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sara14110113
Community Member

Refund Request by a Client {I have delivered more than what he paid-for}

Hello everyone, I am Sara. I am glad to have this forum to discuss...I am in an extremely overwhelming situation right now and I would be highly grateful if you can take some time and read through the details and advise on where I stand.....

 

It's the first of its kind conflict with a client since I joined upwork.

 

I ended a contract with a client recently, as he refused payment for a batch of 50 articles. I have already delivered him a total of 100 articles (of 1800 words each), and he paid me $355 (although, the agreed amount was $17.5 per article but he formulated the contracted to pay a bare minimum of $350 only for each batch of 50 articles every week, and to pay the full amount at the end of contract in week-8 - as it was a project of 400 articles). He also had clauses about paying a penalty of $50 per article per day for late (this penalty was not discussed when he was discussing terms of the contract with me, but when he actually sent me the offer he added that and I was too focused on the $7000 total budget at that time that I misinterpreted the penalty clause to be $50 per day for the entire batch of 50 articles). 

 

In week-1 I realized that 50 articles of 1800 words in 7 days was more than I could possibly manage. It involved a lot of work (preliminary keyword research, factual details on psychopathology, helpful resources from amazon, referencing, adding images etc). So before the deadline of week-1, I approached the client and requested an extension to which he agreed. I also requested a penalty waiver and he agreed. The penalty waiver was discussed and agreed upon for the entire contract as well. 

 

So I delivered him the work and he released $5 for week-1 (50 articles). 

I didn't notice it at the time. 

I delivered him week-2, (another 50 articles) and noticed the $5 payment status, so I discussed it with him and said that I will not work any further if he doesn't pay me for the work. He paid me $350 from week-2 milestone and reassured that $5 was not intended to be the only payment. 

 

=== so until that time the total payments from client were $5+$350 (instead of $350+$350) ====

 

I started working on week-3, but I request him the payment from another milestone (i.e. of $350) before I could send him another 50 articles. On this the conversation trailed off and got stringent. He refused me any payment at all and said that week-1 work was late so he does not owe me anything. 

I sent him proof of week-3 work (as he asked), and waited for him to pay me for the previous $345 but he didn't and declined any payments and said that I can end the contract if I will. During this conversation he ate at my self-esteem...and I felt absolutely low and very controlled....

 

So, I ended the contract and left him honest feedback (that was negative and detailed the whole situation). He ridiculed me on upwork messages by saying that how would I be getting work on upwork with my current success rate that would decline further after he leaves a negative feedback. 

 

Later on, someone approaches me (a third person - who was presumably his client) and tells me that if I revert my negative feedback on upwork profile of that person, they can pay me for what is the due remaining amount. I told them that the due amount was $1395 (by 17.5 per article) but $355 would also be okay as per the weekly minimal payment agreed. They gave me an impression of being okay with this and hasted me to quickly change the feedback as they are on a "deadline". So I reverted the feedback, in the light of presumable resolution. But as soon as I reverted my feedback on the upwork profile, that third person asked me to deliver another 50 articles (from week-3 work), I told them that first I need to be paid for the previous 100 articles but they plainly rejected any further payment for those, telling me that they don't owe me any payment because I was late in delivering work for week-1. I tried to reason with them but of no use, they told me that they are okay with it and they would leave things as it is then.

 

So,,,I reverted my original feedback on upwork profile. 

 

Now, the person who actually hired me on upwork - has sent a REFUND request for the $355 he paid me. 

 

How do I owe him any money? 

They have already kept a total of 80% of full payment (at $17.5 per article for 100 articles) and only paid me $355 for 100 articles. 

 

This client is tailing me...he seems to be trying to intimidate me...it feels so much like bullying...

 

After his refund request, I contacted him over at upwork asking him why did he request a refund and he is asking me to send the week-3 work (without any further payments), revert the feedback and then he cancels refund request. 

 

He says that "his client" has hired debt collectors who have access to India as well, and can come and retrieve their money. He also says that I should help him because he paid those $355 from "his pocket because I asked for payment for that work and was crying" (I was crying, as I sent him an audio to clarify the situation and asked for payment after delivering a 100 articles, to which he sent $350 - the only payment). 

 

I told him I don't have money...

For those 100 articles, I only worked on his project for the 2.5 weeks and wasn't able to do anything else, that includes sleeping properly...Obviously I needed money so I decided to invest time and energy....

I know I got late in delivering week-1 but I approached him with a request for deadline extension and penalty waiver well in-time - to which he agreed. 

 

What should I do now?

Does upwork penalizes me in this context?

Would I be forced to refund? I don't have any funds in my account so far, and a refund would mean that I would be paying this client by working on other projects in future............

 

That's really depressing....and I am having a huge amount of anxiety and panic....

