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sehar-arif-malik
Community Member

Should I fully refund my client or not?

Hi,
Yesterday, a client (previous client) hired me on hourly basis and I started working on it. I said it will take 1 day, but he said he needs it at his morning time or in 10 to 12 hours.I said I agreed. I took the task and worked almost all night because my pm was his am time. It took me a little more  time than I thought, When I saw that my client is offline, I took rest for 2 hours and when I wake up, I immediately read his messages. He was disappointed It was his 8:am +  and he ended my hourly contract too. I sent him at his 8:05 the file to show that I have completed it and then he said good work but late,it just had to be submitted at 8:00am my time(client time).
Now the question is:
He ended contract (hourly) today. Will upwork pay me the amount?

and as he already mentioned in messages that he is disappointed and ended contract before I sent him the files, there is no chance of good feedback.(there are already 3 to 4 feedbacks that he left for his freelancers (he used these words: disappointed and irrespossible )
SO, I am thinking what if I fully refund him his amount and use my top rated perk to remove it from my JSS?
WHat should I do?

24 REPLIES 24
wescowley
Community Member

If you tracked your time properly, you should still be paid. 

 

If you refund the money, your score will take a hit from the no-pay contract, which you won't be able to undo with your perk. If you don't, you will likely get a poor review, but as you said, you can use your perk to remove it and the effect on your JSS. 

 

I'd suggest not doing the refund.

Hi,
Thanks  for reply. I asked upwork support, they said The fully refunded contract can also be removed using top-rated perk.

You do NOT have to give a refund at all - you can use your perk to remove the feedback and the impact on your JSS.


Christine A wrote:
You do NOT have to give a refund at all - you can use your perk to remove the feedback and the impact on your JSS.

Thanks for reply. But he said he does n't need those files anymore. If I will not refund him, he can ask for refund and file a dispute.

No he can't, if it was an hourly contract and you tracked your time properly. Did he say what time the project was due?


Wes C wrote:

If you refund the money, your score will take a hit from the no-pay contract, which you won't be able to undo with your perk.


Huh? Of course you can use the perk on it.

 

Personally, If I have a hard deadline that I myself agreed to and I miss it, I don't charge.


Petra R wrote:

Wes C wrote:

If you refund the money, your score will take a hit from the no-pay contract, which you won't be able to undo with your perk.


Huh? Of course you can use the perk on it.

 

Personally, If I have a hard deadline that I myself agreed to and I miss it, I don't charge.


Hi,
Thanks for reply, Did you remove any of your contract feedback that is fully refunded by you. Did it still cause a decline in your JSS?


Sehar Arif M wrote:


Thanks for reply, Did you remove any of your contract feedback that is fully refunded by you. Did it still cause a decline in your JSS?

If you exclude a contract from your JSS, it excludes any and all effect that contract had. 

So if you use the perk, your JSS will be as if that client and their contract never happened.


Petra R wrote:

Sehar Arif M wrote:


Thanks for reply, Did you remove any of your contract feedback that is fully refunded by you. Did it still cause a decline in your JSS?

If you exclude a contract from your JSS, it excludes any and all effect that contract had. 

So if you use the perk, your JSS will be as if that client and their contract never happened.


Thank you so much, I even talked to Upwork Support, But was still confused about it. Thanks for your confirmation.


Petra R wrote:

Wes C wrote:

If you refund the money, your score will take a hit from the no-pay contract, which you won't be able to undo with your perk.


Huh? Of course you can use the perk on it.

 

OK, my misunderstanding. I didn't think the perk would remove the effect of the no-pay, just the feedback. Thanks for the correction.

jaeveedee
Community Member

Did he actually give you a specific time that it was due or a general 10-12 hours? Also was 12 hours exactly 8am his time?

 

If either of those is a no and you still had time on the theoretical clock to actually submit the work I would say you should not refund the client. If it was past his deadline of even a vague 10-12 hours and you agreed to it then maybe you should refund them.


Jason wrote:

Did he actually give you a specific time that it was due or a general 10-12 hours? Also was 12 hours exactly 8am his time?

 

If either of those is a no and you still had time on the theoretical clock to actually submit the work I would say you should not refund the client. If it was past his deadline of even a vague 10-12 hours and you agreed to it then maybe you should refund them.


I said him that it will take 1 day(24 hours), because when we were discussing it its my 7pm, he said he need help, He will pay me extra if I'll provide it in next 10/12 hours. I mentioned that the task is complex and will take a good time. And I couldn't complete it in 10/12 despite being working a whole night. But I managed to complete it after that time. But I didn't send him because it was his midnight time and I don't want to bother him, I saw that he is offline too so I thought I'll send him when he will be online(In his morning).But he was in rush and he even not waited for next 10 to 20 minutes.
But any ways, I'll refund him and remove the effect from JSS using Top-rated perk because I did it many times( the same client needs some task to complete in few hours and I worked a whole night and meet the deadline. There were two to 3 more clients in my upwork Job history, they also wanted to complete work within even 5 to 6 hours and I met the deadline and they appreciated alot. )

and after getting almost all good feedbacks, I don't want to show that bad feedback while I know that I worked hard. Many new clients will think me as an irresponsible.

The client contacted the freelancer with a last-minute rush job and gave her hardlly any lead time.

 

The freelancer sent the requested file at 8:05 a.m., when the client had set a 8:00 a.m. deadline.

