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jademilburn
Community Member

Upwork - Job Success Thread **title edited**

I want Community Forum Moderators to add to this thread, and really listen to what is going on.

 

I, like many others am sure have the same story.

 

I used to love Odesk, and got many job interviews each week. I had all 5 star feedback, and glowing written references from my clients. Then Odesk made alot of changes and introduced Job Success rate. I was shocked that mine was 67%. That was until I looked at other discussions and heard of other people who had five star feedback, lots of good references and yet had a very low job success rate.

 

This system is beyond unfair as

!)Upwork introduced new changes and a new feedback system. They should NOT include information that people believed was being entered anonymously, prior to the changes. The Job success rate includes information that clients did not think would be shown publicly. They left star feedback that would be shown publicly. You CANNOt use retroactive data for a new system.

2)Since the Job success rate has been started, I am now not getting invited to interview for ANY jobs, so how could I get my Job success rate, even if I tried?

 

You have made a very bad error with this.

 

Can every freelancer on this forum who wants to get rid of the job success rate feature, reply with 'Get rid', and lets see if they listen to us.

1,457 REPLIES 1,457
jademilburn
Community Member

Valeria K, can you please reply to my post, about the huge errors that are now occurring after the changes.

 

Are Upwork going to take Freelancer feedback into account on all the problems and issues that are now occurring after the changes. They should!

 

Why did they fix what wasn't broken? It was a big mistake, and they need to look at this forum and revert some of their acctions, soon.

kochubei_valeria
Community Member

Hi Jade,

 

We appreciate feedback you have shared as well as feedback other members of the Community share and we continue forwarding it to the Team.

 

Job Success score was introduced to better reflect freelancers' performance on the platform. Public feedback does not fully reflect freelancers' performance on Upwork as it doesn't consider jobs where no money was paid or all the money was refunded, disputes and other complaints. Job Success score takes all those parameters into consideration.

 

If you complete your jobs successfully and communicate with your clients professionally and on time, I am sure you will be able to improve your Job Success score.

~ Valeria
Upwork

I see. So because I accidentally entered hours in to the Work Diary for the wrong client, then asked oDesk to refund him -- this is why I lost 3% of my Job Success and hence why I'm no longer Top Rated? Sorry but that's the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen and totally unfair.

Hi Nick,

 

Refunding hours you logged accidentally will not affect your Job Success score. Just communicate with your clients, explain the situation, and let them know that you are going to refund and if possible log hours manually to the right contract.

 

I hope it will get resolved amicably.

~ Valeria
Upwork

Unfortuntaly, this JSS will make all freelancers to move to other freelncaers platform very soon, i think. It seems absolutely random, unlogical and unreasonable....

About refund money from escrow - i made it twice (once client asked for refund in a few hours after hiring, cause his project was closed and another was when client didn't get any requirements for 76 days and i ended contract and made refund). And guess what? It ruined my JSS absulutely. I have feedback from almost all client 5, many long-term clients, but because of this unlogical system  - in a few weeks i will think about changing paltfrom and start from zero... I worked here almost one year and I was happy to work here, but as many people said here - Upwork was no more good place for working now. 

Hope Upwork Team will understand it one day)

Hello 

 

Its been one year I am freelancing on Upwork.

 

I have a big issue with the rating system there.

I know alreday all the rules to get good ratings, I know that clients can give poor feedbacks in the hidden part, I know that every  weeks the ratings changes...

 

Each time I contact an agent from the customer service they copy and paste the answer that I already found on the website. I feel really upset about this rating system.

 

My rating is decreasing with no real obvious reason, and no one is abble to tell me why!

I have good contacts generally with my clients, good ratings etc, and just realise again today (happening all the time these last weeks) that my score has decrease. 

 

So if it is linked to a client which didn't for any reason did the necessery thing It is really not logic to make the freelancer loose points!!

 

I think this systeme is not really helping us.

 

I hope that I am not the only one who notice that!

 

Thank you

Are you upset with the rating system itself, or just your score as a result of that rating system? For example... if your JSS was 100%, would you still be upset with the rating system?

"Welcome, humans. I'm ready for you!"
- Box, Logan's Run (1976)

I think it is logic to have a rating systeme as there are all kind of level on this website. But the way it works on Upwork is really strange and not really logic! you can t blame a graphic designer because the client do not do his job of closing a contract  for example!