 

Please help....

ACCEPTED SOLUTION


Sara N wrote:

Thank you so much for this Jennifer! I really appreciate that you took the time to read my whole story 🙂 

 

And I didn't know about the DMCA at all. So, would it be safe for me to pursue payment for those articles that he didn't pay? He is at the moment kind of threatening me (verbal intimidation or indirect intimidation) to refund him or revert the feedback and send him more work. 


I know it is hard, but you should just ignore him. You do not own him anything. He did not paid you the agreed rate and now wants money back? 
He probably accepted a job and then farmed it out to get it done as cheap as possible (for free). He is now panicing because he misses his deadline, but that is not your problem. Change your feedback to an honest feedback (you can change as often as you like for 14 days once he allowed you to change it).

Since you still own the work he did not pay for, you can try to sell it to another client or elsewhere. It is yours to use. Just make a list with the articles that where paid so you not use them accidently. If you want to be nice, you can share the list with him and inform him that you own the copyright to all the other artices. If your client (or his) uses any of the other articles, have them taken down. You cannot do that if you received the full payment.

View solution in original post

8 REPLIES 8
sara14110113
Community Member

**Edited for Community Guidelines**

A friend advised me to tell the client a certain, statement and here's an update. Please view and share your advise...I would be grateful for all the help 

**Edited for Community Guidelines**

jr-translation
Community Member


Sara N wrote:

Hello everyone, I am Sara. I am glad to have this forum to discuss...I am in an extremely overwhelming situation right now and I would be highly grateful if you can take some time and read through the details and advise on where I stand.....

 

It's the first of its kind conflict with a client since I joined upwork.

 

I ended a contract with a client recently, as he refused payment for a batch of 50 articles. I have already delivered him a total of 100 articles (of 1800 words each), and he paid me $355 (although, the agreed amount was $17.5 per article but he formulated the contracted to pay a bare minimum of $350 only for each batch of 50 articles every week, and to pay the full amount at the end of contract in week-8 - as it was a project of 400 articles). He also had clauses about paying a penalty of $50 per article per day for late (this penalty was not discussed when he was discussing terms of the contract with me, but when he actually sent me the offer he added that and I was too focused on the $7000 total budget at that time that I misinterpreted the penalty clause to be $50 per day for the entire batch of 50 articles). 

 

In week-1 I realized that 50 articles of 1800 words in 7 days was more than I could possibly manage. It involved a lot of work (preliminary keyword research, factual details on psychopathology, helpful resources from amazon, referencing, adding images etc). So before the deadline of week-1, I approached the client and requested an extension to which he agreed. I also requested a penalty waiver and he agreed. The penalty waiver was discussed and agreed upon for the entire contract as well. 

 

So I delivered him the work and he released $5 for week-1 (50 articles). 

I didn't notice it at the time. 

I delivered him week-2, (another 50 articles) and noticed the $5 payment status, so I discussed it with him and said that I will not work any further if he doesn't pay me for the work. He paid me $350 from week-2 milestone and reassured that $5 was not intended to be the only payment. 

 

=== so until that time the total payments from client were $5+$350 (instead of $350+$350) ====

 

I started working on week-3, but I request him the payment from another milestone (i.e. of $350) before I could send him another 50 articles. On this the conversation trailed off and got stringent. He refused me any payment at all and said that week-1 work was late so he does not owe me anything. 

I sent him proof of week-3 work (as he asked), and waited for him to pay me for the previous $345 but he didn't and declined any payments and said that I can end the contract if I will. During this conversation he ate at my self-esteem...and I felt absolutely low and very controlled....

 

So, I ended the contract and left him honest feedback (that was negative and detailed the whole situation). He ridiculed me on upwork messages by saying that how would I be getting work on upwork with my current success rate that would decline further after he leaves a negative feedback. That is feedback manipulation and violates the ToS.

 

Later on, someone approaches me (a third person - who was presumably his client) and tells me that if I revert my negative feedback on upwork profile of that person, they can pay me for what is the due remaining amount. I told them that the due amount was $1395 (by 17.5 per article) but $355 would also be okay as per the weekly minimal payment agreed. They gave me an impression of being okay with this and hasted me to quickly change the feedback as they are on a "deadline". So I reverted the feedback, in the light of presumable resolution. But as soon as I reverted my feedback on the upwork profile, that third person asked me to deliver another 50 articles (from week-3 work), I told them that first I need to be paid for the previous 100 articles but they plainly rejected any further payment for those, telling me that they don't owe me any payment because I was late in delivering work for week-1. I tried to reason with them but of no use, they told me that they are okay with it and they would leave things as it is then.

 

So,,,I reverted my original feedback on upwork profile. 

