Unauthorized refund

[cecilia_marquez]

Hi, I recently finished a contract with a client on upwork. Things went ok, client got what they asked and finished my contract. Today, a week after the contract was closed I receive an email stating “I refunded” the client money. I haven’t authorized such thing, all hours were under the terms of the contract and logged using the time tracker... I have no idea what just happened.

Please do excuse any possible mistakes, I am currently on mobile.

[feed_my_eyes]

I'm sorry that this happened to you and that Upwork uses such confusing language, saying that "you" refunded the client, when you did no such thing. Unfortunately, payments can be reversed if a client files a chargeback or in cases where a stolen credit card was used. But what do you mean when you say that you "logged" your hours - if this was an hourly contract, there wouldn't have been any money in escrow.

[18c7b72c]

Hi Christine, thank you for your reply. The money was in the "Pending" column on my overview. It was an hourly contract. I logged the hours manually as I didn't think it would be an issue as Upwork offers the possibility to proceed this way and the contract linking me to the client permitted it - Also I tried to use the tracking app to log my hours before and my laptop fans went mad so I registered my hours manually from that moment on. The client has a verified payment method and hired  3 other people for the same period as me. The communication has been perfectly normal but from the moment I sent the finished work the client went silent. The work was long, it was a proofreading of a French translation, 58 pages of mechanical engineering, 15 000/20 000 word to be verified against the English version, needless to say it demanded expertise. It feels like a hit and run. I hope Upwork won't be tolerating such behaviour from the client.  

[2b23dc6f]

Hi I did not receive my payment for today and last Sarurday Upwork paused my contract .

My pending payment that was to receive today is not available and upon checking my account I was given a refund to my client and I did not request for a refund. I only have a for review payment but my 1st week billyng cycle that was supposed to get today is not available

Please help me and explain what is gong on 

[2b23dc6f]

I did not request for a refund I did not receive the pending payment on my account it was all vanished and the only remaining is my transaction on for review on my last weeks  12hrs finished task. It was also paused by Upwork I actually have 2 contracts that was paused by Upwork 

[feed_my_eyes]

If this was an hourly contract, did you use the time tracker properly, with high activity levels and written memos? It sounds like the client's payment method failed if Upwork paused the contract, and that the hours you've done so far didn't qualify for payment protection. 

Is this the "copywriting" job that's listed as being in progress in your profile? It's a very odd-looking project - there's no description of what work is required at all, it's just a bunch of text that was copy/pasted from Wikipedia. What was the job, and what made you apply in the first place, when there's no indication anywhere in your profile that you do copywriting? The hourly rate is rather high for a data entry/admin person with no prior Upwork experience. 

[759e32fa]

Hi Kristelle,

Thank you for reaching out to us. On hourly contracts when a client fails to pay for the hours logged by the freelancer and those hours don’t meet the requirements for Hourly Protection, the payment may be reversed. Please note that the reversal will show up in your transaction history as a "Refund" even though the transaction was a reversal processed by Upwork.

[2b23dc6f]

May I ask what will happen my client is unresponsive

[759e32fa]

Hi Kristelle,

If you are working with a client and they become unresponsive for a long period of time, it may be best to stop working on the project and wait for contact from the client.

Please note that any hours logged while the contract is paused will not be paid. You may also check this article to be guided on what you can do when a client becomes unresponsive.

[2b23dc6f]

But how about my payment I log my hours manually does that mean I will not be paid for it??? I have 2 contracts that paused by Upwork and clients are not responsive so is that all? Will I not get my payment even if I work?

[NikolaS]

Hi Kristelle,

Thank you for following up. I checked and it seems that you are already in correspondence with our team on your support ticket. Please allow more time for our team to review your case and respond accordingly to your ticket. You will be notified of their response.

[khemiri_mohamed]

i,
I completed a job with several milestones (total 1100$) on 20 April and were approved by client.

Money got in my withdrawable wallet after 5 day security period.
Now after 30 days, Upwork asked me to refund it as client asked it back from its bank and bank refunded it.

My argument is because payment was approved and 5 day upwork security period was completed - 
1) 5 day upwork security period was completed after approval, So, I am not liable to any refund. Its Upwork's system failure and they are solely repsonsible for it
2) Its a dangerous precendent to set for any freelancer, where your money is not safe even after months in case client decides to have it refund.
3) Upwork charges hefty 20% fee for handling payment and transaction stuff, so I can confortably focus on working on the project
4) Upwork claims money is in Escrow on start of a Fixed price contract. This totally negates there argument of bank not providing funds after 30 days

Can anybody help me with this please? also how is that possible to refund after one month of payment, this is really a very bad thing here, no trust at all

[759e32fa]

Hi Khemiri,

Thank you for reaching out to us.  I reached out to the team handling your case and shared your report. One of our agents will follow up with you on your ticket as soon as possible to assist you further. You can access your support ticket here.

