Job success score is UNFAIR and should be cha... - Page 2

dannykundzinsh · ‎12-23-2018

The job Success score is not an accurate reflection of the freelancers job success, there are projects which were completed successfuly but I haven't got reviews on but still count against my score, the score makes it seem like I am a bad freelancer that isn't completing the projects properly while I completed every project successfully with complete client satisfaction and the score has nothing to do with my performance on the jobs I've worked on.
Is it my fault some clients don't leave feedback? is it my fault that a client doesn't pay? is it my fault that a project lasts for several months beyond the original intended time?
I pay a monthly subscription and I do not feel I am getting my worth as the system is working against me and not for me.
The way the score should work is IF and only IF there are specific complaints against a freelancer and after a management review it's justified then the score can drop, but not because of reasons outside of the freelancers control as I mentioned above.
I completed all my projects with success but my score is 84% when it should be 100%.
Please advise.

tlbp · ‎12-26-2018

@brian F wrote:
I appreciate the thougtful response Scott. Part of the problem, at least for a writer as I am, is that Upwork does not provide many quality writing gigs/assignments. There are A LOT of iffy requests/contracts/clients, but if did not take a lot of these, I'd have almost no business.

So yeah, Ideally I'd avoid these difficult people/clients. But the lack of options and lac of quality writing gigs makes this impossible. Every time you guys say "Why don't you as a freelancer do X, Y, or Z," maybe consider that you're speaking more in ideal terms and not in the reality of the Upwork marketplace.

Freelancers who choose to work with subpar clients can't expect Upwork to adjust the rating system to reflect that fact. Freelancers are business owners, Upwork is a lead generation tool some of those business owners choose to use. You can't blame the tools you choose for the success or failure of your business. Nor is it reasonable to compare market conditions from 5 years ago to today's competitive environment--unless you are comparing them to demonstrate that the field of freelancing has become significantly more competitive. There are hundreds of thousands of new entrants into the market--both clients and freelancers.

If we are going to rely on anecdotal evidence, however, then I can add my anecdote. Upwork has provided me with access to a sufficient number of high-quality clients that I am kept very busy and have to turn work away.

I would recommend that any freelancer who is struggling to find good client matches evaluate their business processes. From product to prospecting.

dannykundzinsh · ‎12-26-2018

Tonya P, I as well as many others have no problems finding quality clients, that is not the issue at hand.
The problem is the way the JSS is setup to count job success %, the title in itself even don't make any sense, I've completed 100% of all of my jobs but my "JOB success" was at around 84%, the title in itself is already an innacurate representation of what the JSS actually stands for, then you have all the other issues that mentioned earlier. when a client sees less than 100% job sucess, client already is suspicious, but he or she has no cllue that the JSS has nothing to do really whether a freelancer completed the projects or not, but other factors which some are completely out of the freelancer's control, such as this secretive feedback which most clients are not even aware how much it hurts the JSS.

So the problem is not that there's a difficulty finding good leads, but rather upwork as a tool, has a malfunction, if I use a hammer, I don't want the hammer to stab me in my hand every time I want to use it, that would be detrimental to it's purpose, but that's how the current way JSS is working, it's stabbing good freelancers in the hand who are trying to use it.

petra_r · ‎12-26-2018

@Danny K wrote:

The problem is the way the JSS is setup to count job success %, the title in itself even don't make any sense, I've completed 100% of all of my jobs but my "JOB success" was at around 84%

So how about a contract open for months but nothing ever paid?

tlbp · ‎12-26-2018

@Petra R wrote:
@Danny K wrote:

The problem is the way the JSS is setup to count job success %, the title in itself even don't make any sense, I've completed 100% of all of my jobs but my "JOB success" was at around 84%
So how about a contract open for months but nothing ever paid?

