Should a low-balling employer be reported?

[macko_phillip]

Dear all,

I feel like we should all police low-balling employers. I'm interested to hear any thoughts you have on the matter.

Here's mine - Recently I submitted a proposal at $95 p/ hour to a posting that; 1) had recieved similar quotes in that range, 2) did NOT list a fixed price range, and advertised looking for a content expert.

My first interview went very well. I was invited to a second, and was sent sales content to review - 28 pages in total. I spent several hours preparing.  I received a message the day before my second call was scheduled that read almost exactly this - "Excited to meet with you again, are we confirmed?  And oh, by the way I forgot to mention that our fixed compensation rate is ..."

The fixed, non-negotiable rate was half my proposed rate. I would never have sent a proposal had they been forthright. I feel it was a conscious bait-and-switch tactic - one that's likely to ensnare others. 

Shouuld we as a community stand up against these types of tactics?

[tlbp]

Do not spend several hours preparing to negotiate a contract. Get a contract, then bill several hours working on it. 

[macko_phillip]

I understand - however in this case it was required that I familiarize with their sales script and services proposal. The second meeting was a role-play with me "selling" the proposal by follwoing exatly the 12 page sales script.

[firescue17]

---

Tonya P wrote:

Do not spend several hours preparing to negotiate a contract. Get a contract, then bill several hours working on it. 

---

While this is highly dependent upon one's area of expertise, if one is hoping to acquire long-term, multi-year contracts, I would strongly advise against this practice.

If one is doing a 30-minute graphic design logo. Sure, take it or leave it. The high volume of contracts will wash out potentially bad prospects.

Personally, I focus on long-term business relationships which last 2, 3, 4 years. I've spent 2, 3 and 4 hours in preliminary strategy discussions prior to accepting a contract. Some of the clients disappeared during initial discussions. I've kicked dozens of them loose because they had no clear business plan (some with zero business experience of any sort), any modicum of how to engage business in the freelance arena, and some simply because I personally didn't like them. None of this information would have been available to me by simply clicking "Accept" and diving headfirst into a black hole.

The few hours I spend upfront is well worth avoiding the potential of getting tied up in knots with clients who will inevitably leave poor feedback because they don't know what they want, how to ask for it, what to do with it when they get it, or otherwise generally aggravate me and make life difficult.

[lysis10 · Accepted solution]

---

Phillip M wrote:

Shouuld we as a community stand up against these types of tactics?

---

I do. I tell them how much it will cost if they want me to do it. I don't need Upwork's help with this nonsense. The more Upwork stays out of my poop, the better I will be.

[a_lipsey]

I got turned down twice today because of my rate. I'm okay with that. Another client hired me at my rate. The first two clients, I wish them the best and hope they got a freelancer who will meet their needs. If not, they know how to reach me. And I let them know I'm here if they do need me in the future. In the meantime, I'm making money from people who respect the value of my work. 

Negotiating and dealing with client budgets is just a part of doing business. I sometimes work on a sliding scale for clients I like who have limited budgets. They know they are getting something worth more than I'm charging them. 

Clients are going to try to negotiate. I'd be a little surprised if they didn't. Yes, it is kind of a pain and slight expense when they won't be up front about their budget, but again, it's just the cost of doing business. Also, things can change after their initial job post. It may not be intentionally misleading or bad faith. Budgets legitimately change. 

There are things I wish UpWork would do, but being Big Brother to my business practices is really not one of them. Let me negotiate with clients. I don't want them deciding things on my behalf. 

So, I respectfully disagree. But I understand your frustration. 

[feed_my_eyes]

---

Phillip M wrote:

The fixed, non-negotiable rate was half my proposed rate. I would never have sent a proposal had they been forthright. I feel it was a conscious bait-and-switch tactic - one that's likely to ensnare others. 

---

Are you sure that they're not willing to pay you this rate, or are they just negotiating? After all, they saw your bid before they started talking to you, so I don't think that they would have wasted so much of their own time if their budget really is half your price. 

One thing that I sometimes do with clients who are "on a tight budget" is to tell them what I CAN do for the price that they're offering, instead of what I can't do. Say, if someone wants a long document designed but they can't afford my rate, I'll offer to create a template that they can use themselves, or I'll just design the cover and they can find a cheaper freelancer to lay out the rest. (And often, the client does end up hiring me to complete the job.) I'm not sure if this tactic is feasible with the kind of services that you provide, but it might be worth a shot since the client is clearly interested in working with you.

[petra_r]

---

Phillip M wrote:
Should a low-balling employer be reported

---

Reporting someone for being a chancer is a waste of time and money. Unless a client or freelancer violates the terms of service, there is nothing to report.

It's irritating, it happens, roll eyes, move on.