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6cb33a67
Community Member

Proposals Going Into A Category Called "OTHER PROPOSALS"

It looks like as if profile is "shadow banned" 

When I submit a proposal it goes to the very bottom in a separate tab called Other Proposals. Even though I'm qualified for the job it says im not relevant. Whereas someone who is totally not relevant to the job post is not in this tab. 

This can probably explain why I haven't had any work on Upwork for the last couple of months. 

Has anybody else had this problem? 

 

**Edited for Community Guidelines**

22 REPLIES 22
25005175
Community Member

How did you come by this screenshot?

Jonathan,

 

It requires a Client account.

That doesn't explain how he was able to see another client's job posting responses. 

Exactly: Like I asked - either he hacked into somebody else's client account OR he created a job as a 'client' and 'applied' to it himself as a freelancer to see where is proposal would end up, which is a TOS violation to create 'fake' jobs for 'testing' purposes.  I'm aware that you can have both a freelancer and a client account, but having a client account does not allow you to see/access the inboxes of other clients.

Lisa,

 

It means that a Client gave him the screenshot.

Freelancers frequently create client accounts and post fake jobs so that they can see how their proposal looks and/or to spy on their competition. I've done over 400 jobs on Upwork and not once has a real client sent me a screenshot just to say, "oh look, your proposal was buried under the 'other' link."

I applied for a job and turned out to be by a old high school friend who recognized my name and profile picture and texted me that screenshot.

I do have a client account too but I've never applied to my own listings. But, heck I might now just to check where my proposals are going.

ericaandrews
Community Member

Yeah, I'd also like to know how you are able to see the client's 'queue' or inbox of proposals received to somehow 'know' that you are ending up in an 'Other' tab.  Did you hack into somebody's account or create your own job as a 'client' and apply to it?  Seems odd for you to have this type of 'insight' into the client's inbox like this.

 

Also, if you read the note under 'Other' it explains exactly why your proposal may have ended up there:  Client's can put in really specific criteria for the types of freelancers they need in their job posts - location, skills, languagues and fluency, time zones, etc , and your profile, no matter how well-written, is never going to be a exact 'match' for every job you submit to.   It's not 'shadow banning', it's just the system trying to show the client the profiles that most closely match their job requirements.  If you think that's bad,  'boosted' proposals get put on 'top' regardless of how poorly qualified the freelancer is:  Now, that's some real 'shadow banning' of qualified freelancers

williamtcooper
Community Member

Brandin,

 

Thanks for the information! I have not seen that on my Client side before.

ericaandrews
Community Member

What's even more interesting is one proposal in that screenshot  being a freelancer with ZERO dollars earned but somehow having a 'Rising Talent' badge, especially considering "Complete projects on time and as promised to clients"  is one of the criteria for getting a Rising Talent badge.  (https://support.upwork.com/hc/en-us/articles/211063228-Rising-Talent)

 

If a freelancer hasn't earned any money, that means they haven't 'completed' any projects, so how are they being granted a 'Rising Talent' badge by Upwork with no jobs/projects completed? I've never heard of a freelancer 'successfully' completing an UW project that results in them earning no money.  I've seen stuff like this pretty often and it always makes me wonder if there are some people simply being 'given' badges by people they know at Upwork (as a 'hookup')  or buying them, versus actually earning one.   Looks very fishy

 

 

 

 

It could be they just recently earned enough to become Rising Talent, but their profile won't be updated with the amount until after this work week ends.  

I doubt it because the badges, JSS scores, and amount earned all update at the same time.  The money is not 'earned' until the work week ends and it clears the 'security' holding period. If you haven't earned a single penny yet, then you certainly haven't 'completed' anything.  However, I have actually done 'searches' in the 'Talent' area  and have come across at least a couple of freelancers that had a 'Rising Talent' badge and NO past or current jobs on their profile. "Work History" was completely empty (which means they also had zero earnings), but they had a 'badge' already. So, explain that.  That's not a 'glitch'. That's just something shady going on.

As with the thread mentioned, a lot of people are very confused about the rising talent. Apparently, you can make up anything you want and call yourself an expert, lie about education, history, jobs, etc. and somehow the program says you're a great freelancer. Then the poor client thinks it means the freelancer has a skill and gets ripped off, never to return and taking their money with them.

CJ, 

 

You are correct that a proposal may show under Other Proposals section if it doesn't meet some of the preferences the client defined on their job. The client will still be able to access all proposals sent for their job, shortlist, accept or decline them.

 

I'd like to make a correction to your comment here:

 


CJ A wrote:

What's even more interesting is one proposal in that screenshot  being a freelancer with ZERO dollars earned but somehow having a 'Rising Talent' badge, especially considering "Complete projects on time and as promised to clients"  is one of the criteria for getting a Rising Talent badge.  (https://support.upwork.com/hc/en-us/articles/211063228-Rising-Talent)

 

If a freelancer hasn't earned any money, that means they haven't 'completed' any projects, so how are they being granted a 'Rising Talent' badge by Upwork with no jobs/projects completed? I've never heard of a freelancer 'successfully' completing an UW project that results in them earning no money.  I've seen stuff like this pretty often and it always makes me wonder if there are some people simply being 'given' badges by people they know at Upwork (as a 'hookup')  or buying them, versus actually earning one.   Looks very fishy


 

Freelancers can get Rising Talent badge before they complete any contracts on Upwork. Please see this passage in the help article you linked in your comment. By design freelancer with $0 earned can have the Rising Talent badge. This badge cannot be given manually by an Upwork team member at a user's request. When the freelancer completes their first few jobs before they get their JSS, they need to complete them successfully in order to maintain their Rising Talent status.

