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Job Success, ongoing work and other serious issues

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Active Member
Vlad R Member Since: Jul 4, 2015
1 of 40

Hi everyone,

There is no shortage of complaints about the Job Success rating in this community, and I will not repeat other's concers.

My issue is with ongoing work. More than 1/3rd of my contracts are ongoing. The others are contracts that have ended. When calculating the Job Success rate, the ongoing work is not contributing to this in any way. I have had a recent chat with Customer Support and they confirmed this - ongoing contracts DO NOT MATTER for your Job Success. And the ongoing work is 80% of my work on Upwork.

That's a HUGE problem. Why? Well, for a few reasons:

- Even though they are about 1/3rd of my contracts, they represent 80% of my work and income. My longest and best working relationships are on contracts that are still ongoing.

- Only 60% of my contracts contribute to my Job Success score. Many of these were quick, $20 jobs that I did to make a little extra on the side, while not working for my long-term contracts. 

- Even though 2/3ds of contracts contributing to my job Success could be considered fair, it only represents 20% of my work or less
- Effectively, 20% of my work and relationship is contributing to my Success score, while a whopping 80% if absolute DEAD WEIGHT.
- I am disturbed that CS told me sometimes clients give 5 star feedback ratings, but privately transmit concerns and low ratings. How is that fair, transparent and encouraged by Upwork? Why are freelancers penalized because clients will not state their concerns upfront, allowing us to improve our relationship?

Due to all of the above, despite having a 4.5 rating and, as far as I knew, overall positive experiences with a few exceptions,  my Success rate is now a measly 66%. If clients trust that statistic to be correct, to them it means that 1/3rd of my jobs end negatively one way or the other.

That is simply not true. I have had negative experiences with clients on a few occasions, some because they did not like my work, some because the client changed their minds. This happens to every freelancer. But it is simply not a correct statistic that only 66% of my contracts were successful.

In short, 80% of my work and relationships with clients do not contribute to my Job Success at all. This can't continue. My long-term contracts are mostly due to good working relationships. Where's that feedback in my success score? Why does Upwork not account for work by volume? 

Upwork needs to account for ongoing work. They need a better system that understands work volume, and that understands ongoing contracts need to contribute to the Job Success rating. If you are like a freelancer withs lots of ongoing work but few ended contracts, you have been royally screwed.

This has been impacting my job applications recently, or at least I am certain that it does. I am certain I am not the only one in this situation, and I am hoping a solution for this will present itself.

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Community Guru
Jennifer M Member Since: May 17, 2015
2 of 40

I can kinda relate. I have an awesome amazing customer who throws me about $400-$600 in work each week. He just keeps hiring me over and over and has been doing so for about the last 6 months. He started off rating me to help me out, but now he basically auto-hires, funds, waits for me, and pays.. then repeats the process. Not sure how many jobs I've done for him but it's dozens. Problem is that he never rates me just because it's just an extra hassle I suppose or maybe he figures I don't care. I really don't care, but I suppose it could be dragging me down on my scores.

 

At the end of the day, it's the money that matters. I'll take a lower score with his income each week rather than a higher scores and no money.

 

You said yourself that you have repeat, ongoing business. That matters more. Don't let an algorithm stress you out. The ones and zeros don't care about fair.

 

 

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Community Guru
Aleksandra K Member Since: Mar 31, 2015
3 of 40

Jennifer,

 

It’s good that you don’t stress out about the JS and you are right that money is what matters. If the client keeps hiring you then you must be doing a good job.

 

 However, if you keep getting jobs that end with no feedback, over time that will probably influence your JS. And as much as you think this is irrelevant at some point your account might be put under review (which is somethings you definitely don’t want) or even be permanently closed. The system doesn’t care how good you are at your job; all the system knows is that your jobs end without any feedback and that is not how the platform works.

 

Although I respect your attitude towards the JS, it’s not something it will pay off on long term basses.