I think he thinks that the job success score is a job "completed" score--like you should get 100% as long as you turn something in. 🤷

mancm · ‎09-20-2022

Well, I have provided outstanding service, and my contribution brought many improvements in the workflow and the work results imrpovements also, but few team members plotted against me and I got fired and additionally got poor feedback, based on LOW level team members false accusations, I reached Upwork support and they do not even want to hear about it, I asked this project to be removed from my profile, because it is giving wrong image to the potential clients, but Upwork don't even want to hear about it, rejecting to take any responsibility, but those team members were also hired via Upwork, now their JSS is rising and mine is lowering, again just because of few low level team memebrs have plotted against me, althoug they earned credits for the improvements that came from me, I guess they were threatened so they decided to get rid of me, IMAGINE, those guys were pointed our as Quality Control, but they actually have no clue how to get the job done and had no vision of what the end result will be, and for them I was told that they have POOR Grammar skills, POOR Math skills, and LACK of Communication skills, yet they got rewarded and I got fired, and additionally got POOR review on Upwork, and Upwork refuses to take any responsibility about it, but keeps protecting such scammers.

Well done Upwork, you are devaluing honest and hard working Freelancers and promoting and supporting Scammers, the shame is on you.

petra_r · ‎12-23-2018

@Danny K wrote:
Petra no, I never had any projects without payment who were closed.

Then you have a contract that has been open for months and nothing was ever paid on it?

@brian F wrote:
My clients who would recommend me is HIGHER than my JSS!

Barely.

And as Tonya says, it is a lifetime metric, whereas the JSS is the best of your 6 month, 12 months and 24 months windows.

dannykundzinsh · ‎12-26-2018

What the current system does is basically allowing clients even though they are happy with the freelancers performance is basically stab the freelancer in the back by giving a "secret" feedback that the freelancer cannot see that lowers the freelancer's JSS, the client has no clue that this is what he or she is doing by providing such "secret" feedback, if the clients would know most of them would NOT provide such feedback at all! and that is guranteed. not if the client is aware that the feedback provided is going to hurt the freelancer's livelyhood.
Most clients think, they are simply providing another feedback that can improve the performance of the freelancer and improve the system while in reality, they are hurting the freelancer's reputation on the platform.
we can all improve, and none of us are perfect, however the way the JSS is currently set up is punishing even the freelancers who do great work which makes no sense.
This is by far the most unfair and broken rating system i've ever encountered, if there is one thing upwork can learn from is the game industry in which I work, there are many types of non destructive and constructive ways of rating that can benefit every one, there's absoulutely no need for such a brutal secretive and unfair system as the JSS, it must change.

tlbp · ‎12-26-2018

@Danny K wrote:
What the current system does is basically allowing clients even though they are happy with the freelancers performance is basically stab the freelancer in the back by giving a "secret" feedback that the freelancer cannot see that lowers the freelancer's JSS, the client has no clue that this is what he or she is doing by providing such "secret" feedback, if the clients would know most of them would NOT provide such feedback at all! and that is guranteed. not if the client is aware that the feedback provided is going to hurt the freelancer's livelyhood.

Prove it.

There's absolutely no evidence that clients would lie to protect a bad freelancer's livelihood.

dannykundzinsh · ‎12-26-2018

Tonya P, this is not the point I am making, read my comment again please.
If clients would know they are going to lower a freelancer's JSS they would NOT provide negative feedback, they think they are helping, where in fact they are helping no one but rather hurting the freelancer who did a fine job, hence hurting upwork by reducing the chances of good freelancers being hired in the future because a client sees less than 100% JSS, there's quite a bit of psychology involved in this, which is why I am bringing it to the upwork's attention and hopefuly the management can review this issue more carefuly and weigh everything I mentioned in this thread.
in a nutshell, the JSS is hurting more than doing good for all parties involved, it's actually costing upwork quite a lot of money, in it's current form it's not worth having. it needs to be reconsidered and remade to be much more forgiving and not detrimental to the purpose of the platform as a whole.
I'm looking at the big picture here, I am not just a voice crying the wilderness, there are plenty others who share the same feelings as I.
In it's most simplistic and bare form: I've been completing every project that started to the best of my ability, but yet under 90% project success rate? the name JSS should change to something else at the minimum, as it has not so much to do whether the job was completed successfuly or not but more whether all the elements involved in a project were perfectly executed according to the platform's rules and regulations which most of the upwork users don't really care or want to knowabout, especially clients who are casual users who will spend a few grands on a project and will never use upwork again, I would bet there's tons of them out there, I know I worked with a few.

versailles · ‎12-26-2018

@Danny K wrote:
What the current system does is basically allowing clients even though they are happy with the freelancers performance is basically stab the freelancer in the back by giving a "secret" feedback

Why would you assume that clients who leave a bad private feedback are happy?

