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Unfair JSS

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Active Member
Tim B Member Since: Jan 29, 2019
1 of 14

I know this topic has been discussed here, but I am now adding my voice because to be honest, I am kind of angry and strongly considering leaving UpWork due to the unfair JSS I have.

 

My score is 71%. I have had 12 contracts to date. Of these, I have the following stats:

 

1 job ongoing ATM

5 jobs with a 5.00 rating and awesome feedback

1 job with a 4.60 rating, but still great feedback

1 job with a 4.00, but again, great feedback

4 jobs where the client for whatever reason did not give feedback

 

You can view my profile here to verify:

https://www.upwork.com/fl/timbishop12?viewMode=1

 

So while I may not have earned a 100% JSS due to the 2 jobs that fall under a 5.0 (though based on the feedback, I am not sure why), a 71% is drastically low when you look at my history!

 

It is unfair that jobs in which a client fails to provide feedback counts against a freelancer. While we can encourage a client to leave feedback, we cannot force them to and a lack of feedback does not equal poor performance nor an unhappy client.

 

My 71% score is TOTALLY unfair! I am strongly considering leaving UpWork to focus on my work on other networks!

 I have another reason for that, another complaint, but I think it best to put that in a separate issue.

 

Community Guru
Phyllis G Member Since: Sep 8, 2016
2 of 14

Only the nine closed contracts factor into your JSS. Five left feedback and there's no way to know what the private side indicates. On one, you left less than 5 stars for the client, suggesting that project was not altogether happy for either of you. 

 

Obviously, we can't force clients to leave feedback. That is why a sprinkling of 'no feedback' jobs do not affect the JSS adversely. You have more than 40%. Like it or not, the onus is on us FLs to cultivate client relationships such that most of them leave feedback. Whether a relationship lasts for a single project or blossoms into a long-term engagement (or series of engagements), cultivating it is part of the gig. That's not an UW thing, that's true in any FL context.

 

I did a quick search for US-only FLs using "wordpress, linux server" and filtered for those charging $60/hr and above. There are only 95 who have earned anything. 73 have a JSS of 80 or more and 66 have 90 or higher. The good news is that you are not competing with thousands. And most are managing the JSS system, so you can, too.

 

Stop thinking about whether or not it's fair. Just stop. It is what it is and it is not going to change. FLs who thrive here think of it as a tool they can turn to their advantage, by looking at a JSS dip as a chance to figure out how to manage their FL business better. Anyhow, it's fair in the only sense that really matters, IMO: we are all subject to its vagaries and mysteries. What we do with it is our choice.

 

Active Member
Tim B Member Since: Jan 29, 2019
3 of 14

I believe in leaving positive feedback. The 1 I left less than 5 stars on was a great client, but not so great on staying responsive. So I gave 4 stars on communication.

 

If "no feedbacks" do not count against my JSS, then for certain my JSS should be much higher because there are currently 10 jobs displayed in my profile. And as you say, 4 have no feedback. The other 6 one is ongoing, so that one doesnt count. That leaves 5, as you say. 3 of those are rated 5.0. One is the 4.0 and one is the 4.60,

Simple math would put the average at 4.72. That is 99.35% of 5.00. So just based on simple math, my job score should be at minimum 95%

 

So again, I have earned a higher score. I know my math does not take into account private feedback. BUT, how likely is it that someone gave you a great public rating, and then trashed you privately to upwork? I am sure that happens from time to time, but I doubt it is common.

 

Now as for your comments to not worry about if it is "fair"??? That is just plain absurd! I am in total agreement that making this a super positive and effective system for clients is priority 1. But the fact is that the JSS score has a huge impact on a freelancers ability to find work. So making sure that the rating system give a fair, i.e. truly earned score is essential! While client satisfaction is priority, do not forget that without freelancers, UpWork no longer exists. So being treated fairly should hold nearly as much weight.

 

The fact is that I am on several other freelance networks and on all of them, I maintain a very high score. That is not because I do anything different there. It is because the way freelancers are scored makes more sense and reflects the TRUE skill, reliability, and trustworthiness of the freelancer.

 

Finally, I have to say that I have found several similar complaints in this community recently. Perhaps UW and it is always blamed on the FL. And while I am sure that in some cases this is not inaccurate, I find it difficult to believe that it is the case in all of these complaints. 

 

I work hard to build my reputation here and on every other network I use, To have it tarnished by a system that scores inaccurately, well that is frustrating. 

Community Guru
Rene K Member Since: Jul 10, 2014
4 of 14

Let's try this again:

 

The answer to the question Would you recommend this freelancer left by clients after they have left their feedback, weights a lot. And you can check what your value is by clicking here: My stats

 

Clients who would recommend you is what you are looking for. What does it say?

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"Where darkness shines like dazzling light"   —William Ashbless
Community Guru
Phyllis G Member Since: Sep 8, 2016
5 of 14

Tim B wrote:

I believe in leaving positive feedback. The 1 I left less than 5 stars on was a great client, but not so great on staying responsive. So I gave 4 stars on communication.

 

If "no feedbacks" do not count against my JSS, then for certain my JSS should be much higher  -- 'no fb' contracts do not count against you UNLESS there are a lot of them, and 44% seems like a lot, to me -- because there are currently 10 jobs displayed in my profile. -- only closed jobs are factored into your stats, except open ones that stay idle for a long time with no money ever changing hands -- And as you say, 4 have no feedback. The other 6 one is ongoing, so that one doesnt count. That leaves 5, as you say. 3 of those are rated 5.0. One is the 4.0 and one is the 4.60,

Simple math would put the average at 4.72. That is 99.35% of 5.00. So just based on simple math, my job score should be at minimum 95% -- or, based on different simple math, your score should be at maximum 52% (base avg score on 9 completed jobs, not 5). I don't think the no fb jobs are weighted equally with the ones that have fb, but it does appear that if they represent a large enough proportion of your history, they do factor in somehow.

