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Upwork need to change way things works.

Community Guru
Kelly B Member Since: Jan 1, 2016
21 of 56

It looks to me like you are doing really well so far, and if you keep doing well you will get both repeat clients and invitations which don't use connects. I wouldn't sweat it too much.

 

 

Active Member
Ahmet S Member Since: Jun 1, 2019
22 of 56

Kelly B wrote:

It looks to me like you are doing really well so far, and if you keep doing well you will get both repeat clients and invitations which don't use connects. I wouldn't sweat it too much.

 

 


Thank you.
But I wish they change algorithm. So we don't end up wasting our connections. 
They could even charge more per connection but they should first fix the way it was now.

I just apply job spesificly require Adobe InDesign and I see a lot of job offer that have +50 proposal and client is idle for long time (15+ Days)
That mean upwork get 45$+ without doing anything at all  and freelencer end up spending more money on connections.

Community Guru
Virginia F Member Since: Feb 15, 2016
23 of 56

Ahmet S wrote:

Thank you.
But I wish they change algorithm. So we don't end up wasting our connections. 
They could even charge more per connection but they should first fix the way it was now.

I just apply job spesificly require Adobe InDesign and I see a lot of job offer that have +50 proposal and client is idle for long time (15+ Days)
That mean upwork get 45$+ without doing anything at all  and freelencer end up spending more money on connections.


$45 without doing anything at all ... do you think Upwork doesn't pay anything to run this site, to pay it's employees, it's IT people, it's CSRs? Do you think everyone who works for Upwork works for free?

 

Experienced freelancers who have worked in the brick and mortar world understand that we have business expenses. Anything you have to "spend" to get work is not, never has been, and never will be "wasted". It's called "the cost of doing business". This statement more than anything is what many of us are tired of hearing. 

 

Go ahead, leave online work and try to find clients locally for work - without spending a dime. I did it for many years - but I had to spend money ... on gas to meet clients, on business cards to have at the ready, on meeting clients in restaurants to pitch myself. I spent money on expensive inks for my printer because I had to show clients actual printed examples. Not all local clients I connected with gave me their work - do you think I asked them to pay me for the gas and time I used in hopes of getting a job? Of course not.

 

Many who responded are not necessarily happy with everything Upwork does, but we also understand that it's not our decision how this company runs their business. I hate some of the programs that have been introduced recently ... but is all that going to make me leave Upwork in hopes I'll connect with as many clients in the real world as I do here?

Community Guru
Mark F Member Since: Jul 10, 2018
24 of 56

Jennifer M wrote:

oh yay another "I'm new and I want Upwork to change everything to fit my limited view so I can win all the jobs!"


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Active Member
Ahmet S Member Since: Jun 1, 2019
25 of 56

 


Jennifer M wrote:

oh yay another "I'm new and I want Upwork to change everything to fit my limited view so I can win all the jobs!"


**Edited for Community Guidelines**Just read what I write.
I'm just saying my opinon and is not limited. 

Ace Contributor
Ozan S Member Since: Dec 30, 2017
26 of 56

**Edited for Community Guidelines**

 

Secondly, I agree with SOME of the things you've mentioned. I agree that a majority of clients don't even know how long their projects will take, and letting that determine the number of connects to be spent is a bit weird. I also agree that the return of the waste connects (e.g. when a client simply won't hire someone for a long period, or won't even check the website) should be facilitated, especially now that each connect is actually equal to money. The other the things you mentioned (like the service fee% being high) are things that you can pretty much do nothing about, as that's the price you pay for the value you get. Don't forget that Upwork isn't a charity -- it's a business.

 

And then, even though you're right about some of the things mentioned, YOU are in control. For example, you don't have to apply to jobs with a budget set at 5$. You just don't have to. Or don't apply to any job if you simply believe that it's not worth the number of connects you'll spend. The platform isn't forcing you into doing anything in a specific way, so it's a bit unfair to complain this way.

 

So, yes, you have some fair points, and yes, Upwork should facilitate more. But I think this is not the right way to raise issues. Not this language.

Community Guru
Tiffany S Member Since: Jan 15, 2016
27 of 56

Ozan S wrote:

**Edited for Community Guidelines**

 

Nah, we want you to win. We just define winning differently than you do. You all seem to define it as "proving that Upwork sucks," whereas we define it as "making many thousands of dollars per month on our own schedules from the locations of our choice."

 

I think many of us just can't get our minds around the fact that so many people would rather prove all of their problems are Upwork's fault than solve them.