I would guess that in this case, they are not happy with the work at all, but they may not want to tell the freelancer, for some reason.

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"Where darkness shines like dazzling light" —William Ashbless

dannykundzinsh · ‎12-26-2018

Rene K
I would encourage you to go to my profile and see how many "unhappy" reviews I have.
there is inconsistency between the star reviews and the secretive reviews, if a client gives me 5 stars on a project but gives me a different review in secret so I can improve, the client is not necessery unhappy with my performance but rather feels there are areas I can improve upon, which is acceptable, in fact I encourage every client to give a constructive feedback to how a freelancer can improve but NOT if the freelancer gets hurt in the process by having their JSS lowered which hurts their reputation and income possibilities.

versailles · ‎12-26-2018

@Danny K wrote:
Rene K
I would encourage you to go to my profile and see how many "unhappy" reviews I have.
there is inconsistency between the star reviews and the secretive reviews, if a client gives me 5 stars on a project but gives me a different review in secret so I can improve, the client is not necessery unhappy with my performance but rather feels there are areas I can improve upon, which is acceptable, in fact I encourage every client to give a constructive feedback to how a freelancer can improve but NOT if the freelancer gets hurt in the process by having their JSS lowered which hurts their reputation and income possibilities.

I'm wondering if you had a contract closed without earnings. Usually, Upwork doesn't like these.

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"Where darkness shines like dazzling light" —William Ashbless

petra_r · ‎12-26-2018

@Rene K wrote:
I'm wondering if you had a contract closed without earnings. Usually, Upwork doesn't like these.

He's already confirmed that there are none that closed without payment. Unfortunately repeated questions whether there are any that have been open for months without anything ever having been paid have not prompted any response at all.

tlbp · ‎12-26-2018

@Danny K wrote:
Rene K
I would encourage you to go to my profile and see how many "unhappy" reviews I have.
there is inconsistency between the star reviews and the secretive reviews, if a client gives me 5 stars on a project but gives me a different review in secret so I can improve, the client is not necessery unhappy with my performance but rather feels there are areas I can improve upon, which is acceptable, in fact I encourage every client to give a constructive feedback to how a freelancer can improve but NOT if the freelancer gets hurt in the process by having their JSS lowered which hurts their reputation and income possibilities.

JSS is an assessment tool for clients, not a self-improvement tool for freelancers. Upwork doesn't want to promote freelancers who are hoping to improve. Upwork wants to provide clients with recommendations for freelancers who are already performing well.

Freelancers who genuinely wish to improve should make a habit of seeking feedback from their clients throughout the performance of the contract and at its conclusion. And by feedback, I am referring to direct communication with the client asking if they are satisfied and what the freelancer could have done better--not asking the client to leave a rating.

melaniekhenson · ‎12-26-2018

@Tonya P wrote:
@Danny K wrote:
Rene K
I would encourage you to go to my profile and see how many "unhappy" reviews I have.
there is inconsistency between the star reviews and the secretive reviews, if a client gives me 5 stars on a project but gives me a different review in secret so I can improve, the client is not necessery unhappy with my performance but rather feels there are areas I can improve upon, which is acceptable, in fact I encourage every client to give a constructive feedback to how a freelancer can improve but NOT if the freelancer gets hurt in the process by having their JSS lowered which hurts their reputation and income possibilities.
JSS is an assessment tool for clients, not a self-improvement tool for freelancers. Upwork doesn't want to promote freelancers who are hoping to improve. Upwork wants to provide clients with recommendations for freelancers who are already performing well.

Although it may seem rough, I agree with this. I try to look at it from the client's perspective. Would I want to hire someone for the purpose of receiving less than satisfying work for my money and then being a teacher for that person so s/he can deliver better work to someone else next time? (Sorry for the run-on sentence.) Oh heck no.

