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The Problem with job success rate

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Active Member
Guilherme Gabriel T Member Since: Jan 20, 2016
21 of 107

Still though Valeria, what can I do to improve? well...public most of them are 5 stars and only 2 that aren't, it's 4.6 and 4.4 and 3 without any feedback, but still though why is it only 74% job success? is there a way to improve it? Please don't say get other jobs and get 5 stars. 

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Community Guru
Jessica S Member Since: Dec 4, 2015
22 of 107

@Guilherme Gabriel T wrote:

Still though Valeria, what can I do to improve? well...public most of them are 5 stars and only 2 that aren't, it's 4.6 and 4.4 and 3 without any feedback, but still though why is it only 74% job success? is there a way to improve it? Please don't say get other jobs and get 5 stars. 


I am pretty sure anything less than like a 4.9 is considered bad by Upwork. A score of 8 and below is also considered bad in private feedback. If a client gives an 8 it means (to Upwork) that he does NOT recommend you.  You have to do perfect work here all the time because the consequences of not are pretty severe. And you can't learn from your private feedback because they won't share it,  Your score also gets docked when clients don't close contracts and they go idle. Unfortunately, there is a lot that goes into your score that is not in your control but Upwork thinks that is fair so we have to deal with it. 😁

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Active Member
Guilherme Gabriel T Member Since: Jan 20, 2016
23 of 107

Well I really didn't know about that, so probably that is why. In this matter of recommendation no doubt Elance was better, let us see if one day Upwork will somehow improve it, because there are some bad things towards the Freelancer for example: I might not even show up in the results (as many employers do that), besides some jobs they require a certain percentage of AWESOMENESS, furthermore I cannot get into some specific groups in Upwork, because I need a minimum score. So....I still believe it is unfair towards us as freelancers. 

I also wonder if the board of directors will check and improve that, anybody knows? 

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Ace Contributor
George K Member Since: Mar 7, 2015
24 of 107

JS is : “The percentage of this freelancer's jobs that resulted in a great client experience” or NOT

 

I recently logged into my account and saw that my JS dropped from 100% to 95%. My last contract was closed 2 months ago and my JS was 100%. All of a sudden it dropped to 95%. Why? Because I have not logged any hours for 2+ months.

 

So, how would that reduce the epxerience that any future clients would get from me? 

 

You do not state in your policy that freelances should make a certain amount of money in the platform, therefore, you seriously violate all ethical policies by reducing the JS score of a freelancer because they simply are to busy to for a period of time to take more work. Freelancing is not a 9 to 5 job and your scoring criteria should take that into account. 

This is totally rubbish and Upwork has to understand that I am the real client here. Their commission comes from my fees.

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Community Guru
Jennifer M Member Since: May 17, 2015
25 of 107

Looks like you had a 5 star contract drop out of your 1 year mark. That leaves the one with 4.8 and likely "project was not completed successfully" set as his answer.

 

You only have 1 project for your 6 months, 2 for 1 year, and then a few others. I suspect when there is too little data for the shorter time frames, they use the full 2 years. This is my guess from looking at other profiles. If that's the case, then that 1 project could be pulling your average down.

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Ace Contributor
Jordan G Member Since: Aug 21, 2015
26 of 107

Actually sounds to me like the exact opposite.  This is why the formula should be known.  Obviously the math is just not right.

If it's going the full 2 years then he has 27 projects.  That means the one project represents 3 % of his projects so even if he received a 0 then he should still have a higher JSS.  At  a 4.8 it should have been so miniscule percentage wise that it should not have dropped.

However 4.8 out of 5 is about 96 per cent so it's almost like the one project is the basis for his whole JSS.

 

Again the JSS is absurd, and it is impossible to know if it's working correctly.  Imagine the tax man telling you thay determined your tax rate but your not privy to the formula they used and you just have to trust them to calculate it correctly.  Upwork takes 10 per cent of my wages so at the very least all formula used to classify and represent me should be fully transparent.  However time and again Upwork has proven to have little regard for the freelancers on their site.

