to the ones I get here for the same cost. Every minute I spend not doing billable work is money lost. So I'm much better off pursuing the leads that Upwork brings me and paying their commission.

bundie702
Community Member

Raising my hand with a resounding "Yes!" (the fees are too high). I think that 15% of first $500 is plenty.

 

I grit my teeth every time I see the chunk they take of my earnings, and I feel for resume writers and other freelancers, the nature of whose work does not call for repeat business.

syedzaheer92
Community Member

As, everyone in thread already explained it is for $500 under projects and than drops to 10 and 5%.

In my opinion they are taking justified amount.

Reason :

1- They provide a platform where you can build a reputation and approach clients.

2- They provide safe payment ( so no chance of scam or clients taking away work and money).

3- You can grow your work and portfolio both.


Syed Z wrote:

As, everyone in thread already explained it is for $500 under projects and than drops to 10 and 5%.

In my opinion they are taking justified amount.

Reason :

1- They provide a platform where you can build a reputation and approach clients.

2- They provide safe payment ( so no chance of scam or clients taking away work and money).

3- You can grow your work and portfolio both.


Your #2 point is not actually true. The only certain payment protection is on hourly contracts using the desktop time tracker precisely as it's meant to be used. And even then, I believe there is a cap on the amount that's protected. Manual hours are not protected at all and on fixed-price contracts the client can dispute up to 30 days after the final milestone is done (and do a chargeback at any point, although they likely forfeit their own account in that case).

 

That said, like Patricia and Petra I find the ROI to be well worth my while. My UW practice is a mix of repeat and one-off clients and my overall fee percentage runs 11-12%. There's no way I could find -- or be found by -- the clients I connect with here by spending a comparable amount on my own marketing initiatives. Plus, I'd have to invest up front with no guarantee of returns. Here, I get to pay as I go.

 

e816da1f
Community Member

Well. I worked 2 jobs for a client, got a higher rate on job 2 and earned 29 dollars but take home 9? It's my first month so client is happy but seriously thinking about this. Just landed another job so maybe that won't take such a hit? Anybody else like this?
Tina Lawlor Mottram

Yes It's TOO high! 
Here people are asking to move to other platform if you find the fee to be high...! 
Well give me a competitive platform with equivalent opportunities like Odesk and Elance few years back... I would happily shift. 
so you understand the reason for the merge and then raising the fee. Kill the competition and create the monopoly

Secondly, the services which they are proving for 20%, elance gave out those opportunities @8%.
PLUS it charges more for getting connects these days. 

Over and above, clients are also paying processing fee of 3%. 


Thirdly, Small jobs may cost more for new freelancers. Freelancers who have been working here for last 10-15 years, they already know how to deal with it.
_____________________

So I think upwork should come out with some plan considering the people from asia who work at much lower rates and the probability of going above 500 per client is very less. 

 

clarimoraes
Community Member

I find it EXTREMELY high and unfair. We're not gonna earn up to 500$ in every job we get, so it's not as simple as "it's only for the first 500 dollars".


Clarissa M wrote:

I find it EXTREMELY high and unfair. We're not gonna earn up to 500$ in every job we get, so it's not as simple as "it's only for the first 500 dollars".


Unfair to whom? Unfair how? It's the same for everyone.

Upwork has to stay in business for us to be able to benefit from it, and without making any money it won't last,  To this day, it has never made a profit.

 

The fee is a business expense you need to build into your rates and prices, When you accept work at a rate that simply won't make you any money and is barely over a quarter of your (already more than reasonable) profile rate, the fee matters.


If you were to set your rate at a more realistic level and didn't accept jobs at a fraction of your profile rate, the fee would be no problem for you.

 

If you accept bottom-of-barrell rates you don't only end up not earning enough, you also end up with the worst clients and you also harm your fellow freelancers. Professional translators don't usually work for $5 an hour.


Clarissa M wrote:

I find it EXTREMELY high and unfair. We're not gonna earn up to 500$ in every job we get, so it's not as simple as "it's only for the first 500 dollars".


Clarissa, I suspect there is something fundamentally wrong with your business plan. Why would you say you couldn't earn more than $500 per project?

 

PS. It is $500 per client regardless of the number of projects for that client.

Either way, the point everyone is missing is that the sliding scale stops at 5%. Forever. Why doesn't it become zero or 1% at some point?

So even if you keep a customer for a long time doing a significant number of hours per month, you are always leaving 5% (in the best case) to Upwork, indefinitely.

That's in my opinion where the real issue is: they take a significant cut of your money. 5% of a full month means that a whole day is worked for Upwork only, FOREVER.

re: "Either way, the point everyone is missing is that the sliding scale stops at 5%. Forever. Why doesn't it become zero or 1% at some point? So even if you keep a customer for a long time doing a significant number of hours per month, you are always leaving 5% (in the best case) to Upwork, indefinitely. That's in my opinion where the real issue is: they take a significant cut of your money. 5% of a full month means that a whole day is worked for Upwork only, FOREVER."

 

Juan:
The important point is that all of this is VOLUNTARY.

 

It is TRUE that Upwork's fees don't go down to 1% or zero. They go down to 5% and stay at 5%.

 

But it is YOUR CHOICE whether to use Upwork to find clients or not.
You can make the choice to use other platforms to find jobs.

You are allowed to stop using Upwork and instead use freelance work platforms which never charge 20% or which quickly go down to 1% or zero percent fees.

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