Clients want as few headaches as possible and I don't blame them. I try to deliver just that: great work, no headaches. But I also vet my clients in advance so that *I* don't have as many headaches either. 😉

This place can be a sounding board for improvement. The place for improvement isn't on a client's time and dime. Harsh but true, and actually, it makes total sense.

bfry1981 · ‎12-26-2018

I dunno, maybe we have a system that incorporates BOTH freelancer AND client perspectives? I've seen a hell of a lot of complaints about client behavior and haven't seen any evidence that the ratings system was adjusted to make clients more accountable, only adjustments not in the favor or freelancers to thin the herd and address clients' concerns. Like, why are they afraid to leave bad reviews? This strikes me as absurd that a client would rate a freelancer's work 5/5 then have MAJOR complaints in private. It seems like if a client leaves 5/5 but has a few minor quibbles in private that Upwork treats that as "uncessessful." This really does not makse sense.

If a client is happy leave positive review. If not, leave a negative review. In public. Why is this somehow uncomplicated or unsatisfactory? If a client leaves a bad review, then offers to issue a partial refund to make up for it, isn't that a normal part of customer service in all kinds of fields? If their is a problem, it gets states and attempts at making amends are made? Many times I've gone to s store angry with something defective and left happy because I got a refund or something else in return. We don't need to reinvent the wheel here...

browersr · ‎12-26-2018

@brian F wrote:
I dunno, maybe we have a system that incorporates BOTH freelancer AND client perspectives? I've seen a hell of a lot of complaints about client behavior and haven't seen any evidence that the ratings system was adjusted to make clients more accountable, only adjustments not in the favor or freelancers to thin the herd and address clients' concerns. Like, why are they afraid to leave bad reviews? This strikes me as absurd that a client would rate a freelancer's work 5/5 then have MAJOR complaints in private. It seems like if a client leaves 5/5 but has a few minor quibbles in private that Upwork treats that as "uncessessful." This really does not makse sense.

There are of course client ratings that come from freelancer reviews. However, the nature of buyer/seller means that client reviews mean a heck of a lot less. It will never be a level playing field in that respect.

The crux of the issue I believe is private feedback. Indeed why write a positive 5-star message publicly and then kill the freelancer privately. I do believe that is a problem. I believe UW is trying to get as uncoerced a view as possible. This is why there is the double-blind review process as well. People can be afraid of confrontation or even reprisal based on whatever their job was. Maybe they need to rely on the freelancer to some extent for a while post project and don't want to muddy those waters. Maybe the client thinks they are being nice to the freelancer and then telling a more realistic (from their view) perspective in private not realizing the impact it will have. I would agree that a significant imbalance between public and private feedback should be in some way flagged. There can be degrees through. Perhaps the client was okay with the freelancer and the job was done satisfactorily. However, for one reason or the other, the client wouldn't really recommend this person. They weren't bad but perhaps not good enough to put their own name behind by way of a recommendation. One could easily see that sort of situation which is not an outlandish difference between public and private. Yet, I would assume indicating you wouldn't recommend someone might be taken a bit stronger into the JSS score. So like I said, it isn't so cut and dry.

bfry1981 · ‎12-27-2018

Scott- The public reviews are already double blind. Life shouldn't be perfect for the client either. Maybe they will be depending on the freelancer in the future so instead of giving a crappy review they can talk to the freelancer, be open, honest, and communicative about how the improve and the freelancer can actually make those improvements. If they are nervous about leaving a bad review were nervous about getting one! Doesn't that cancel out to a degree? Why should the client's reservations about leaving reviews on a public rating system (which you admit affects we freelancers far more to begin with and is inherently unequal) be given such a substantial corrective as private feedback but our reservations are given nothing? If anything, it'son the client to explain issues and allow the freelancer to correct them. We can't read minds and many clients are terrible at communication. We should have a lower score because can't read minds? I honestly think this concept of a client being afraid to leave an honest review is more hypothetical than real. People who are willing, beyond minor quibbles, to leave a vastly different review in public than in private are just not honest people and. Again, if they are going to have an extended relationship with us. common decency dictates that they just tell us what's wrong and allow us to fix it. This is not rocket science, and how many freelancers would honestly not fix issues they were presented with by a client? If they did not fix them, I could see that as earning a bad review. But you are right, the discrepancy between public and private reviews IS a thing and IS telling a problematic clients when it isn't minor. In my experience, a clients can often just be lazy, they expect you to read their minds and then it isn't exactly what they ask for--even when you asked for more detailed instructions and they declined to give you any (this happened to me recently with a client who left not public feedback)-they come at you with attitude and negativity.

