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ยป Forums ยป Freelancers ยป Re: Protection for payment issues?
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lalucoo
Community Member

Protection for payment issues?

Hi there, Im new to the site. I didn't understand the notice UpWork sent warning about project work vs milestone work. If I agree to do something for someone on a project basis, am I not protected if they back out? 

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25005175
Community Member

You get good faith money when they fund a milestone - they at least have the capability to pay. Upwork will subsidize arbitration for you if your client tries to not pay you. Upwork will attempt to combat any chargeback attempts by the client on your behalf, with mixed results (failure = you pay back money to Upwork).

 

If you want actual protection, then only do hourly jobs and follow the time tracking rules for Hourly Protection.

 

The note about Project vs Milestone is a reminder that you have to setup milestones to get paid as you progress through the project, and that you should only work on the currently funded milestone - regardless of how much is in escrow. If you elect to do a lump-sum payment at the end of the project (i.e. no milestones), be prepared to not get paid until the project is done, revision requests are complete, and the Client releases the payment to you (plus some days for security holds).

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prestonhunter
Community Member

I don't work for Upwork. This is my OPINION:

"Protection" is illusory.

 

Upwork does not guarantee "protection."

 

The best way to protect yourself:

Start with a relatively small task.

A milestone that can be done in two hours or less.


If you do the work and then the client pays you as expected, then you can agree to another, larger task.

As the client continues to pay you as expected, you will build trust in the client.


Other than that? No, I don't think you should feel protected AT ALL by Upwork itself.

Does Upwork offer protection?

 

QUESTION: For example, if I agree to a $2000 fixed-price project, and then work really hard for a couple of weeks on this project, does Upwork protect me? Am I guaranteed to get paid?

 

ANSWER: It would be very foolish to work so hard for somebody you don't know. You have no way of knowing that the client will actually release payment to you. You have know of knowing that you will ever receive the money. Upwork's escrow does NOT MEAN that you will get paid if you do the work. You should understand what it really means.

25005175
Community Member

You get good faith money when they fund a milestone - they at least have the capability to pay. Upwork will subsidize arbitration for you if your client tries to not pay you. Upwork will attempt to combat any chargeback attempts by the client on your behalf, with mixed results (failure = you pay back money to Upwork).

 

If you want actual protection, then only do hourly jobs and follow the time tracking rules for Hourly Protection.

 

The note about Project vs Milestone is a reminder that you have to setup milestones to get paid as you progress through the project, and that you should only work on the currently funded milestone - regardless of how much is in escrow. If you elect to do a lump-sum payment at the end of the project (i.e. no milestones), be prepared to not get paid until the project is done, revision requests are complete, and the Client releases the payment to you (plus some days for security holds).

lysis10
Community Member


Kara J wrote:

Hi there, Im new to the site. I didn't understand the notice UpWork sent warning about project work vs milestone work. If I agree to do something for someone on a project basis, am I not protected if they back out? 


Not really. The only thing you know with escrow is that a card got charged an amount. You know nothing else. If they back out, you agree to go into mediation if you want any money.

lalucoo
Community Member

I see, thank you everyone for clarifying that's super helpful.

As an aside: I saw a job posting requesting to see what our idea was for their illustration need before they choose someone but their reference images are exact request examples. I think they're collecting samples for free? Am I being paranoid or is this request meant to be a milestone? Trying to learn to watch out for cons lol

lysis10
Community Member


Kara J wrote:

I see, thank you everyone for clarifying that's super helpful.

As an aside: I saw a job posting requesting to see what our idea was for their illustration need before they choose someone but their reference images are exact request examples. I think they're collecting samples for free? Am I being paranoid or is this request meant to be a milestone? Trying to learn to watch out for cons lol


Not being paranoid. Some people do indeed operate this way. Also, as an aside, Upwork IDs you so you should change your picture to be a picture of you or you will fail it.

lalucoo
Community Member

oh ๐Ÿ˜• okay, much appreciated!

25005175
Community Member

There are also jobs posts in which the clients request detailed feedback and plans during the interview stage. Others where they request you to download apps, create an account, or input your information on a spreadsheet as a requirement for being interviewed.

 

To learn about cons, check out these:

Scammers Know How To Get Money Transferred TO Them 

Top Red Flags for Scams: From Community Member Wes C 

https://support.upwork.com/hc/en-us/articles/1500007578942-What-kind-of-jobs-aren-t-allowed-on-Upwor...

lalucoo
Community Member

Ah **bleep**. Okay! Thanks for linking me. I'm glad I asked. I asked a friend about the "connects" micro currency and they said it was probably a way for the platform to filter out spam. I guess it helps a little but not for everything. I'll read through the other articles. 

25005175
Community Member

I asked a friend about the "connects" micro currency and they said it was probably a way for the platform to filter out spam. I guess it helps a little but not for everything.

No, if they were for filtering out spam, then they completely failed. But that's not their purpose. Connects are a revenue stream. Upwork is not alone in using that approach.

Before you apply for a job, you need to educate yourself about how to do business on Upwork. Start with the Terms of Service and then read everything on the site. Because you are new, you are a target for scammers. Your profile is non-existent. Learn how the platform functions before you get scammed. There are numerous resources you need to use before applying for a job.


Jeanne H wrote:

Before you apply for a job, you need to educate yourself about how to do business on Upwork. Start with the Terms of Service and then read everything on the site. Because you are new, you are a target for scammers. Your profile is non-existent. Learn how the platform functions before you get scammed. There are numerous resources you need to use before applying for a job.


Are there resources you could link me? Aside from maybe trying to Google the company or project I'm just going by the innate bs meter. I was hoping this place had less of that ๐Ÿค” I'll start with the links someone else sent. Appreciate the guidance ๐Ÿ™๐Ÿป

25005175
Community Member



Aside from maybe trying to Google the company or project I'm just going by the innate bs meter.


That's pretty much all you have. Clients have reviews on their past jobs, but those are only worthwhile evidence if those freelancers weren't naive enough to leave good feedback on a bad client or were themselves bad freelancers.

 

All you can do is calibrate that "innate bs" meter with experience. You can either go through that long, hard process yourself OR learn from others. Another resource that I didn't think about until just now is Crazy Job Postings and its predecessors - both humorous and enlightening.

There's no point in Googling anyone, because scammers obviously aren't going to give you their real names; they find names of real people and legit companies on the Internet and pretend to be them. 

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