I have a good profile, with lot of good reviews...and they say that there are also some parts we don t see..this is not cool!

 

 

 

I had 100% JSS for example, but after a few refunds money to clients without my fault, suspended contracts (clients who didn't want to close contracts, cause they wanted my service in future) and long duration contracts (nobody knows what is "reasonable period" for freelancers in Upwork) it is not 100% anymore, despite of fact that all clients are happy. Is this logic?

I  have the same problem, and it seems many of us are suffering from this, but upwork seems to not realise this.... most of us have 5 stars in all projects, no cancellation, no bad feedback yet JSS drops, this will cost the freelancers and upwork loads of money.. So many are complaining yet nothing is being done.. come on upwork...

Just how does the rating system work? 

It doesn't work.  It's based on the ridiculous idea that if you don't have lots of activity (ie. lots of contracts), or if clients like your proposal but leave it pending without a contract, then the problem must be you as a freelancer. All of that degrades your score.

Hi!

I am now in soup!!!

the last working job was successfully completed and got 4.40 rating.

then i had to discontinue for a month because of my health issues. i am back and see my success rate dropped to 53%!!!!

for what???

i didnt bid for a month, no job pending, no negitve feedback!

how i am gonna bag jobs now??

 

is it fair from 95-53 for no reason.

isnt remote work known as we can resume or log off whenever we want.

 

Totally unfair


Shalina S wrote:

 

the last working job was successfully completed and got 4.40 rating.


Not really. Your three last contracts did not end well...

 


Shalina S wrote:

isnt remote work known as we can resume or log off whenever we want.


No, that is not correct.

4.40, 3.65 and 4 are not good rate??

 

out if which one was of 2 year ago whom i asked to mark as finish which was my first client.

anyways. i dont think so now i would be able to work. theres no way to recover from 53 to 90.


Shalina S wrote:

4.40, 3.65 and 4 are not good rate??


Not really, no. Not when most clients give 5 stars unless a contract went really badly wrong.

 


Shalina S wrote:

theres no way to recover from 53 to 90.


I've seen people recover from worse, but it would take effort.

This has happened to me. I just come on when I have a break from tutoring and need to supplement. I didn't realize I would have a JSS dip!


@Nick M wrote:

I see. So because I accidentally entered hours in to the Work Diary for the wrong client, then asked oDesk to refund him -- this is why I lost 3% of my Job Success and hence why I'm no longer Top Rated? Sorry but that's the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen and totally unfair.



I got docked for a job that was paused by Upwork. No complaints from client, work turned in on time, but the contract ended up costing me a great deal.

 

GET RID

oh thats bad, many of my jobs will be paused by upwork, if the client does not need my help for a while. Not like you be changing something once a week in a small adwords acc with 1 campaign. I will ask all my inactives to end the contract

Hello Valeria K

 

As you said that If we complete our jobs successfully and communicate with our clients professionally and on time, You are sure we will be able to improve our Job Success score.

 

But upwork has closed the doors for the contractors with poor job success score, to apply for new contracts or clients, therefore there are no chances for the contractors  to complete the new jobs successfully and communicate with our new clients professionally and on time,

 

But even though you are sure we will be able to improve our Job Success score. How can you be sure in the present situation that "poor job success contractors are not eligible to apply for new contracts or new clients".

 

Mohammad Iqbal

 

 

No surprise an other templae response. 

I was just informed that the job success rate will be the standard.

 

As contractors, we will have no voice to counter any information given.

 

My job success as gone down 30%, while I have a 4.88% feedback score which is no longer listed on my profile.

 

I have been working through odesk/upwork for several years, and gone through a hurricane and death of loved ones while maintaining projects and keeping up my professionalism and communication with clients.

 

You can't keep a high feedback score and not do most things right.

 

We are being pushed off this platform, and have no control or way to defend ourselves from behind the sceens communication.

 

Doesn't sound like a fair system, does it?  

Hello Valeria , 

I can't agree MORE with Jade on the UN-REALISTIC job success scores. Since October , 2015 I have been aiming at delivering client's on time , increasing the similar client's hiring rate on my profile (Long-term clients) , picking up larger projects and release of milestones on time. 