Where are the protections from clients like this? the blind feedback offers none, but the system is supposed to protect clients who are nervous about leaving public feedback. Come on. If they are happy, the rating should reflect that even if there is room for improvement, and they can always send us messages to give us more details feedback and discuss details. This is ridiculous, the idea that the client NEEDS private feedback to say what they really think...

bfry1981 · ‎12-27-2018

This place can also and should also be a sounding board for Upwork's chances to improve. But wow dot he Upwork people resist and that possibility!

browersr · ‎12-27-2018

@brian F wrote:
This place can also and should also be a sounding board for Upwork's chances to improve. But wow dot he Upwork people resist and that possibility!

You need to stop this already, Brian. There are a million threads as mentioned with people airing their grievances around JSS as I and others have told you countless times. The forum members here cannot fix this issue but we can help people - who are willing to listen - to start focusing in on things they can control and give them hope that even under this system, they can be successful. You are completely obsessed with JSS to the point that it appears to be dominating your thoughts around Upwork. If anyone tries to give you other thoughts and avenues to focus on, you immediately assume they are the enemy and against you and your ideas. Your concerns have been stated numerous times. Hundreds or thousands have stated concerns over the years just like you. So you can now either choose to adjust and overcome or you can continue to use valuable time and energy flogging the same message. Of course you can choose to take your business elsewhere. It's really up to you.

So here is my parting advice which you can certainly ignore but others may choose to learn from. Do a better job communicating with your clients. Accept that maybe just maybe some of this is on you and do more with your clients to create an atmosphere where the private review yields something closer or matching to the public. This will not always work even with your best efforts, but frankly it should work enough of the time that your JSS isn't ruining your life (again I will point to many people with long histories that maintain a 100% or close rating.) Life isn't fair. Not all clients are fair. Do what is within your power and you can achieve success like so many others have. You have a lot of open jobs. Kick butt with them and your JSS woes will be a thing of the past. Or, spend time here complaining to folks with zero power to change the system. The choice is yours.

colettelewis · ‎12-27-2018

@Scott B + 1000

melaniekhenson · ‎12-27-2018

@Scott B wrote:
@brian F wrote:
This place can also and should also be a sounding board for Upwork's chances to improve. But wow dot he Upwork people resist and that possibility!
You need to stop this already, Brian. There are a million threads as mentioned with people airing their grievances around JSS as I and others have told you countless times. The forum members here cannot fix this issue but we can help people - who are willing to listen - to start focusing in on things they can control and give them hope that even under this system, they can be successful. You are completely obsessed with JSS to the point that it appears to be dominating your thoughts around Upwork. If anyone tries to give you other thoughts and avenues to focus on, you immediately assume they are the enemy and against you and your ideas. Your concerns have been stated numerous times. Hundreds or thousands have stated concerns over the years just like you. So you can now either choose to adjust and overcome or you can continue to use valuable time and energy flogging the same message. Of course you can choose to take your business elsewhere. It's really up to you.

So here is my parting advice which you can certainly ignore but others may choose to learn from. Do a better job communicating with your clients. Accept that maybe just maybe some of this is on you and do more with your clients to create an atmosphere where the private review yields something closer or matching to the public. This will not always work even with your best efforts, but frankly it should work enough of the time that your JSS isn't ruining your life (again I will point to many people with long histories that maintain a 100% or close rating.) Life isn't fair. Not all clients are fair. Do what is within your power and you can achieve success like so many others have. You have a lot of open jobs. Kick butt with them and your JSS woes will be a thing of the past. Or, spend time here complaining to folks with zero power to change the system. The choice is yours.