[zahranooreen]

I received an email: You refunded $*** to the client. I don't know why Upwork refunded $** to the client on my hourly project?? Someone, please clear this I didn't even add manual time.  here is the screenshot.

[pgiambalvo]

Upwork really needs to change the language of these refund messages to make it clear what happened instead of making freelancers keep asking about it. "You" didn't refund anything. Upwork did, and even that's not really correct as they most likely tried to charge the client and the payment didn't go through. I don't know why they don't just say that.

[zahranooreen]

Exactly I am confused about why this happened? Even there isn't a clear message explaining the refund. 

[the-right-writer]

The so-called client is a thief. They stole the credit card number and they scammed their way into Upwork with it, and then scammed you. The credit card checks out when Upwork makes a tiny charge. Then when it comes time to get paid, the money is not there because the card owner's bank has stopped the use of the card. There never was any money.

When Upwork discovers the card is invalid, they send a ridiculously worded message about a "refund."

For there to be a refund there must be money and there is none. The truth is it was a scam and you will never receive a penny.

[kochubei_valeria · Accepted solution]

Hi Zahra and Muhammad Hamdoon,

Unfortunately, when the client fails to pay for hours logged by the freelancer, any hours that aren't covered by Upwork Hourly Protection may be reversed. Please check out this help article for more information. When this happens, first an automatic notification is sent but the team will also be reaching out to you directly via email with more information about your specific account.

Update: 

This thread has been closed from further replies due to its size. We appreciate your participation in the Community and welcome you to continue the conversation on this new thread.

Thank you!

[sofia2008]

---

Valeria K wrote:

When this happens, first an automatic notification is sent...

---

Hi Valeria, would it be possible to escalate the concern that the terms used in the notification is creating confusion among freelancers receiving it and is lacking accuracy as it says something like : You send a refund to ---- when if fact "Upwork reversed the payment due to issues with the client's account" or something similar indicating who initiates the reversal (not a refund). Thanks!

[LuiggiR]

Hi Sophie,

Your feedback is well received. I'll be sure to share this with the team.

Thank you,

[pgiambalvo]

Yes, please! And also make it clear that Payment Protection on fixed priced contracts does not protect freelancers from clients using a stolen credit card or who issue a chargeback.

[4359c6c3]

The same thing with me on fixed-price job. I was scammed two days ago and  Upwork says that it cant do anything.

 Sorry, but Upworks terms say:

"Upwork charges the client at the beginning of the project, and the money for a milestone is deposited in escrow."

 "Please choose fixed-price jobs carefully. Only funds deposited for an active milestone are covered covered by Escrow Protection." This client had already paid and left 5 star review 

So how it is possible to take funds back from escrow? If it is than there should not be even talk about Payment Protection.

[heliasohrabi]

Hello,

I have the same problem. For the past two months, I have worked for a client within the limit allowed per week, never added manual hours and the client has been very satisfied by my work. The contract has been twice a hold because of a payment issues. the client resolved it the first time, and the secnd one was last Sunday. They told me that in a few days this will be resolved too. So, I simply stopped working until further notice. Today, I receveid an email from Upwork that 56$ is refunded to the client!! So strange since they owe me 9 hours of pay. Upwork shouldn't refund an amount from my account wihtout my consent!! I should also receive better than a generic explanantion text about this refund that was copy-pasted in the email. How was 56$ calculated? why not more or less? I received no detail.

It would be great if Upwork provides us better support.

Thank you

contract ID: 31295716

[JoanneP]

Hi Helia,

I checked your account and it looks like you are already corresponding with our team. Please allow them time to review the information you've shared. They will update you directly on the same ticket to assist further. You can access the ticket here. 

[sana987]

this is the bloody **bleep**ing system of Upwork, soon no one will want to work with Upwork. when everyone is waiting for payment and you reverse the amount after 10 days to the client. bloody fail system. and keep the Upwork hourly protection in the ass of upwork as soon as its not protecting freelancers. just a shame on this system.

[3f98e34e]

Hi Valeria, 

I was refunded two times already from Upwork, how can I get them back? Thanks!

[ArjayM]

Hi Cristhel Mae,

I took a closer look at the refund transaction and I can see that it's been processed once on your account. Feel free to respond to the email sent by the team linked to your case if you have questions or still need further assistance. They will surely assist you accordingly.