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Community Guru
Jennifer M Member Since: May 17, 2015
4 of 40

You're absolutely correct that I wouldn't want my account suspended. But, I highly doubt "jobs with no feedback" is the only factor. I suspect "many different small jobs with no feedback" is an issue. I think "provider and client together bank 5 figures through the site" outweighs the issue.

 

I suspect your income plays a huge factor in your scoring. From my experience (and I think it makes sense), if you bank a high per client income, it greatly improves your scores.  For instance, my per client rate in IT is much higher, I have 100% satisfaction rate, and I'm ranked pretty well. But overall, I have a lower per year income. In writing, I have a much higher per year income, but my per client income is lower and I'm so so in rank and only 85% recommended. Elance's recommended rate seems to coincide with Upwork's JS. I'd say 80% of my income is writing.

 

I think $10k from one customer in a few months outweighs 100 $100 jobs. The only exception to this rule seems to be if you're doing tons of jobs (farmers) each day, so it looks like you're making $250k for yourself but you're actually farming out the work outside of the platform. I have a farmer who I regularly compete with who does this. His "agency" is one person, so it looks like it's just him making money. His recommended rate is only 79% and if you look at his feedback, he has at least 1 person per page who accuses him of plagiarism or poor quality. However, he does such a tremendous amount of work each day, these poor ratings just get drowned out. Hence, he's able to "recover" from all of the low ratings.

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Community Guru
Aleksandra K Member Since: Mar 31, 2015
5 of 40

It was never confirmed nor denied that the jobs with no feedback influence your JS. The only thing that was said was that if you have many jobs that ended with no feedback (regardless how big or small they were) it might lead to account review. The “no feedback” jobs are not the only factor for JS, but I am sure they are important.

 

I believe the income is a big thing, as that is how UpWork makes their money. However, making money for them doesn’t guarantee you get to keep your account (assuming the JS is low). There are many people who complain that although they were making a significant amount of money, UpWork limited the functionality of their accounts, and some were even permanently closed (without any explanation – as they claim).

 

I’ve never worked on Elance, so I am not quite sure how their system works, but I am familiar with the way UpWork works. If the JS was not such a big deal for those that make a lot of money, then there wouldn’t have been so many freelancers compiling about the JS ruining their life.

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Community Guru
Garnor M Member Since: Oct 29, 2014
6 of 40

Hi Aleksandra,

You mentioned, "It was never confirmed nor denied that the jobs with no feedback influence your JS." We have confirmed that a work history with a prevelance of jobs without feedback will count against your JS. Again, one or two jobs without feedback won't negatively affect you if the majority of your work history is comprised of jobs that do have ratings.

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Community Guru
Aleksandra K Member Since: Mar 31, 2015
7 of 40

Hi Garnor,

 

Thank you for your reply. It is true that you (meaning UpWork) has confirmed that if the freelancer has many jobs with “no feedback” it will count against the JS, but I can’t recall reading the effect that one job with “no feedback” has on the JS. My comment was referring to that.

 

So my question is this – Are you saying that one or two jobs with “no feedback” have no influence at all on the JS, or that they do but it is insignificant?

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Moderator
Valeria K Moderator Member Since: Mar 6, 2014
8 of 40

Hi Aleksandra,

 

One or two jobs with no feedback provided will not be counted in your Job Success score unless those jobs constitute the majority of your work history.

~ Valeria
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Community Guru
Fergus M Member Since: May 23, 2015
9 of 40

Hi Valeria,

 

Thanks for replying, but that's pretty vague. Around a third of my jobs on Elance don't have feedback, because it's from repeat clients and they can't be bothered giving me feedback every week. Is that going to have an effect?

If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.― George Orwell
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Moderator
Valeria K Moderator Member Since: Mar 6, 2014
10 of 40

Hi Fergus,

 

In your situation, having a lot of long-term repeat clients is going to have a positive effect on your Job Success score. Contracts that show with no feedback will not bring it down.

~ Valeria
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