Wise words. Here's to a great 2019!

versailles · ‎12-27-2018

Scott: +1000

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"Where darkness shines like dazzling light" —William Ashbless

melaniekhenson · ‎12-27-2018

@brian F wrote:
This place can also and should also be a sounding board for Upwork's chances to improve. But wow dot he Upwork people resist and that possibility!

What do you mean, "the Upwork people"? You're an Upwork person too.

browersr · ‎12-26-2018

There are two types of comments I find myself struggling with in this thread. The first the is the notion that those of us providing feedback who are not in the 100% on board camp with the OP are speaking in the ideal and not the reality of the current marketplace. The second is that the system is so screwed up that it's virtually impossible to do any work here and have a high score.

To the first issue, we are all working from the same marketplace. Comments I or others may make about good and bad clients come from the same pool as everyone else. Of course the nature of our work differs so we may not all be looking at the exact same clients but we are all getting our clients from the same UW pool. Consider that some of us may have been on this platform a lot longer or otherwise have more experience and that is the reason we may do a better job with client selection (although this is never guaranteed!) This isn't unfair nor unrealistic, but life.

The second issue makes me wonder how there can be so many freelancers with 100% scores who have a lot of contracts and history and continue to work regularly here. How is this possible with such a punitive system. Look, I am not special. I do believe I do excellent work for my clients and provide top notch communication. I've been on this platform part-time and more recently full-time since 2015. I've maintained 100% JSS through that time. I've had a lot of clients. I continue to have a lot of clients. Do you think magically all of these clients have been great? Do you think that everyone has left a review? Do you think all of my clients are seasoned? The answer to all of these is an emphatic NO. I have never been a paying member of UW either. So how have I (knock on wood at the time of this writing) maintained 100% under the exact same parameters as everyone else? Again, not special. Check the profiles of others on this thread and elsewhere and you will see the same. Sorry to use you here Tonya, but check out her profile and you will see the same long-term numerous clients freelancer who has a 100% JSS. We are NOT the only two, I assure you of that.

Net, everyone is aware of JSS concerns and all of these points have been made thousands of times over the years and guaranteed they will be made thousands of times more from different profile photos. JSS is not great but it also isn't an apocalyptic nightmarish mess. Proof of that is within the profiles of many who find a way to compete on the exact same platform without succumbing to its more draconian features.

kochubei_valeria · ‎12-26-2018

Danny and others,

I would just like to clarify a few points about JSS that came up on this thread:

- All contracts in the last 2 years can potentially be included in JSS. This includes contracts that don't show publicly on the freelancers profile because all money was refunded or no money was paid on them yet or at all. If a contract was closed before the last JSS update (displayed in My Stats,) it'll be included in the current Job Success score. The freelancer can check My Jobs> All Contracts as that page includes all contracts including ones that don't show on the profile.

- Recommended score is calculated and updated differently. It's a lifetime calculation unlike JSS that doesn't consider contracts from more than 2 years ago. Of all the clients who gave feedback the score reflects the number of clients who said they would recommend the freelancer. Recommended score isn't updated at the same time as JSS. So there can be some contracts included in Recommended score but not in JSS and vice versa.

- Contracts without feedback only affect JSS if there is an excessive number of them. That is not the case with Danny's JSS.

Thanks for the discussion and feedback.

~ Valeria

bfry1981 · ‎12-26-2018

Valeria- "This includes contracts that don't show publicly on the freelancers profile because all money was refunded or no money was paid on them yet or at all." Umm so when the previous system offered a freelancer a chance to preserve a higher public rating by giving possible hard-earned money back to a client Upwork retroactively put in place a new system that penalizes them even AFTER they have returned the money. Swell.

