Unfair Rules in Sending Proposals

[jayleenp]

Hi Upwork,

I am very concern about your changes being implemented this past few weeks or months. Since the name change to upwork, i did not get any interviews or job offers from new clients. Isn't it unfair for us who doesn't have badges? Seems we don't have any single chance to be hired by clients because when they open all the proposals, they only look on the highlighted profiles and disregard the rest. And as I analyze, it is not our fault why we have below 90 percent of job success. Some of the clients just pay and doesn't end the contract and give feedback. Please can you change the rule? that if the client already pays the freelancer in full it means the contract is ended? I tried to contact my clients who doesn't give feedback but they don't reply. And it is very unfair on our part because we already did our part and provide to them the final output. I am really concern about this because this is my only ways of living. I am a fulltime freelancer here in Upwork, and since it was change to upwork i did not have new clients. Please advise and I hope this concern will be heard to the ones who are implementing this. Thank you.

[rossmontenegro]

Nice Topic. Small but Meaningful..

[jayleenp]

I brought up this topic because this changes really change my lifestyle in terms of income 😞 sad to say, this is not happening during Odesk. I hope they will be making rules for the benefit of all

[a5337e24]

I recently switched from elance and have posted 2 projects on upwork.  When I looked at the proposals, you bet I noticed the freelancer's job success %.  To be honest, I didn't know what that meant and did not spend much time on the proposals with a lower job success %, even though they had good customer ratings.  I looked for something to click to tell me what a low job success % meant but didn't find anything.

I was surprised to read your post that job success relates to feedback given.  There were multiple times on elance where I didn't leave feedback on a project for a reason.  I agree that job success % isn't a good measurement to have. Customer reviews are what counts to me.

I also didn't understand the freelancers that were "recommended".  I received a few emails saying that they found a perfect fit for my project and it was from one of these recommended freelancers.  It felt like Pay Per Click with someone purchasing the featured space. Is that correct?

[jayleenp]

You are right Sir Keith, it is really unfair for us who doesnt have above 90 percent of job success. And its not like our fault. If they base it on clients feedback, they will see how we do well and exceed expactations from client. Its just that, some clients doesnt end the contracts that what keeps us hanging. And also, you mentioned they recommend freelancers to client? isnt so unfair for those who just new to this community and is starting to build up reputations? instead of helping new members to grow, i think it makes new members more hard and complicated to find projects here. Just my opinion

[digitalant]

I've worked on a few projects on Upwork, but only 2 of my clients have closed the project. Hoever i've completed almost 250hours of work on upwork. I've got great feedback from both these clients. I agree that job completing rates are unfair. propective clients should be able to see the job ratings as well.

[jayleenp]

Manish, i hope upwork will do something to this issue. What about all the hardworks we have in the last projects we did. We did our best just to have great feedbacks from clients. They should also give credit to that.

[noirre]

Keith, the recommendation of UpWork is not something a freelancer can buy. It is calculated by the algorhitms they have in place for each jos separately. Heaven knows how. Same algorhitm will also autohide proposals it deems a bad fit.

As far as I can tell, the choices this algorhitm makes for you are based on several factors, including the level of expertise the freelancer has chosen for him or herself in their profile (this is not public information), pages they have linked to their website (again not public information), their bid amount and if it's within what is expected from the level of expertise you are looking for / if it is in budget if it is fixed price contract and comparing their profile and keywords in it to your job post and requirements.

[jayleenp]

Hanna, I understand the porpuse. But what i did not understand is this job success rates and badges. It makes us feel not equal to other freelancers. We dont have to be blame for those clients who does not end their contracts. Please also see and give credits to the entire percentage of our work here. We did our best to get good feedbacks and reputation, and just by job success or badges implementation, most of the clients just disregard our proposals. I hope the rules from Odesk before will be retrieve. I think they are more implementing equal rights to the freelancers. Its up for the clients whom they will choose. Upwork doesnt need to recommend freelancers to clients. It just gives new members discouragement. Thank you.

[josepepitojr]

Same thing here! 

These past few weeks I'm not receiving any invitations, no job, and no income of course. At the first place, how can we improve our job success if clients don't even bother clicking our proposals? Just 4% short of the 90% top rated requirements, and I’m desperately applying on every job best fit for me. I’m getting frustrated and trying to send numerous applications, just to read the notifications… declined declined declined. I’m really puzzled on how can I improve the job success, if I’m stagnant.

I hope upwork will at least discuss this with the team, and credit some of our previous projects with good feedbacks. And reveal the secret formula of job success, so we know how we are rated.

“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.” —Albert Einstein

[colettelewis]

I have sometimes been sent irritating questionnaires by companies (not Upwork) when I have been busy with other things. I have sometimes responded with very neutral replies just to get them off my back. This is why those algorithms don't work here. They depend not only on a freelancer's performance, but also on the mood of the client. They are not impartial, they are emotive, and that is not the way to judge.

[j_scolton]

I was dismayed to learn during the webinar today that failure to attract clients has a negative impact on my reputation score. Apparently when I try to connect with clients via proposals, each rejected or ignored proposal counts against me. How else am I supposed to market myself, then?

I'm new here. I have skills, I want to build a business--but it seems there's a high chance that clients aren't seeing my proposals. Oh, but if they do see them? And I'm not what they're looking for? Failure to land that job drives my score down even further, thus contributing to a vicious cycle.

I feel like I'm being kicked while I'm down.

[suznee]

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@Janelle S wrote:

I was dismayed to learn during the webinar today that failure to attract clients has a negative impact on my reputation score. Apparently when I try to connect with clients via proposals, each rejected or ignored proposal counts against me. How else am I supposed to market myself, then?

I'm new here. I have skills, I want to build a business--but it seems there's a high chance that clients aren't seeing my proposals. Oh, but if they do see them? And I'm not what they're looking for? Failure to land that job drives my score down even further, thus contributing to a vicious cycle.

I feel like I'm being kicked while I'm down.

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Janelle,

I don't think because they hired someone else it affects your JS. It sure hasn't mine and I have been rejected because they hired someone else for various reasons.

It does affect your metrics in your stats, but I don't think it affects your JS. I could be wrong and hopefully a moderator will answer this to be sure. 

[kochubei_valeria]

That's correct Suzanne, freelancer's proposal activity, whether they are accepted or declined will be reflected in My Stats. Job Success score is based on the outcomes of active or closed contracts that were actually awarded.

[suznee]

Thanks Valeria,

I was pretty sure it did not affect the JS as it hadn't mine. I would have had a really low score if it was for rejection 😛