Problem with a client

Tatjana V · ‎09-15-2021

Hi all,

I am new to the Upwork and I am looking for some help, please.

I got a contract from the client after his request to lower my hourly rate and started working. I am new to the platform and I forgot to check my work diary. Client sent me the brief but refused to have a call with me in order to explain me the brief, since it was a bit unclear and I continued working with what I have. I spent 7h working and the client did not allow Manual time. After sending 1 draft solution client was furious and unprofessional because I didn't understand him and his brief, he threaten that he will finish the contract if this is my design style. I sent him request for manual time and he refused. All the communication is in the Upwork chat, including my design solution. Can I get paid for the work I did? Can someone please explain me what I should have done?

Thank you so much!

Best Tatjana

Preston H · ‎09-15-2021

Tatjana:

Relax.

This client didn't love your work.

It happens.

Not every client/freelancer combination works out.

Don't worry about it!

This is an hourly contract.

An hourly contract means that you get paid for the time that you logged.

There is no checkbox that clients click indicating that they "loved your work."

You logged an hour of time, you get paid for an hour of work.

Simple.

Upwork is not going to look at your chat logs and referee a disagreement between you and the client. There's no need for that.

If a client doesn't want to allow manual time, he doesn't have to. That's his choice.

If you don't want to work for a client, you don't have to. It's your choice.

If a client says he doesn't allow manual time, you can choose not to work for that client.

Let me tell you about Jane.

Jane worked for a client on an hourly contract.

The client claimed that he hated Jane's work.

The client tried to avoid paying Jane for her work.

But Jane had followed the rules of Upwork Payment Protection.

So even though the client tried to dispute Jane's hours, Upwork rejected the client's request, and Jane was paid for all of the time she worked on the project.

Tatjana:
I have povided you with information in response to the questions and concerns in your post. If you still have any questions, feel free to ask your questions here. We want you to fully understand how the platform works so you can move forward with confidence.

Petra R · ‎09-15-2021

Preston H wrote:
Tatjana:
Relax.

This client didn't love your work.
It happens.
Not every client/freelancer combination works out.
Don't worry about it!

This is an hourly contract.
An hourly contract means that you get paid for the time that you logged.

There is no checkbox that clients click indicating that they "loved your work."

You logged an hour of time, you get paid for an hour of work.
Simple.

Upwork is not going to look at your chat logs and referee a disagreement between you and the client. There's no need for that.

If a client doesn't want to allow manual time, he doesn't have to. That's his choice.
If you don't want to work for a client, you don't have to. It's your choice.
If a client says he doesn't allow manual time, you can choose not to work for that client.

Let me tell you about Jane.
Jane worked for a client on an hourly contract.
The client claimed that he hated Jane's work.
The client tried to avoid paying Jane for her work.
But Jane had followed the rules of Upwork Payment Protection.
So even though the client tried to dispute Jane's hours, Upwork rejected the client's request, and Jane was paid for all of the time she worked on the project.

Tatjana:
I have povided you with information in response to the questions and concerns in your post. If you still have any questions, feel free to ask your questions here. We want you to fully understand how the platform works so you can move forward with confidence.

Preston, if the OP had tracked her time, she obviously wouldn't be asking the client for manual time so this entire thing is a moot point or actually mocking the OP for not having tracked the time....

Preston H · ‎09-15-2021

re: "if the OP had tracked her time, she obviously wouldn't be asking the client for manual time so this entire thing is a moot point or actually mocking the OP for not having tracked the time"

Nobody was mocking the original poster. I want her to succeed as she moves forward in using the platform.

I was providing accurate information about how these things work.

The original post did not specifically state whether or not any time was logged using the desktop time-tracker. I wasn't making an assumption about that one way or the other.

Tatjana V · ‎09-15-2021

so I should close this contract on my own and move on ?

Petra R · ‎09-15-2021

Tatjana V wrote:
so I should close this contract on my own and move on ?

You might as well. At least if you close the contract, the client might at least not leave poor feedback.

In future, use the tracker.

Tatjana V · ‎09-15-2021

Hi Petra who is OP ? thank you

Preston H · ‎09-15-2021

re: "who is OP?"

OP = "original poster"

That is you (in this thread).

Tatjana V · ‎09-15-2021

Thank you Preston

Martina P · ‎09-15-2021

1. You should not have decreased your hourly rate.

2. You should not have accepted an offer before having everything you need to start working.

The most important thing to learn in freelancing is when to say no. (Before hire)

3. You should never agree to manual hours. Always use the tracker.

You will probably not get paid, but you learned a valuable lesson.

Preston H · ‎09-15-2021

Let me tell you about another freelancer:

Frank started working for a client.

The client claimed that he hated Frank's work.