"Contracts without feedback only affect JSS if there is an excessive number of them." Define "excessive." There are SO many possible reasons that clients don't leave feedback. Each situation involves different circumstances and different people. Regardless of how many there are, there is generally no way to prove that this has anything to do with the freelancers and this is ultimately the responsibility of the client. That this penalizes freelancers in ANY way is absurd and grossly unfair. I have had a number of strange situations where clients just disappeared, no explanation, and I know for a fact that these are lowering my JSS score and are being included in the overall totals by which my score is calculated. This really is a abomination that must be removed from the calculation.

petra_r · ‎12-26-2018

@brian F wrote:
Umm so when the previous system offered a freelancer a chance to preserve a higher public rating by giving possible hard-earned money back to a client Upwork retroactively put in place a new system that penalizes them even AFTER they have returned the money. Swell.

You do like twisting facts, don't you?

This has not changed.

If a full refund is given a contract vanishes from the freelancer's profile. It still does that. This is not "a new system," - nor was it "retroactively put in place."

tlbp · ‎12-26-2018

@Petra R wrote:
@brian F wrote:
Umm so when the previous system offered a freelancer a chance to preserve a higher public rating by giving possible hard-earned money back to a client Upwork retroactively put in place a new system that penalizes them even AFTER they have returned the money. Swell.
You do like twisting facts, don't you?
This has not changed.
If a full refund is given a contract vanishes from the freelancer's profile. It still does that. This is not "a new system," - nor was it "retroactively put in place."

I believe he is complaining about the JSS system which prevents freelancers from buying their way out of bad performance by paying off the client and hiding the review.

petra_r · ‎12-26-2018

@Tonya P wrote:
@Petra R wrote:
@brian F wrote:
Umm so when the previous system offered a freelancer a chance to preserve a higher public rating by giving possible hard-earned money back to a client Upwork retroactively put in place a new system that penalizes them even AFTER they have returned the money. Swell.
You do like twisting facts, don't you?
This has not changed.
If a full refund is given a contract vanishes from the freelancer's profile. It still does that. This is not "a new system," - nor was it "retroactively put in place."
I believe he is complaining about the JSS system which prevents freelancers from buying their way out of bad performance by paying off the client and hiding the review.

Yeah, but that's not "new."

Remember that bug a couple of weeks ago when all the "dead" (refunded) contracts came back to once again show on people's profiles? It was very enlightening to go and take a look at some of the profiles from people who had previously claimed to have no idea why their JSS is low because all their feedback had been flawless 😉 ...

dannykundzinsh · ‎01-22-2019

Tonya and Petra, DO NOT for a second think this post has anything about "bribing" clients to give good feedback, you have obviously NOT been paying attention! I am insulted to even being suggested as such, complete digrace and disregard of the true issue at hand.
You ladies should be ashamed of yourselves.
I've said it before and will say it again, the JSS is not working in the favor of the freelancer, I won't go into the why's as I've already explained everything there is to explain so there's no point in re beating this dead horse, but I am shocked that you are trying to turn the issue I raised here into a "bribe" the client and just sweep my thread under the carpet of this accusation, simply unbelievable.

722032a2 · ‎03-20-2022

Hey Danny, it seems like you are quite successful on Upwork now which is great to see! Any words of encouragement for a newer freelancer at an 87% JSS who just got their JSS about a month and a half ago? I'm working my butt off to give clients a good experience and luckily am not having a hard time getting work with my current JSS. But it's still discouraging to be somewhat stuck at this JSS. Thanks in advanced!

dannykundzinsh · ‎03-20-2022

My advice would be not to take just any job, check the client and make sure you can do 100% of a good job so the client has no reason to give you any less than 5 stars, always under promise and over deliver, never the other way around.
It also seems like you have a bunch of jobs with no feedback, that is what lowers your score also, upwork's reasoning be that if you do a good job a client should leave you a feedback, so ask for clients to leave feedback, I some times have to do that also, that's how I got to 100%.
Upwork can be tough at first but reading tips online and just educating yourself on how to raise your score will help, you can do this, good luck!

alexandernovikov · ‎03-20-2022

Since a lot time ago, projects with no feedback left do not count against JSS at all. It was a problem but it was solved like, years ago.

If you have a lower JSS, it's because people set you a good public but bad private feedback. Either they are being toxic, or they aren't as happy with your work as they openly state.

Job success score is UNFAIR and should be changed.