~ Valeria
Upwork

Valeria, does this also occur if a freelancer applies to their own job post?


Jonathan L wrote:

Valeria, does this also occur if a freelancer applies to their own job post?


Jonathan, it is not possible for the freelancer to apply to their own job posted from the client context on the same account. But freelancers and clients may talk to each other and may share their experience with each other. That happens.

 

I prefer not to assume anything based on the limited information shared publicly on the Community thread. I discourage other members from making assumptions and accusations based only on information available publicly in the Community as well. 

~ Valeria
Upwork

Then your article is making a false/misleading statement:

 

"To qualify for a Rising Talent badge, you must:"

Complete projects on time and as promised to clients

 

then, later....

 

"Even professionals who have yet to complete any Upwork projects can become Rising Talent if they have skills that are in demand."

 

Both cannot be true at the same time: A requirement to complete projects to get a badge and eligibility for a badge without completing any projects cannot logically co-exist.

 

That's like saying: "To get a driver's license, you must prove proficiency in operating a car.  However, if you can't operate a car, you might be eligible for a driver's license anyway".   That doesn't make any sense

 

Something can't be both a requirement and not a requirement at the same time. Something is either a requirement, or it isn't.

 

It is also unfairness:  some freelancers have to PROVE themselves on the platform, and others don't, not to mention how misleading it is for the clients

 

Basically the criteria should be posted as : Upwork issues badges to whovever it sees fits,  whenever it sees fit. 

 

Now, that would be more honest and accurate.

CJ,

Even new users who have yet to complete any Upwork projects can become Rising Talent. Having contracts isn't required. However, if they do get contracts, they need to complete them successfully, on time and as promised to clients in order to maintain and continue to qualify for the badge.

To use your metaphor (very loosely though), you must prove proficiency in operating a car in order to get a license, however you may lose your license if you get pulled over for serious enough offence to get it revoked. 

~ Valeria
Upwork

You just CONFIRMED the unfairness I mentioned.  You basically said that SOME people need to PROVE they can drive before they get a license, and then based on Upwork's only personal feels, ANOTHER group is immediately HANDED a license, with NO proof they can drive, and then that license "might" be taken away later if they crash their car into a telephone pole.  

 

Again: Unfair and ridiculous and it is also FALSE adverstisement as it relates to what clients EXPECT from rising talent.

 

This page explains the badge as follows:

'To become a Rising Talent, you must have great potential based on a strong background in your field(s) and early success with your Upwork clients."

https://support.upwork.com/hc/en-us/articles/360049702614-Upwork-s-Talent-Badges

 

No freelancer can claim "early success" with "Upwork clients" if that have had NO projects, NO jobs, and NO clients on Upwork, and you most certainly can't make the assumption that  the freelancer had 'early success' on  the same they create their account simply because they filled some 'skills' fields you happen to like that are 'in demand'.  People can 'claim' anything on a profile, that doesn't mean they can actually DO the work.  The clients see the description of rising talent and ASSUME that badge was issued  based on actual merit and PERFORMANCE on the platform, not expected or 'hoped for' future performance.  The fact that some person or algorithm at Upwork is just 'handing out' the badge automatically without seeing the freelancer's PERFORMANCE on the platform is misleading to the CLIENT and unfair to the freelancers in other skill sets that have to jump through an endless, 'undisclosed' number of 'hoops' and still may never get the badge.   The entire system should be criteria and requirements driven and MERIT based, based on performance on the platform.  Not some type of raffle or lottery where somebody just 'spins' the wheel and badges 'fly out' in random directions.   When Upwork hands out one those badges, they are basically VOUCHING for that freelancer's capabilities:  Why would you do that, and risk your own company reputation, when you haven't seen their actual PERFORMANCE on the platform?

 

 

Again: Something is either a REQUIREMENT or it is NOT.  When it is a 'requirement' for some people and not others, its called unfairness.  Plain and simple. Requirements that are not true requirements for all are called bias and discrimination, and facts that 'evolve' based on time/situation/audience are called falsehoods

CJ, this thread went pretty in-depth into the Rising Talent badge. TL;DR: evidence indicates that it is either randomly assigned at account creation or that there is an unpublished criteria that can only be met during account creation.Alas! Raising Talent badge. 

I know it's pretty much 'unpublished' criteria and something shady going on behind the scenes, just like the JSS scores UW 'can't disclose' the formula for.  That's exactly what I'm saying: The page makes it LOOK like people can actually 'earn' the badge, but the system is just 'handing out' badges to people that don't meet the criteria they have listed on the FAQ page. Nobody should be given a 'rising talent' badge immediately upon account creation - without any experience of any kind on the platform.  That defeats the purposes of the freelancers that actually are working hard to EARN the badge. I doubt it is 'randomly' given during account creation:  More like somebody has a 'friend' at Upwork that 'upgrades' their account immediately with a 'hook up'.  I think UW could eliminate lots of concern about 'shady dealings' like this by simply being more honest and transparent about these types of things

CJ, 

Both, the help article you shared in your earlier post on this thread and the solution on the thread Jonathan linked confirm that new freelancer who have yet to complete any Upwork projects can become Rising Talent. Having completed contracts isn't required. We do share that publicly. 
I'd also like to reiterate that this badge cannot be given manually by an Upwork team member at a user's request.

~ Valeria
Upwork
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