Not only this , my response time was 3 days , I started to communicate well and my response time is now 24 hours. 4 jobs in progress with assigned milestones , 4 five star feedbacks within this period and what is my rise in the job success score ? 1%

Yes , it came from 75% to 76%. I do not know what logics they are using, but Upwork should really do something about it. They have to ACCEPT that there is ineed a FLAW in their FEEDBACK System. I agree that this change has given a much more standard filteration to the resources here on upwork , and client's can RELY more on upwork as a GLOBAL OUTSOURCING agency. But , then what about the people who want to GROW ? what about the PEOPLE who want to IMPROVE? What about the people who are having repeated bad experiences with client even when it's not their FAULT? 

Jade has 63 Kudos on this post. Only SERIOUS UPWORK members , come to this discussion. If 63 SERIOUS USERS of upwork AGREE with SOMETHING , don't you think we atleast need a re-evaluation of our profiles for job-success score ? 

Thanks , 
Sheeraz Ahmad

"If you complete your jobs successfully and communicate with your clients professionally and on time, I am sure you will be able to improve your Job Success score."

 

I did exactly that, and my JSS tanked.

 

PLEASE GET RID

Hi Valeria, 

 

You did not address my issue. Please help me how can I request erase it because I am top rated freelancer. It fell from 99 to 89. 

 

Thank you, 

 

Abdil

Hi Abdul,

 

In order to request a removal of feedback, please email freelancersuccess@upwork.com and provide the contract number that you would like to have removed. Check this help article for more information.

~ Valeria
Upwork

Valeria K, your statements simply are not true.

 

Like Jade M, Nick M. Yuliya S and many of the others, I, too, am suddenly a victim to this poorly-thought-out so-called Job Satisfaction Score.

 

I've been an oDesk freelancer since 2012. I only had 1 rating that was less than 5 Stars. A 4.6 or thereabouts. 438 hours worked. $7k from 25-30 clients.

 

For over 4 years, my rating sat at 96%. Along comes this JSS and it drops overnight to 67%.  And suddenly, I cant get hired. I no longer get invites. But I DO get automated UpWork suggestions .... that arent even in my line of work!

 

Ive written scathing notes to Upwork. Very long, meticulously detailed notes. Notes to which I receive a canned response from an unaffected individual who hasnt been there and cant truly appreciate our anger and frustrations. 

 

What I am repeatedly told is that my JSS has suffered, and will continue to suffer, because of an open-ended long-term contract. This is an eLearning project out of New York City which employs HUNDREDS of UpWork freelancers in various fields. Artists, animators, illustrators, data entry, voice talent, etc. The client adheres to rigid production practices. He has to due to the scale of the job. I was brought in 2nd, following data entry. 

 

I am the voice talent. To date, I have recorded and shared 4,760 individual word, definition, sentence & keyword files with the client. Thats 4,760 animations that then need to be created, 4,760 illustrations that need to be drawn. 

 

In other words, I set the pace. One by one each group does their job until we're all on the same page again and then it starts all over again. Whats more is that like clockwork, I receive an email from UpWork, advising me that theyre putting this contract on hold while they investigate. The response is always the same. They have contacted the client, confirmed the validity of the contract and, so, the hold will be removed (again)!

 

My position is ... they got the thumbs up from the client ..  over and over and over again ... what more do they need? Perhaps its because theyre not getting their 20% from me while I wait for the next round?  That 20% is a sore spot as well. 

 

Yuliya S is onto something ... theres so much unfairness taking place here. If UpWork is going to stand their ground, cant they at least provide us with reasoning that makes good sense, that's logical, thats understadable? "You have an open long-term contract. If you end the contract, your score will go up."  ME: "That open-ended contract means my client is happy with my work and wants me to stick with him through the end of the project".  

 

And thats exactly what I intend to do.

 

And to Scott E, if you went to bed with your rating sitting pretty at 100%, where its been for years (because of your top notch work ethic) and you awaken the next morning to shhhhhh ....... absolute silence. No responses to submitted proposals. No invitations to Interview. No nothing.  You think "Thats weird." You look at your profile and no longer are you looking at absolute perfection with tremendous pride. WAIT!! WHAT?  "Congratulations, Scott E. we've calculated your new rating under our new system! We call it a Job Satisfaction Score and we think it better reflects the level of satisfaction your clients have with your work.  Congratulations Scott E., your new score is 67%!

