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Threatened & extorted by client

petra_r
Community Guru
Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
31 of 53

There won't be any arbitration. The client has filed chargebacks, arbitration is off the table, the client's account suspended.....

lysis10
Community Guru
Jennifer M Member Since: May 17, 2015
32 of 53

@Mark K wrote:

Katarina,

Some truths:

#1 This is an Internet-based, free-for-all, global, race-to-the-bottom job posting site -- which should give us all great pause and concern.

#2 How you react to a client who says such things (if that is the case - we have not heard clients side) - can determine if you end up resolving the problem without losing your $ (or all of you $) and your mind.  Ive learned the hard way.  From your notes, my guess is that you went to the dark side right away.  Not excusing chumpy client behaviors, but your reaction is under your control.

#3 UW indeed mysteriously loses threads such as these -- (see #1 above)

 

Possible Solution:

I had a nefarious client stiff me for several thousand $ here.  I asked to speak to his manager - and he became very defensive.  I closed the project here b/c I did not have adequate payment protection.  (NOTE: you are completely and entirely hammered every time without it).

It was a sizeable chunk of cash -- so I posted a very professional, balanced but honest assessment of the company on GlassDoor.  Two days later the President of the Co called me -- he got both sides and apologized for the person's shenanigans and asked how to make it right.  I said pay me the x thousand dollars.  He sent a check that day.   May not always work, but it was nice to feel some green vindication. 

 

Good luck.

Be Positive -- Move Forward!

 

 


 YESSSS! That's how it's done. I'm going remember GlassDoor. I was always thinking ripoffreport, but a lot of places are really monitoring their GlassDoor profiles. This is a great idea.

financemark
Community Guru
Mark K Member Since: Jul 7, 2016
33 of 53

Jennifer,

It worked for me I think ONLY bc the president was concerned enough to reach out.  I don't know that many would.  Glass Door can also be a place where disgruntled ex-employees go to rip their prior companies -- and I sometimes wonder how much of these rants are justified.

 

The key is to try to be balanced -- and it is very difficult.  I feel for the OP. 

 

 

lysis10
Community Guru
Jennifer M Member Since: May 17, 2015
34 of 53

@Mark K wrote:

Jennifer,

It worked for me I think ONLY bc the president was concerned enough to reach out.  I don't know that many would.  Glass Door can also be a place where disgruntled ex-employees go to rip their prior companies -- and I sometimes wonder how much of these rants are justified.

 

The key is to try to be balanced -- and it is very difficult.  I feel for the OP. 

 

 


 I worked for a place where the CEO was obsessed with his GlassDoor rating. lol The place was small enough too that most of us knew who made the ratings, so we could judge if it was real. The company is only rated a 2/5 and we were sure HR was making fake posts only because the CEO was so obsessed with being rated low. lol At Citrix, the employees watched GlassDoor ratings. 

 

I think it's becoming a thing. I always go to GlassDoor before I interview.

dkatria
Active Member
Katarina Đ Member Since: Aug 31, 2017
35 of 53

The client has now also requested a charge back for additional 3 contracts, and I am in debt 595$, not counting fees. I warned Upwork support this will happen. They still haven't given me a concrete answer on my screenshots of his threats etc.

 

For the fees we are paying Upwork, do we get no support and no protection AT ALL?

tlbp
Community Guru
Tonya P Member Since: Nov 26, 2015
36 of 53

I have yet to see a freelancer report that Upwork went to bat for them and fought a charge back by a client. So when a fixed price contract is involved, I have no faith that a client who lies and cheats to effect a chargeback would be prevented from doing so. 

dkatria
Active Member
Katarina Đ Member Since: Aug 31, 2017
37 of 53

I agree completely! So:

 

- why are fixed price projects even allowed in that case?

- why are we paying 20% of hard earned money to upwork?

- why is upwork support uninterested and unhelpful?

 

tlsanders
Community Guru
Tiffany S Member Since: Jan 15, 2016
38 of 53

@Katarina D wrote:

I agree completely! So:

 

- why are fixed price projects even allowed in that case?

 

Because hundreds of thousands of them go just fine. If only things that had zero risk associated with them were allowed, we would all be standing very carefully in one place wrapped in bubble wrap...except even that undoubtedly has some risks.

 

- why are we paying 20% of hard earned money to upwork?

 

Primarily because Upwork invests a huge amount of money in marketing, which connects us with clients we would be unlikely to have ever found otherwise. Upwork provides other services (payment processing, escrow, access to reduced-cost arbitration, etc.), but the marketing is where they're saving you huge amounts of time and money. 

 

- why is upwork support uninterested and unhelpful?

 

I do agree that Upwork should do more to fight chargebacks. Alternatively, if Upwork has decided not to bother with the options available for fighting chargebacks, then maybe the company should absorb them. While I don't think Upwork should be responsible for paying a freelancer out of its own pocket, the situation changes a bit when Upwork is a wall between the freelancer and the opportunity to challenge fraudulent actions by the client. It doesn't seem that the company should be able to decide to blow off the opportunity to fight the chargeback on behalf of the client and stick the client with the bill

 

Aside from that issue, though, there isn't much Upwork can do to "help." As you discovered, the dispute team can't render any decisions--actually can't, as a matter of law. All it can do is attempt to facilitate a resolution between the freelancer and the client. 

 


 

kat303
Community Guru
Kathy T Member Since: Jul 17, 2015
39 of 53

@Katarina D wrote:

The client has now also requested a charge back for additional 3 contracts, and I am in debt 595$, not counting fees. I warned Upwork support this will happen. They still haven't given me a concrete answer on my screenshots of his threats etc.

 

For the fees we are paying Upwork, do we get no support and no protection AT ALL?


 Katarina = From my understanding, the way it works is this.  When a client starts a chargeback, the bank or credit card company goes after Upwork because initially the client paid into Upwork's escrow account. Upwork pays back the client's bank/credit card. Then, because Upwork is out that money, Upwork then goes after you so they can replace the funds they had to pay back.

 

Upwork says they will challenge or fight the chargeback on your behalf but I wonder how hard they actually fight "on your behalf" since they've recouped their money.

 

2 things should be done. Either Upwork should give the freelancer ALL the information about the client that they have (account numbers, bank name, client's name etc.) so that the freelancer can fight the chargeback themselves. Or, the chargeback should go directly to the freelancer who was the one that provided the served and ultimately received the client's money.

kochubei_valeria
Community Manager
Valeria K Community Manager Member Since: Mar 6, 2014
40 of 53

Katarina,

 

We understand how frustrating this situation is for you and have already escalated your concern to appropriate teams. Also, rest assured that actions have already been taken against the client's account. Since we can't share details here in the Community, we'll make sure any update is communicated to you via your open ticket as soon as possible.

 

Thank you for your patience.

~ Valeria
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