Frank thought to himself:

"I am an experienced, talented professional. There are lots of clients out there who would benefit from and appreciate my work. If this client doesn't LOVE my work, then I don't want to work for her."

Frank sent a message to the client:

"Geraldine: Thank you for the opportunity to work on this project. It is clear that the work I do is not what you are looking for. I am going to close the contract now and wish you well in finding a freelancer who is a good fit for this project."

Then Frank closed the contract.

Tatjana V · ‎09-15-2021

Hi Martine thank you so much

I agree with you at every point

3. You should never agree to manual hours. Always use the tracker. - I remember I used this tracker option for another client and it worked perfectly, I was suprised when I realised I cant track my time with this new client.

Do you maybe know how to check manual hours for my future new contracts, where I can see this info?

Thank you

Petra R · ‎09-15-2021

Tatjana V wrote:
I was suprised when I realised I cant track my time with this new client.

You could have tracked the time. Using the tracker. While doing the work.

Do not use manual time unless you know a client well and trust them.

Tatjana V · ‎09-15-2021

Thank you so much Petra, this may sound super newbee but how I can track my time, where is this tracker I can t find it, in work diary or in TO DOs?

Petra R · ‎09-15-2021

Tatjana V wrote:
Thank you so much Petra, this may sound super newbee but how I can track my time, where is this tracker I can t find it, in work diary or in TO DOs?

https://www.upwork.com/ab/downloads/

You need to download the app and install it.

Please AVOID manual time even if it is enabled (it is enabled by default, so a contract that has it disabled is always manually disabled, and the client must have really, REALLY objected to manual time or they wouldn't have gone to the trouble of disabling it).

Martina P · ‎09-15-2021

Tatjana V wrote:
Hi Martine thank you so much
I agree with you at every point
3. You should never agree to manual hours. Always use the tracker. - I remember I used this tracker option for another client and it worked perfectly, I was suprised when I realised I cant track my time with this new client.
Do you maybe know how to check manual hours for my future new contracts, where I can see this info?
Thank you

Not sure what you mean. A client can enable manual hours on a contract if he chooses, but as a freelancer, you should not agree to that option since they are not payment-protected. They can be used in special circumstances with a long-term client, or when you tracked hours on the wrong contract, but should not be the norm. If you use the tracker, record automatic screenshots and add memos, you are payment-protected.

Are you saying this was a fixed-price contract?

Edit: The tracker is an app you download, find it somewhere in the help section.

Preston H · ‎09-15-2021

re: "Do you maybe know how to check manual hours for my future new contracts, where I can see this info?"

For a CURRENT contract, you can check here:

Upwork -> My Jobs -> [click on name of contract] -> Terms & Settings

Tonya P · ‎09-15-2021

Tatjana V wrote:
Hi all,
I am new to the Upwork and I am looking for some help, please.

I got a contract from the client after his request to lower my hourly rate and started working. I am new to the platform and I forgot to check my work diary. Client sent me the brief but refused to have a call with me in order to explain me the brief, since it was a bit unclear and I continued working with what I have. I spent 7h working and the client did not allow Manual time. After sending 1 draft solution client was furious and unprofessional because I didn't understand him and his brief, he threaten that he will finish the contract if this is my design style. I sent him request for manual time and he refused. All the communication is in the Upwork chat, including my design solution. Can I get paid for the work I did? Can someone please explain me what I should have done?
Thank you so much!
Best Tatjana

1. Can you get paid?
If you have an hourly contract and do not use the time tracker to record your time along with relevant memos and the client refuses to pay for your manual hours, you will not get paid.
What could you have done different?
1. Be slower to accept contracts. Ask more questions and make sure you undestand how the client will work with you before you accept the offer to work with them. View the brief and make sure you understand it before saying yes.
2. Be particularly cautious when agreeing to lower your normal hourly rate. A client who wants a lower rate is either very price sensitive and may complain aobut the total cost when the work is completed or doesn't respect your skills enough to pay your asking price. Sometimes both.

Preston H · ‎09-15-2021

re: "Be particularly cautious when agreeing to lower your normal hourly rate."

Obviously I can't speak for everyone... But I think for most of us who are experienced Upwork users, it's a hard "no" on that question.

On rare occasions I have been asked about lowering my rate. These days I typically just ignore the question.

But a better way to address such a question is probably to tell the client:

"Diane, Thank you for talking to me about your project. It looks like I won't be able to work on this, but I wish you well in finding other freelancers for your team."

Christine A · ‎09-15-2021

Preston H wrote:
re: "Be particularly cautious when agreeing to lower your normal hourly rate."

Obvioiusly I can't speak for everyone... But I think for most of us who are experienced Upwork users, it's hard "no" on that question.

I completely agree. Not sure why anyone would ever lower their rate unless it's to work for a charity. It's like you're saying, "The rate listed in my profile is just wishful thinking - I'm not really worth that much."