Furthermore if the formula is valid then it should be near imposible ot game anyway.  I believe they are keeping the formula hidden because either:

It is illogical and people will see it for what it is - absurd and ludicrous
or

it doesn't work and this way they don't have to fix it in any hurry


Not to mention why does the freelancer take a hit if the client does not leave feedback?  If your system needs feedback so much then just use the freelancers average feedback for ones that don't leave any.

 

***Edit ***

Furthermore as the original poster pointed out when you put the mouse over the JSS score the exact wording is

"The percentage of this freelancer's jobs that resulted in a great client experience"

Is 4.8 out of 5 not a great client experience?  where are the 5% (1.35) of jobs in his profile that are the bad experience?  I looked at the profile and he's obviously a great worker and freelancer.

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Community Guru
Jennifer M Member Since: May 17, 2015
27 of 107

You're just taking the stars into consideration though. Also the other projects are still in progress. If I remember correctly, he has an old (could be dormant) contract. 

 

It's not just stars they take into consideration. It's the other questions they ask from the client and their own internal signals. 

 

We don't know, but here are questions I ask:

 

1) Is the old contract dormant? Bad

2) The 4.8 customer said the project was unsuccessful. This could, perhaps, weigh more than 1 good 5 star contract. We don't know if it's a 1:1 comparison.

3) Refunds...cancellations? We don't know.

4) Most contracts in progress have money, but he hasn't been rated yet, correct? So I don't know if ongoing current projects count positively. I assume they do, but I would also assume that closed, rated contracts count much more. That would make sense since we don't know the outcome of the job yet. 

 

One thing is for sure though, he lost a 5 star contract in January. This must have been carrying some weight until now.

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Ace Contributor
Jordan G Member Since: Aug 21, 2015
28 of 107

Yes it could be any of those things or it could be none is my point.  How would anyone know if their JSS is being calculated correctly?  If there were some way to be sure it was calculated correctly, there would be concrete reasons why his JSS dropped.  Instead it's just maybe this, maybe that.

 

Furthermore as I noted the JSS score when hovered over says "The percentage of this freelancer's jobs that resulted in a great client experience"

looking at his record and from other threads in this forum at this point I believe this definition of JSS is the farthest thing from the actual reality of the score. 

And on the hidden feedback that makes no sense to me.  Just rate the freelancer, and thats it.  That hidden recommendation stuff is absurd.  If you go to McDonalds, no matter how good the food or your experience your not going to necessarily recommend it.  However you go out for a fine meal and then you might rate it.  And lets be honest a lot of the jobs on Upwork are the equivalent of fast food.  

 

 

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Community Guru
Jessica S Member Since: Dec 4, 2015
29 of 107

@Jordan G wrote:

 

Furthermore as I noted the JSS score when hovered over says "The percentage of this freelancer's jobs that resulted in a great client experience"

 


 THIS is the part of it all that really makes me mad. "The percentage of the freelancers jobs that resulted in a great client experience" is how Upwork explains JSS to clients. Tell me...how do idle contracts contribute to a LESS than satisfactory client experience when the client is the one who is supposed to close it? How does forcing freelancers to beg clients to close contracts contributing to a great client experience? It's NOT. It's irritating and unprofessional and the actions Upwork forces us to take contributes to a BAD client experience. Clients would never think idle contracts are part of a JSS score because a contract left open or closed has NOTHING to do with their experience. 

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Ace Contributor
George K Member Since: Mar 7, 2015
30 of 107

>1) Is the old contract dormant? Bad

Nope, just clients who wish to maintain the contracts open in case they ever need something. They don’t understand that they can always rehire me and I can not force them to close their contracts.

>2) The 4.8 customer said the project was unsuccessful. This could, perhaps, weigh more than 1 good 5 star contract. >We don't know if it's a 1:1 comparison.

Where did you get the idea that it was unsuccessful? The guy was in as hurry to fix something that 5 freelancers before me had screwed up and I offered him a a quick solution instead of reinstalling his full system. I did not charge anything and the money he paid me was a bonus!

>3) Refunds...cancellations? We don't know.

None

Like I said earlier my JS has always been 100% until recently, without any contract being closed or any dispute or whatever.

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