 

The client then asked for a complete refund because it was turned in late. (Five minutes late.)

 

REGARDLESS of what would be the right thing for the freelancer to do...

REGARDLESS of what the smartest or most tactical thing for the freelancer to do is...

 

The CLIENT should have thanked the freelancer for the work and paid as arranged.


Preston H wrote:

The client then asked for a complete refund because it was turned in late. (Five minutes late.)


If you miss a flight by 5 minutes, did you miss it any less than if you had missed it by an hour? A hard deadline is a hard deadline. 

 


Preston H wrote:

The client contacted the freelancer with a last-minute rush job and gave her hardlly any lead time.


She had the choice NOT to agree-

 


Preston H wrote:

The CLIENT should have thanked the freelancer for the work and paid as arranged.


It's an hourly contract, so the client might not have a choice if she decides not to refund.

re: "- If you miss a flight by 5 minutes, did you miss it any less than if you had missed it by an hour? A hard deadline is a hard deadline.
- She had the choice NOT to agree
- It's an hourly contract, so the client might not have a choice if she decides not to refund."

 

I agree with everything you said here.

Yes, the freelancer missed the deadline. Yes, the freelancer had a choice to not agree.

 

I don't have any problem at all with what you said when you said that you - personally - would refund the client if you missed a hard deadline.

 

It is my opinion that the right thing for the client to do would be to thank the freelancer and not try to get any kind of refund.



Preston H wrote:

The client contacted the freelancer with a last-minute rush job and gave her hardlly any lead time.

 

The freelancer sent the requested file at 8:05 a.m., when the client had set a 8:00 a.m. deadline.

 

The client then asked for a complete refund because it was turned in late. (Five minutes late.)

 

REGARDLESS of what would be the right thing for the freelancer to do...

REGARDLESS of what the smartest or most tactical thing for the freelancer to do is...

 

The CLIENT should have thanked the freelancer for the work and paid as arranged.


I know he said that he wants the design in 10/12 hours But  I couldn't complete it in 10/12 hours,it was his mid night when I completed it, He was offline, I thought it is his night time, I shouldn't disturb him. I'll send him at his 8 or 9 am, at 7am+ time , he ended contract and said he is disappointed, I failed to meet deadline etc. I think he has a client and he delayed his work too much and therefore he hired me and when his client wasn't happy and don't want to work with him anymore due to his own reasons. He said that I missed deadline and he don't need these file anymore. Because I have did many rush jobs but No one says that he/she doesn't need files.
However I can still recieve money but that's my decision to refund him because I really felt bad. He could wait for 5 to 10 minutes. Instead of appreciation I recieved a bad feedback. Many of community members said that I can remove feedback and still recieve money but "This feedback has been removed " also states that there is something very bad about me.

 

Sehar:
As this was an hourly contract, you really don't need to refund anything.

 

It would be your choice.

 

If you refund ALL of the money, the feedback will NOT appear on your pubic profile.
But then you won't have the money. And you'll have a zero-pay contract, which is not good for JSS.

 

Only you can make this decision.



Preston H wrote:

Sehar:
As this was an hourly contract, you really don't need to refund anything.

 

It would be your choice.

 

If you refund ALL of the money, the feedback will NOT appear on your pubic profile.
But then you won't have the money. And you'll have a zero-pay contract, which is not good for JSS.

 

Only you can make this decision.

It will still hurt my JSS because of his negative feedback.
I still have to use perk.


 

You have completed 62 jobs and you have a 98% JSS right now.

 

So you are insulated quite a bit from the negative impact of any ONE job.

 

Have you even seen the client's feedback to you?

I definitely would not make a decision about giving a refund until you see the feedback, unless you do so purely because you feel bad about the job being late.


Preston H wrote:

You have completed 62 jobs and you have a 98% JSS right now.

 

So you are insulated quite a bit from the negative impact of any ONE job.

 

Have you even seen the client's feedback to you?

I definitely would not make a decision about giving a refund until you see the feedback, unless you do so purely because you feel bad about the job being late.


I have to wait for refunds. when these will be available then I'll think again.I apprecaite your suggestions.
Thanks.

So the deadline wasn't 8 am

The deadline was between 5 and 7 am

 

What absolutely stuns me is that you finished the work the client was absolutely desperate for asap and chose not to SEND it for hours.

 

That is nothing short of insane.

Some valid points.

 

A big difference between an 8 am deadline and a deadline between 5 and 7 am.

 

Are we talking about just two hours of work?

Sounds like there would be little downside to just refunding the whole thing.


Preston H wrote:

Some valid points.

 

A big difference between an 8 am deadline and a deadline between 5 and 7 am.

 

Are we talking about just two hours of work?

Sounds like there would be little downside to just refunding the whole thing.


I know that I should not accept his offer.

I should send him work right after completion.

I already Knew that he gave 2/3 people a bad review. (he can give me too but other reviews were good so I thought I should accept.
He doesn't Know that how much a task can take time? He thinks it just 1 or 2 hour tasks but quality work and detailed illustrations take time.

I agree with both of you. I'll definitely keep all these things in my mind.

You have no reason to refund, especially on an hourly contract. If the client wanted the job done on time he would have hired you a few days earlier! You did your best to deliver on time, but the risk of missing the deadline is on the client. 

What if it was a bigger project, would you refund an entire month of work for being a few hours late?

 

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