 

So again, I have earned a higher score. I know my math does not take into account private feedback. BUT, how likely is it that someone gave you a great public rating, and then trashed you privately to upwork? -- Quite likely, any time a client is less than 100% thrilled with every aspect of a project and is conflict-averse and/or disinclined to hurt your feelings or make you mad and/or like most people, simply avoids difficult conversations, but also feels an obligation to other clients to leave candid feedback. -- I am sure that happens from time to time, but I doubt it is common.

 

Now as for your comments to not worry about if it is "fair"??? That is just plain absurd! I am in total agreement that making this a super positive and effective system for clients is priority 1. But the fact is that the JSS score has a huge impact on a freelancers ability to find work. So making sure that the rating system give a fair, i.e. truly earned score is essential! -- The biggest single factor affecting an individual freelancer's ability to find work is their own combination of skills, attitude, and work ethic. The JSS does not prevent hardworking professionals with marketable skills and a business-like orientation to their enterprise from succeeding. What it does seem to do is amplify problems for those who do not possess--or choose not to deploy--all of those strengths in combination. The national severe weather forecasting system is not infallible. The fishermen who take it for what it is and add their own experience and intuition, and balance judgment and venturesomeness, catch most of the fish. The ones who sit around the dock complaining about the system and demanding that it be upgraded in order for them to have a chance, don't catch so much. While client satisfaction is priority, do not forget that without freelancers, UpWork no longer exists.-- Well, yes, but in practical terms, UW is never going toes-up due to a lack of FLs, there are too many. If quality clients stopped coming around, it would implode pretty quickly. And they would, in the absence of some kind of starting point for sifting through the universe of FLs on the platform. So being treated fairly should hold nearly as much weight. You are being treated fairly. You are subject to the exact same rating system as every other FL on this platform. You have the same opportunities as everybody else to learn about it, use it to learn about your own performance, and figure out how to work with it instead of against it.

 

The fact is that I am on several other freelance networks and on all of them, I maintain a very high score. That is not because I do anything different there. It is because the way freelancers are scored makes more sense and reflects the TRUE skill, reliability, and trustworthiness of the freelancer.

 

Finally, I have to say that I have found several similar complaints in this community recently. Perhaps UW and it is always blamed on the FL. And while I am sure that in some cases this is not inaccurate, I find it difficult to believe that it is the case in all of these complaints. 

 

I work hard to build my reputation here and on every other network I use, To have it tarnished by a system that scores inaccurately, well that is frustrating. I work hard to maintain my reputation here (and elsewhere).It requires mastering a lot of wraparound skills and services that are independent of core competencies and deliverables but are crucial to any small business enterprise. To have so many FLs who refuse to do some of that same hard work, demanding to be given comparable success scores as me and others who do the work, is both appalling and amusing.

Community Guru
John K Member Since: Feb 17, 2015
6 of 14

Tim, in case you weren't aware of it, JSS is heavily based on private feedback, which is labeled 'Clients who would recommend you" in your My Stats page. So if that's on the low side, and anything below 80 is low, then your clients on the whole are not likely to recommend you to friends or colleagues, for whatever reason.

__________________________________________________
"No good deed goes unpunished." -- Clare Boothe Luce
Community Guru
Virginia F Member Since: Feb 15, 2016
7 of 14

And in regards to your other post - Upwork's customer service reps know absolutely nothing about the mysteries of JSS scores - you will get no satisfactory answers from that front. All they can do is refer you to the info available on the site about this metric.

Community Guru
John K Member Since: Feb 17, 2015
8 of 14

Virginia F wrote:

And in regards to your other post - Upwork's customer service reps know absolutely nothing about the mysteries of JSS scores - you will get no satisfactory answers from that front. All they can do is refer you to the info available on the site about this metric.


JSS is definitely above CS agents' pay grade. Robot Sad

__________________________________________________
"No good deed goes unpunished." -- Clare Boothe Luce
Community Guru
Rene K Member Since: Jul 10, 2014
BEST ANSWER
9 of 14

Tim B wrote:

 

It is unfair that jobs in which a client fails to provide feedback counts against a freelancer. While we can encourage a client to leave feedback, we cannot force them to and a lack of feedback does not equal poor performance nor an unhappy client.

 

My 71% score is TOTALLY unfair! I am strongly considering leaving UpWork to focus on my work on other networks!

 I have another reason for that, another complaint, but I think it best to put that in a separate issue.

 


It would have been really unfair indeed. If it were true. But it's not, not unless you have a lot of jobs closed without feedback, which is fairly uncommon.

What is true, though, is that the answer to the question Would you recommend this freelancer left by clients after they have left their feedback, weights a lot. And you can check what your value is by clicking here: My stats

 

Clients who would recommend you is what you are looking for. What does it say?

-----------
"Where darkness shines like dazzling light"   —William Ashbless
Active Member
Tim B Member Since: Jan 29, 2019
10 of 14

So considering that all of my clients who have left feedback have left positive feedback,  how can I raise that would they recommend me score?

 

And I would bet money that clients not leaving any feedback effects that score as well. Am I wrong? Because I mean if they do not give feedback, they cant say they would recommend me. 

 

And just for the record, I think private feedback is an unfair and shady practice anyways. I mean, whatever happened to "If you won't say it to their face, don't say it all"?  Private feedback gives clients (and freelancers) an ability to say things that are untrue or exaggerated, without giving the other person the ability to defend themselves. While I am sure most clients and freelancers are honest and do not abuse private feedback that way, I am also certain it does happen.  Just seems unfair, and dangerous to the community, to deny anyone the right to respond to anything someone says about them.

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