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Loitering Clients

bobafett999
Community Guru
Prashant P Member Since: Sep 29, 2015
1 of 39

I addition to Upwork being a Mecca for clients looking for bottom of the barrel talent, it also has become a place when people just post.  They have have no intention of hiring or are looking for freelancers who would work outside of Upwork.  Perhaps it would help Upwork as well as freelancers if Upwork charged them some refundable job posting fee - money would be refunded if they hire or they lose the deposit if they don't.  A filter to weed out loitering clients.

tlsanders
Community Guru
Tiffany S Member Since: Jan 15, 2016
2 of 39

Prashant, this has been discussed at great length. Clients don't want this, successful freelancers don't want it, and Upwork doesn't want it. None of us are interested in driving away good paying clients. Perhaps that seems less important to you, since your post suggests that you are overlooking the large number of good-paying clients on Upwork, but those of us profiting from them (freelancers and Upwork alike) feel pretty strongly about refraining from creating obstacles for them.

bobafett999
Community Guru
Prashant P Member Since: Sep 29, 2015
3 of 39

Perhaps, the space you are working in has good paying clients.  When I look for postings 75% of them are looking for lowest priced workers, want a 600 word blog post for $1!   Here is an example of posting on the site, "This project is for the completion of all 12 sites with a minimum of 3 pages on each Weebly Property. " for a fixed total price of $40 and they looking for most experienced freelancers.  Here is another for you,"WP designer/developer needed - onpage SEO knowledge a must. " - FIXED PRICE: $100.  And one more for you, "Weebly Web Development - Expert level - fixed price $79".

 

Besides what difference does it make if the fee is refunded upon hire - don't you think it will eliminate clutter?

tlsanders
Community Guru
Tiffany S Member Since: Jan 15, 2016
4 of 39

Prashant, I am a writer. I would estimate that 90-95% of the job postings I see are well below the pay rate I would consider. That's not a problem. I ignore those and focus on the 5% or so that I'm interested in. That's the only way anyone succeeds on Upwork.

 

Think for a moment about what you're asking when the client has to make a deposit to post a job, and that deposit is refunded upon hire:

 

-The client is being asked to commit to hiring through Upwork without seeing what type of proposals he receives--if he doesn't find the right freelancer here, he has to choose between forfeiting his deposit and picking an inferior freelancer.

 

-He has to much more thorougly vet the site before deciding whether even to give it a try, since he'll be providing credit card information online before he even knows whether he'll be using the site.

 

-If the client is an employee of a larger company, chances are that he/she will have to request authorization to make the deposit--perhaps even ask a superior to take the time to log in and enter credit card information--without knowing whether he will actually be using the site.

 

As someone who has paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to freelancers throughout my career, I can definitely tell you that if a site required a deposit before posting a job, I'd simply bypass it and go to one of the many other options that do not. Large Upwork clients have said the same in past discussions. 

cupidmedia
Community Guru
Jennifer D Member Since: Feb 15, 2016
5 of 39

@Tiffany S wrote:

Prashant, I am a writer. I would estimate that 90-95% of the job postings I see are well below the pay rate I would consider. That's not a problem. I ignore those and focus on the 5% or so that I'm interested in. That's the only way anyone succeeds on Upwork.

 

Think for a moment about what you're asking when the client has to make a deposit to post a job, and that deposit is refunded upon hire:

 

-The client is being asked to commit to hiring through Upwork without seeing what type of proposals he receives--if he doesn't find the right freelancer here, he has to choose between forfeiting his deposit and picking an inferior freelancer.

 

-He has to much more thorougly vet the site before deciding whether even to give it a try, since he'll be providing credit card information online before he even knows whether he'll be using the site.

 

-If the client is an employee of a larger company, chances are that he/she will have to request authorization to make the deposit--perhaps even ask a superior to take the time to log in and enter credit card information--without knowing whether he will actually be using the site.

 

As someone who has paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to freelancers throughout my career, I can definitely tell you that if a site required a deposit before posting a job, I'd simply bypass it and go to one of the many other options that do not. Large Upwork clients have said the same in past discussions. 


Prashant, I might be a guru but I'm also a client (in fact, I'm the client Petra mentioned with over $100k spent). Tiffany has already excellently articulated the multiple reasons why a client may not want to do what you are asking. This is no different to the suggestions that client must verify their payment method before being able to post jobs. I would never have started on Upwork if I had to pay a deposit first, regardless of if it was refundable or not. I'd never hired a freelancer, wasn't even sure if it was the solution to my problem, and had no particular reason to choose Upwork. If I'd had to pay a deposit before I could post a job, I would have simply gone somehwere else.

You already have tools available to you to root out potential clients who are not serious - you can see their hiring history, their average rate paid, their total spend on the site, if their payment is verified, etc. You can use those tools, which introduce no barriers to the client, to make an educated decision whether to bid on a job or not.

dossy
Community Leader
Ed S Member Since: Oct 27, 2017
6 of 39

I think the best compromise is to charge a nominal fee for a client's first (and only their first) job posting to Upwork.  This will likely cut down on the people who create new accounts to evade account suspensions  and people who have no intention of awarding the job on the site and are looking to find people to work with off-site.

bobafett999
Community Guru
Prashant P Member Since: Sep 29, 2015
7 of 39

That might be a fair compromise an I agree with you about the fake people.  I see same posting word for word, but from different parts of the world.

petra_r
Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
8 of 39

Absolutely not. It has been discussed over and over and over and over, and it is a dreadful idea.

Client after client told us that they would never, ever have posted their first job on Upwork if they had to pay a deposit or jump through any hoops.

 

They would simply have gone to one of the other platforms, none of which do this, for the same reason Upwork doesn't do it: It's stupid.

bobafett999
Community Guru
Prashant P Member Since: Sep 29, 2015
9 of 39

@Petra:  It is not stupid, your comments are stupids.  Get a life, keep discussion civil.

petra_r
Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
10 of 39

@Prashant P wrote:

@Petra:  It is not stupid, your comments are stupids.  Get a life, keep discussion civil.


 OK, let me rephrase it: Let's say it is not in the interest of Upwork, its freelancers or clients to introduce a measure which creates a barrier to entry for paying clients. This is why no other platform does it, because it would reduce revenue and opportunities for freelancers.

 

Personally I have no desire for Upwork to introduce anything that creates barriers to entry for paying clients, which this idea has been proven to do.

 

It would not generate one single Dollar of revenue, and prevent the generation of $$$............. 

 

Better? Bottom line's the same.

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