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Regularly Negative Clients' Feedback Not Included in JSS Calculations

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Community Guru
Will L Member Since: Jul 9, 2015
1 of 13

Others here will no doubt claim they already knew about this element of the JSS calculation, but it is new to me – the calculation of freelancers’ Job Success Score will “exclude clients whose freelancers report a history of unreasonable feedback so their scores won't count against you.”

 

I have said here before that Upwork should make public the average ratings clients have provided their previous freelancers, so freelancers who might apply to those clients' future job postings can decide whether they want to work for hard-to-please / argumentative / dyspeptic clients.

Upwork's solution to this problem is better than nothing, but it results in such clients' future freelancers worrying unnecessarily about unavoidably negative feedback they have no way of knowing won't actually count against their Job Success Score.

For my part, I'd much rather completely avoid dealing with such clients than work for them, put up with their shenanigans and then wonder whether their unjustifably negative feedback is or isn't going to be reflected in my JSS calculation.

Making these clients' prior feedback trends public would likely also have the effect of reducing the number of proposals these clients get for their future projects, which Upwork has recently said is an important goal.

 

So, freelancers, let Upwork know when a client gives you unjustifiably public feedback. Of course, there is no way you can know when a client’s private feedback has been unjustifiably negative, so let’s hope Upwork is not just relying on freelancer feedback but is also secretly tracking these clients’ freelancer feedback and ignoring the consistently negative clients when calculating their freelancers’ JSS.

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Community Guru
Jennifer M Member Since: May 17, 2015
2 of 13

Upwork does most of this stuff to rein in the poop tier freelancers, so we legit people have to deal with rules to deal with the trash. It's frustrating for sure, but I would say they will never make this stuff public because the "plz give me job sir" people who harass clients to give them good feedback and sometimes over the slightest ding like a 4.8 instead of a 5.0. 

 

All the rules that affect legit freelancers are because of the trash. I embrace the purge and hope it gets rid of these people, but I'm afraid it won't tbh. They'll get rid of the super low tier, but that's it. They need to purge like half of their freelancers.

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Community Guru
Will L Member Since: Jul 9, 2015
3 of 13

How does eliminating regularly negative clients' feedback from freelancers' JSS calculations "rein in poop tier freelancers"?

 

If some clients repeatedly (but accurately) report they have bad experiences with Upwork freelancers because they only get "poop tier" ones to work for them, why would those clients keep coming back to hire freelancers on Upwork?

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Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
4 of 13

Will L wrote:

Others here will no doubt claim they already knew about this element of the JSS calculation, but it is new to me – the calculation of freelancers’ Job Success Score will “exclude clients whose freelancers report a history of unreasonable feedback so their scores won't count against you.”

 


Actually that isn't exactly true. It has nothing to do with "reporting"- that is poorly worded.

 

Here is the actual terminology:

 

We understand that some projects have bad outcomes because the client is difficult to work with. So we track freelancer feedback of clients and flag those clients with a history of poor collaboration. If one of your clients has been flagged (or has been suspended for Terms of Service violations), then the client's feedback will not count against your score.

 

This means if a client has a poor history of collaboration (enough freelancers leaving enough poor feedback, including private, or the client leaving enough poor feedback) or is suspended, THEN such a client's feedback is excluded from the JSS calculation.

 

No need to report. It is automated. Reporting doesn't do anything.

 


Will L wrote:

 

So, freelancers, let Upwork know when a client gives you unjustifiably public feedback.


Nope. See above. Everyone with poor feedback tends to claim it is unjustified. 

 

It is automated. Once a threshold is reached, it gets flagged and excluded.

 

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Community Guru
Will L Member Since: Jul 9, 2015
5 of 13

Petra,

 

If you know more about Upwork's secret JSS algorithms than an Upwork moderator does, then we are very lucky to have you here to set the record straight.

 

And since you are here, why do you think Upwork doesn't make public the historical feedback ratings clients have provided for their freelancers, so other freelancers can make in informed decision about whether they want to work with difficult clients?

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Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
6 of 13

Will L wrote:

 

If you know more about Upwork's secret JSS algorithms than an Upwork moderator does, then we are very lucky to have you here to set the record straight.


Oh stop it. The mod who posted it is brand new and you can read the official line as clearly as I can.

I even (once again) posted the link to the "oh so secret" stuff you keep claiming nobody could possibly know anything about. It is not secret.  You just like pretending it is, makes for better hostile posts, doesn't it?

 


Will L wrote:

 

And since you are here, why do you think Upwork doesn't make public the historical feedback ratings clients have provided for their freelancers, so other freelancers can make in informed decision about whether they want to work with difficult clients?


I don't know. Why don't you ask them?

 

 

 

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Community Guru
Will L Member Since: Jul 9, 2015
7 of 13

I asked you, Petra, because you just told me you know more about Upwork's policies than an Upwork employee does. So, your opinion, or even some factual information on the subject, would be useful to other freelancers.

 

But I'll open it up and ask any Upwork employee who happens by why there is no information available about client's historical feedback for their previous freelancers.

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Community Guru
Jennifer M Member Since: May 17, 2015
8 of 13

Will L wrote:

I asked you, Petra, because you just told me you know more about Upwork's policies than an Upwork employee does. So, your opinion, or even some factual information on the subject, would be useful to other freelancers.

 

But I'll open it up and ask any Upwork employee who happens by why there is no information available about client's historical feedback for their previous freelancers.


In all fairness, most regulars here know more about the way Upwork works than their level 1 CS people, and you have to admit it's a lot to do with Petra. You just want to complain about everything and get upset over someone who is pro-Upwork policies.

 

Most people who are pro-Upwork (I'm one of them too) don't always like their rules, but you can see why they are doing it. The less you care about their rules and just bill people on-platform, the more money you'll make. All of this nonsense is not important.

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Community Guru
Phyllis G Member Since: Sep 8, 2016
9 of 13

Jennifer M wrote:

Will L wrote:

I asked you, Petra, because you just told me you know more about Upwork's policies than an Upwork employee does. So, your opinion, or even some factual information on the subject, would be useful to other freelancers.

 

But I'll open it up and ask any Upwork employee who happens by why there is no information available about client's historical feedback for their previous freelancers.


In all fairness, most regulars here know more about the way Upwork works than their level 1 CS people, and you have to admit it's a lot to do with Petra. You just want to complain about everything and get upset over someone who is pro-Upwork policies.

 

Most people who are pro-Upwork (I'm one of them too) don't always like their rules, but you can see why they are doing it. The less you care about their rules and just bill people on-platform, the more money you'll make. All of this nonsense is not important.


I'd like to submit this as evidence of why we need an "uber kudo" button.

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Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
10 of 13

Will L wrote:

I asked you, Petra, because you just told me you know more about Upwork's policies than an Upwork employee does.


You know as well as I do that it was you who said that, I didn't - and you are just arguing and being hostile and twisting things around for the sake of it.  Again.

 

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