 

BTW UpWorks help section clearly states "It will be difficult to get jobs if your JSS is under 75%'!  We wish you the best. And remember, Fiverr is just down the street!

 

In closing, a Job Satisfaction Score should only take into consideration items that actually relate to Job Satisfaction. A client-verified, open long-term contract wreaks of a happy client. An unhappy client WOULD HAVE ENDED THE CONTRACT, GIVEN ME NEGATIVE FEEDBACK and NOT REPEATEDLY VERIFIED THE CONTRACT TO BE IN GOOD STANDING.  

 

You know this is unfair.

 

One more thing. UpWork tried to force me to give a client a refund. The fact of the matter was (because I contacted the client and sent her screenshots of what they were sending.) It was a $15 job. She (Jordan) forgot to pay me. She paid me immediately, left me 5 Stars. Even after she paid me, i still continued to receive daily "reminders" that I owe my client a refund! I'm guessing what is CLEARLY UPWORKS ERROR, also counted against MY JSS?  Didnt it?  Yeah thats fair!!

 

HEY ... WHAT UPWORKS JOB SATISFACTION SCORE? I shudder to think!

Elizabeth,

 

I see that Kevin from our customer support team provided a very detailed explanation of why your Job Success score decreased back in December. It looks like good feedback that's older than 2 years is falling off of the calculation and there were some more recent contracts that weren't completed successfully. Please, note that feedback on contracts that were closed with no money paid can count in your JSS as well. Also, it doesn't look like any of your active contracts count negatively in your JSS.

Please, make sure that you discuss all the terms and deadlines with the client prior to accepting the offer and communicate with your clients in a timely and professional manner. I'm sure you'll be able to raise your JSS by completing new contracts successfully.

 

~ Valeria
Upwork
yield9
Community Member

I am with you on this, Elizabeth.  I can relate to your frustration.  I'm a voice talent too, but I don't take many jobs through Upwork anymore - the platform has just become ridiculous.

 

The funniest thing is that Upwork is actually hurting themselves by use of their mindless job success algorithm.  If I were a client and checked out any given category, I would see that Upwork has ZERO top-rated talent.  If Upwork doesn't have any good talent to offer, why would I bother posting my work here?  Sadly, the way Upwork does their job success score is actually making pathetic sites like freelancer.com look good!

What do you mean Zero top rated talent?

I just did a search for Voice Talent (since that was the category mentioned) and see a page full of Top Rated Voice Talent freelancers charging from $30 to $155 an hour.

Hi Valeria,

I do not understand exactly why my succes score is steadily decreasing, since I started as an upwork user all my work has been completed successfully for both parties, can you help me?

petra_r
Community Member


@Carlos M wrote:

Hi Valeria,

I do not understand exactly why my succes score is steadily decreasing, since I started as an upwork user all my work has been completed successfully for both parties, can you help me?


You have masses of long inactive and closed without feedback contracts. 

camm3d
Community Member

thanks!, In fact, I had some jobs that were inactive for a long time, since I was a user of elance, examples, the client simply disappeared, others came to a good conclusion but the client never closed the contract, That was not a problem because elance has a smart system and What really mattered was the good or bad ratings from customers.


About 6 inactive jobs accumulated over 3 years of almost perfect qualifications by my clients gave me a rate of 4.8 stars and everything was fine,

 

After elance was absorbed by upwork, I spent a few months of inactivity and my succes rate went down from 100% succes to 95% , is that fair? 

 

When I return to work after my period of inactivity, I do good work and receive excellent feedback from my clients, butThen a client of upwork hired me, and told me that it might take some time before we start to work, I thought it might be 3 or 4 weeks But it was months even upwork put the contract on hold, the client reactivated the contract but never had any communication with me, This situation was repeated twice, when I did not get any response from the customer after months I decided to cancel the contract and then my succes rate low from 95% to 90%

is that fair? 

 

And just a few days ago I realized that due to a repeat customer that I made very happy with two jobs that I delivered perfectly,he thanked me and paid me
But, he forgot the small detail of the feedback and close both jobs
those jobs remained active for about a month or a little more
And then my succes score low from 90 to 88%

 

Now instead of asking if that's fair, my question is if anyone really thinks that this way of calculating the succes rate works?