[b186653a]

Last week my hourly contract with a client got suspended and I got the email that I will get paid as I did not lock manual hours and my all hours qualify for hourly protection.

But today when the amount should be available, it automatically refunds to the client. 

I don't know how did it happen. My hours are according to the rules. 

Please help me regarding this,

Thanks!

[04fe150f]

Hello, Client allowed me to add manual hours in the contract, we both agreed to add a certain amount. But today I got notified that the entire amount has been refunded to the client and I did not receive any payment. The contract has been suspended by upwork. Is there a way I can get my payment?

[LuiggiR]

Hi Noreen,

I'm really sorry to hear about your experience. Please note that on hourly contracts when a client fails to pay for the hours logged by the freelancer and those hours don’t meet the requirements for Hourly Protection, the payment may be reversed. 

Our team will be reaching out to you via email with updates and more information.

[tsarlybee]

I have received a message from upwork that I refunded a payment. And upon searching the forums this happens when a client can't pay the amount and it was not covered by payment protection. Does this mean that a client can abuse this and fool a freelancer to work and not get paid? I will try to reach to my client as well about this. Is there a way to prevent this from happening? Thank you in advance.

[pgiambalvo]

Does this mean that a client can abuse this and fool a freelancer to work and not get paid?

Yes.

[tsarlybee]

Upwork sent me a reply. My client failed to pay for it and my logged time was not covered by payment protection.

Upwork will reverse time for the following when reviewing your Work Diary:

1. Manual time
2. Low activity
3. With insufficient or no work memos
4. With more than 10 minutes of activity not pertaining to the job itself
5. Activity that violates Upwork’s Terms of Service

Please note that the reversal will show up in your transaction history as a "Refund" even though the transaction was a reversal processed by Upwork. If your client approved the hours reported in your work diary, please ask them to make a bonus payment to you for the amount reversed.

Anyway I talked with my client and just sent it as a bonus. Thank you for responding.

[JoanneP]

Hi Charlie,

I checked and it looks like our team reached out to you already via a support ticket. You can access the ticket here. 

[2e91eeed]

So I just received an email saying that I've refunded $X to the client. The client received the same email but with slightly more details 

**Edited for Community Guidelines**

Why is Manual Time a reason to reject payment and how can Upwork decide which part of the memo does not pertain to the work itself? Perhaps the client has asked us to deliver a different product while the other one is on the shelf due to technical reasons (which is exactly what happened btw)? The client has allowed Manual Time for a reason: We are an agency; we have multiple people working on the project, and we can't run trackers on each one of them individually since the contract belongs to one person in the agency only. When the stakeholders are totally fine with the arrangements, why is Upwork trying to interfere? If the client had any issues, he would've contacted you. We would've contacted you. What's this helicopter inspection?


PS Apologies for the post in the wrong section it should've been in agencies. If some moderator can move it there, I'll be grateful

[feed_my_eyes]

Manual time IS allowed by Upwork (obviously, since they provide a way for us to record it) and it's automatically charged to the client every Monday. Upwork doesn't make a decision to reverse your payment; it was reversed because your client failed to pay. So, your client needs to sort this out.

You're using hourly contracts incorrectly anyway; your client is supposed to hire each person in your agency and then they can track their hours properly. If you did this, Upwork would have given you protection by paying you even though your client's payment method failed.

[759e32fa]

Hi Muhammad,

Thank you for reaching out to us. On hourly contracts when a client fails to pay for the hours logged by the freelancer and those hours don’t meet the requirements for Hourly Protection, the payment may be reversed. Please note that the reversal will show up in your transaction history as a "Refund" even though the transaction was a reversal processed by Upwork.

[1dfcc0e4]

I currently have a -400 pending charge because Upwork randomly refunded the majority of the hours I worked on a job. The client didn't request a refund or anything, and Upwork already accepted payment from him. They paid me and then automatically refunded it, leaving me at a loss for the job.

And now my client can't get the work they paid for because I can't put more hours in when I was never paid for my first few. 

[AndreaG]

Hi Nat, unfortunately, when the client fails to pay for hours logged by the freelancer, any hours that aren't covered by Upwork Hourly Protection may be reversed. Please check out this help article for more information. 

[1dfcc0e4]

He did pay. No reason was given for the refund. He was charged twice and refunded for one of them. I was payed and it was refunded. So he has paid for my work and I have not been.

[ArjayM]

Thank you for your response Nat,

I can see that the team handling your case has already reached out to you with regard to your claim. I highly suggest you continue communicating with our team by responding to the email or through these tickets for updates and further assistance.