 

Now, the person who actually hired me on upwork - has sent a REFUND request for the $355 he paid me. 

 

How do I owe him any money? 

They have already kept a total of 80% of full payment (at $17.5 per article for 100 articles) and only paid me $355 for 100 articles. 

 

This client is tailing me...he seems to be trying to intimidate me...it feels so much like bullying...

 

After his refund request, I contacted him over at upwork asking him why did he request a refund and he is asking me to send the week-3 work (without any further payments), revert the feedback and then he cancels refund request. 

 

He says that "his client" has hired debt collectors who have access to India as well, and can come and retrieve their money. He also says that I should help him because he paid those $355 from "his pocket because I asked for payment for that work and was crying" (I was crying, as I sent him an audio to clarify the situation and asked for payment after delivering a 100 articles, to which he sent $350 - the only payment). 

 

I told him I don't have money...

For those 100 articles, I only worked on his project for the 2.5 weeks and wasn't able to do anything else, that includes sleeping properly...Obviously I needed money so I decided to invest time and energy....

I know I got late in delivering week-1 but I approached him with a request for deadline extension and penalty waiver well in-time - to which he agreed. 

 

What should I do now?

Does upwork penalizes me in this context?

Would I be forced to refund? I don't have any funds in my account so far, and a refund would mean that I would be paying this client by working on other projects in future............

 

That's really depressing....and I am having a huge amount of anxiety and panic....

 

Please help....


Have a look into the ToS:

6.4 OWNERSHIP OF WORK PRODUCT AND INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY
Upon Freelancer’s receipt of full payment from Client, the Work Product (except for any Background Technology), including without limitation all Intellectual Property Rights in the Work Product (except for any Background Technology), will be the sole and exclusive property of Client, and Client will be deemed to be the author thereof. If Freelancer has any Intellectual Property Rights to the Work Product that are not owned by Client upon Freelancer’s receipt of payment from Client, Freelancer hereby automatically irrevocably assigns to Client all right, title and interest worldwide in and to such Intellectual Property Rights. Except as set forth above, Freelancer retains no rights to use, and will not challenge the validity of Client’s ownership in, such Intellectual Property Rights. Freelancer hereby waives any moral rights, rights of paternity, integrity, disclosure and withdrawal or inalienable rights under applicable law in and to the Work Product. If payment is made only for partial delivery of Work Product, the assignment described herein applies only to the portion of Work Product delivered and paid for.
If the client uses any articles, you provided but did not get paid for, file an DMCA. You own the copyright. Use them for your portfolio.

Thank you so much for this Jennifer! I really appreciate that you took the time to read my whole story 🙂 

 

And I didn't know about the DMCA at all. So, would it be safe for me to pursue payment for those articles that he didn't pay? He is at the moment kind of threatening me (verbal intimidation or indirect intimidation) to refund him or revert the feedback and send him more work. 


Sara N wrote:

Thank you so much for this Jennifer! I really appreciate that you took the time to read my whole story 🙂 

 

And I didn't know about the DMCA at all. So, would it be safe for me to pursue payment for those articles that he didn't pay? He is at the moment kind of threatening me (verbal intimidation or indirect intimidation) to refund him or revert the feedback and send him more work. 


I know it is hard, but you should just ignore him. You do not own him anything. He did not paid you the agreed rate and now wants money back? 
He probably accepted a job and then farmed it out to get it done as cheap as possible (for free). He is now panicing because he misses his deadline, but that is not your problem. Change your feedback to an honest feedback (you can change as often as you like for 14 days once he allowed you to change it).

Since you still own the work he did not pay for, you can try to sell it to another client or elsewhere. It is yours to use. Just make a list with the articles that where paid so you not use them accidently. If you want to be nice, you can share the list with him and inform him that you own the copyright to all the other artices. If your client (or his) uses any of the other articles, have them taken down. You cannot do that if you received the full payment.

That makes sense, and yes he did not pay me anything but $355 for 100 articles, and the total due payment for these would $1750. 

 

Does he hold an advantage in this situation, given the delay in work deliver from me during week-1?? (but I did request him formally for extension and then requested the removal of penalty to which he agreed at that time). 

 

And yes, you are right he does seem to be after getting everything done for free. At this point, I don't even know if he is the owner of that company (for which he is allegedly getting it written) because I am getting emails from that company as well, calling me a "deceitful person" that I didn't change the negative feedback over here on upwork and demanding the money again. 

Thank you so much, Jennifer, for your help and insight. I was very overwhelmed and in panic, the resources and advice that you shared really has helped. 

Hi Jennifer, I just accidentally came across this old post and thought to check in and thank you once more 🙂 Your message gave me the strength and courage to stand firm at that time. I am so grateful and wishing you well in your life. 

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