I don't understand how I can have all 5 star ratings or no rating and have a 75%. It seems completely arbitraty. It is huge on my profile and I'm sure a deterient for some potential employers unless they continue to scroll down and read my reviews. It seems a very unfair way to evaluate freelancers and not the least bit accurate.

The JSS is illogical.

Its impossible to manage. Clients can say one thing to you and then stab you in the back with private feedback.

I viewed your profile. You need to beg those 3 clients to leave some kind of feedback. We all know they probably are busy and dont care. Send them a message and get them to complete the contrct with any feedback.

Good luck and welcome to the utter nonsense of the JSS.

 

I understand Upwork wants to reflect the freelancer's true performance on the platform, but this process has to be fair. My job rating went down apparently because of a complaint by a client that Upwork tells me they will not reveal.

 

I feel that if the job rating is going to be affected the freelancer has to be able to counter the concern and prove their work. Otherwise, clients can just go and complain and the freelancer is penalized without due process. I do not feel this is conducive to trust that we are protected.

 

I have no problem being penalized if I have done poor work or not fulfilled a contract, but I am not ok with being penalized for secret feedback I have no knowledge of and without the ability to defend myself, especially if I have no idea which client complained because in my book I have 5-star ratings and up to last week I had 100% job success.

 

Either the process is fair or otherwise, the ratings do not reflect the real output of a freelancer.

 

Please start researching on this topic because it needs to be addressed.

 

Sincerely

 

Daniela Maldini

rsm2016
Community Member

Hello, community!

 

I do not sign on to respond very often at all, but I feel the need to step in.

For years, I have struggled to understand the value or the importance of UpWork's JSS rating system. The community forums are riddled with more comments about this than anyone wants to count, but the question is, "Is UpWork's Job Success Score, fair?"

 

From my experience and from reading through the community concerns, it boils down to the star rating. Clients provide excellent feedback, but the JSS still drops. Why?

 

Your JSS is comprised of several factors that exist outside the public/private star-rating system. This is where many people get confused.

 

Your JSS is made up of other factors like how many long-term clients you have, how active your account is, age of contracts and others. The system looks at your score in blocks of time and each block of time can change your score depending on factors like client feedback, star rating, and the others mentioned above.

 

People complain about the unfairness of the rating system because it allows clients to provide feedback that we as freelancers cannot see, nor do we have access to. Sure, this can provide a lot of headaches because why would a client give you 5-star feedback and then privately give you a negative comment? It happens.

 

Even the most successful projects have hiccups and client expectations can differ. Have you ever looked at reviews for products you order online? You'll come across two and three-star ratings and the customer gave them a wonderful review. Sometimes people hold a rating system at different standards and that's life.

 

As long as you, the freelancer are doing your job and providing exceptional quality, your JSS will level out to what your skillset really is.

 

UpWork is not hear to make you, the freelancer happy. They just aren't. It's not a viable business model. They are here, however, to make sure clients have the opportunity to source the best talent they can find/afford for their projects. The end game is to make every client so happy they have no choice, but to praise you. In the event, you have a hard to please client. Remember your JSS and follow UpWork's motto of ensuring project satisfaction. 

 

Everything will work out in the end as long as you follow their policies and take advantage of their resources on how to improve your freelance game.

I completely agree with you Daniela.

Support on UpWork is, and unquestionably will always be for the client. We,
the freelancers, who work our butts off knowing the scale isn't tipped in
our favor, and that a hiccup can unfairly lead to behind the scenes hidden
comments that can reduce our JSS, and our status as top rated UpWork
freelancers. It's so unfairly skewed in favor of the clients that it
doesn't take much for a dedicated hard working freelancer to fall from
grace. Something that can even occur due to communication gaps.. Freelancer
and client speaking different languages which can certainly lead to
misunderstandings. It's those misunderstandings that frustrate clients in
other countries and frustration can equate to a less than stellar review.
It's highly unfortunate. What needs to be understood is this is a 2 party
system. Freelancers Plus clients. One cannot succeed without the other.
Without freelancers to complete projects for UpWork client base, thered be
no profits for UpWork. Seems freelancers should be able to leave comments
abt clients that clients cant see and clients should have a PSS project
success score that fluctuates based on how prepared they were, their
communication skills, how long it takes them to reply to freelancers need
for information etc..

FAIR IS FAIR.
atria
Community Member

This is post has been here for the longest period of time. Upwork will not listen. So, it's either you will stay or not. 

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