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Needed algorithm update

emilyholzer
Active Member
Emily H Member Since: Mar 17, 2019
1 of 20

I (like many posting on here) have only five-star reviews. However, after one or two jobs my clients usually stop leaving feedback, probably due to redundancy. This has led to a significant drop in my JSS. I have spoken on the phone to customer support, and they suggest waiting out the client to close the job so that they have to leave a review. This 1) delays freelancers in getting paid for their work and 2) will still reflect negatively on the freelancer if the client simply leaves the contract open but inactive, which is happening to me now. Since the freelancers have no control over the actions of the job posters, I don’t understand why their inaction negatively reflects on the freelancers. Per so many of these posts, it is clear that the algorithm calculating Job Success Score and freelancer quality is misleading and inaccurate. Is anyone working to change, update, or correct this? 

petra_r
Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
2 of 20

Emily H wrote:

I (like many posting on here) have only five-star reviews. However, after one or two jobs my clients usually stop leaving feedback, probably due to redundancy. This has led to a significant drop in my JSS.


No. It has not (led to your JSS drop.) Contracts with money paid do not affect your JSS if closed without feedback or open, unless you have a huge number of them.

 


Emily H wrote:

 

 I have spoken on the phone to customer support, and they suggest waiting out the client to close the job so that they have to leave a review. This 1) delays freelancers in getting paid for their work and 2) will still reflect negatively on the freelancer if the client simply leaves the contract open but inactive, which is happening to me now.


1) No it doesn't delay anything at all.

2) No it doesn't. Open but inactive contracts with money paid on them do not hurt your JSS unless you have too many of them.

 


Emily H wrote:

Since the freelancers have no control over the actions of the job posters, I don’t understand why their inaction negatively reflects on the freelancers.


It doesn't.

 


Emily H wrote:

I (like many posting on here) have only five-star reviews.


Public feedback, yes.

Private feedback..... ? (What is your private feedback average? The "Clients who would recommend" metric on your My stats page?)  I would bet it's pretty close to your JSS?

 

Public feedback is frankly near meaningless. Just about everyone has near all 5 stars.

 

 

emilyholzer
Active Member
Emily H Member Since: Mar 17, 2019
3 of 20

So I don't have a "huge" number of contracts without feedback, but the woman I spoke with said it was roughly 38% and led me to believe that this was what was causing my JSS drop. This conclusively would mean that the inaction of job posters does indeed reflect negatively on the freelancers. Additionally, since my contracts are made almost entirely of repeat clients, I feel confident that they would not ding me on recommendations. 

petra_r
Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
4 of 20

Emily wrote:

, I feel confident that they would not ding me on recommendations. 


That's nice... So: Again: What is your private feedback average? (The "Clients who would recommend" metric on your My stats page?)

 

That is the rating left by the clients who did leave feedback and it is not just the "reccommendation" but a set of criteria.

 


the woman I spoke with said it was roughly 38% and led me to believe that this was what was causing my JSS drop

about 38% of the grand total of your contracts don't have feedback (yet.) That is true. But of those, 2 are still active, so don't do any harm at all.

 

If the number of "no feedback" contracts worries you, don't close contracts yourself in future, let your client(s) do it, that way you are guaranteed feedback.

 

emilyholzer
Active Member
Emily H Member Since: Mar 17, 2019
5 of 20

Is this to suggest that these clients would consistently request work from me but also suggest that my work is not of a quality to be recommended? However, they are not recommending me in the sense that they have stopped leaving reviews, which again would be a reflection of the inaction of a job poster negatively reflecting on a freelancer. The fact that this is to any extent embedded in the JSS algorithm alone presents a problem that takes agency and consideration away from freelancers.

 

I am simply communicating to this forum what the Upwork Support confirmed of my own knowledge of the situation. I don't find this helpful, especially as many of the points I am making here are being ignored. 

petra_r
Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
6 of 20

Emily H wrote:

However, they are not recommending me in the sense that they have stopped leaving reviews, which again would be a reflection of the inaction of a job poster negatively reflecting on a freelancer


Private feedback only includes the actual rating of those clients who did leave feedback. It does not include those who left no feedback.

 

Again: What is your private feedback average? Roughly in line with your JSS or not?

emilyholzer
Active Member
Emily H Member Since: Mar 17, 2019
7 of 20

In fact, my recommended stat was 100% recommended when my JSS lowered. I brought this to the attention of customer support, who informed me that it was the lack of feedback that brought on the lowering of my JSS. As you can imagine, this is why I am frustrated by the fact that the inaction of job posters negatively reflects on freelancers. Per my initial question, is this something Upwork is amending? 

petra_r
Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
8 of 20

Emily H wrote:

In fact, my recommended stat was 100% recommended when my JSS lowered.


That is because that metric only updates every x number of contracts. (no idea what the exact number is) to avoid people guessing which contract had the poor private feedback.

 

So, in other words: Your private feedback is roughly in line with your JSS. (considering how determined you are to avoid the question)

 


Emily H wrote:

I am frustrated by the fact that the inaction of job posters negatively reflects on freelancers.


It doesn't, unless there is an excessive number.

Your JSS and your private feedback rating are more or less in line. That alone should give you a super strong hint that inaction is not what has lowered your JSS.

 

emilyholzer
Active Member
Emily H Member Since: Mar 17, 2019
9 of 20

I truly do not understand what I am not making clear? Here I have attached my initial inquiry to Customer Support (since you are clearly not accepting what I am saying now) and the response I received verifying that it is, in fact, the client inaction causing my lower JSS. With a lower JSS, it is hard to find more work to offset the low response rate from my repeat clients. Again, this is why I am frustrated that the inaction of the job posters reflects negatively on the freelancers and that the algorithm does not consider the fact that repeat clients are less likely to continue to leave feedback week after week. Speaking of being determined to avoid questions, I am reaching out to the forum to see if this is something that is being considered/amended/updated?

petra_r
Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
10 of 20

 


Again. The reason why your JSS dropped before your Clients who would recommend percentage did is because it is NOT updated after every contract. So whatever contract(s) initially made your JSS plummet did not immediately make the metric on your My Stats page drop. That is why it stayed (originally) at 100% until the next time it was recalculated.

 

If your private feedback percentage is the same or lower than your JSS, that alone proves to you where the reason for your JSS lies, and that it isn't contracts without feedback. With a private feedback percentage in the 80s clients have marked you down in private feedback. There is no talking around that.

 

If a bucket of green paint falls over and makes a green stain, there is no point claiming that a closed bucket of red paint on a nearby table made the stain.

 


Emily H wrote:

Speaking of being determined to avoid questions, I am reaching out to the forum to see if this is something that is being considered/amended/updated?


They are constantly refining it, it is a lot less severe than it was originally.

 

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