Ace Contributor
Ozan S Member Since: Dec 30, 2017
28 of 56

Tiffany S wrote:

Ozan S wrote:

**Edited for Community Guidelines**

 

Nah, we want you to win. We just define winning differently than you do. You all seem to define it as "proving that Upwork sucks," whereas we define it as "making many thousands of dollars per month on our own schedules from the locations of our choice."

 

I think many of us just can't get our minds around the fact that so many people would rather prove all of their problems are Upwork's fault than solve them.


 

You're proving my point well Tiffany, thanks. Thanks for pointing out that there's actually a "we" versus "them" mentality here, and thanks for including me in the latter group, too. And while you went as far as claiming that we lot have been claiming that Upwork sucks, "I" can personally tell you that I have never involved myself in such talks, and have always solely pointed out the (albeit unintentional) unfairnesses I've observed in the system, like the fact that higher chance of winning a proposal war being skewed towards existing users with established profiles, regardless they're better than others or not. This is NOT saying that Upwork sucks -- this is calling Upwork to action, so that maybe they would do something to balance things out. This applies to pretty much every other issue I've raised myself or kudoed till today.

 

See, "making many thousands of dollars per month" and all other things you mentioned are not things that everyone here gets to have. I can assure you though, it's not because these people are any lesser, but because they're just "not there yet". This platform is just, but it's not equal to everyone, simply because luck and a thousand other things play a big role. Some people may not understand this because they're in need of money and losing patience, and they may then (unfairly) say "Upwork sucks". Of course, this is not nice, and of course, they're not right. But if you were true "community gurus" (lol), you lot would rather explain this to them instead of saying "you should **Edited for Community Guidelines** or find a different platform". I don't see that sentiment here. I don't see even minuscule of it honestly.

 

And I wonder -- if you can't wrap your mind around people and their problems, why even comment? There are dozens of responses here and all they do is to make the OP angry. They don't help. Not even one bit.

Community Guru
Tiffany S Member Since: Jan 15, 2016
29 of 56

Ozan S wrote:

Tiffany S wrote:

Ozan S wrote:

**Edited for Community Guidelines**

 

Nah, we want you to win. We just define winning differently than you do. You all seem to define it as "proving that Upwork sucks," whereas we define it as "making many thousands of dollars per month on our own schedules from the locations of our choice."

 

I think many of us just can't get our minds around the fact that so many people would rather prove all of their problems are Upwork's fault than solve them.


 

You're proving my point well Tiffany, thanks. Thanks for pointing out that there's actually a "we" versus "them" mentality here,

The "we" v "them" mentality in this discussion was introduced by YOU clustering regular posters as combative and unwilling to let whichever group you were addressing "win." But, you knew that.

 

and thanks for including me in the latter group, too. And while you went as far as claiming that we lot have been claiming that Upwork sucks, "I" can personally tell you that I have never involved myself in such talks, and have always solely pointed out the (albeit unintentional) unfairnesses I've observed in the system, like the fact that higher chance of winning a proposal war being skewed towards existing users with established profiles, regardless they're better than others or not. This is NOT saying that Upwork sucks -- this is calling Upwork to action, so that maybe they would do something to balance things out. This applies to pretty much every other issue I've raised myself or kudoed till today.

 

You involved yourself in this one when you created the us/them categories and aligned yourself with one group.

 

See, "making many thousands of dollars per month" and all other things you mentioned are not things that everyone here gets to have. I can assure you though, it's not because these people are any lesser, but because they're just "not there yet".

 

Right. Which, for the four billionth time, IS EXACTLY WHY EXPERIENCE AND SUCCESSFUL FREELANCERS GET SO FRUSTRATED WHEN PEOPLE WHO COULD BE BUILDING SUCCESSFUL BUSINESSES INSTEAD GET MIRED IN POINTLESS FINGER POINTING.

 

This platform is just, but it's not equal to everyone, simply because luck and a thousand other things play a big role. Some people may not understand this because they're in need of money and losing patience, and they may then (unfairly) say "Upwork sucks". Of course, this is not nice, and of course, they're not right. But if you were true "community gurus" (lol), you lot would rather explain this to them instead of saying "you should STFU or find a different platform". I don't see that sentiment here. I don't see even minuscule of it honestly.

 

I take no responsibility for the fact that the **Edited for Community Guidelines** forum platform Upwork uses deems one a guru after a certain number of posts.

 

That said, I've never told anyone to shut up, or anything close to it. If you consider refuting points or making counterpoints or telling someone that there's a more productive way to look at things equivalent to telling them to **Edited for Community Guidelines**, that sounds like a personal issue.

 

And I wonder -- if you can't wrap your mind around people and their problems, why even comment? There are dozens of responses here and all they do is to make the OP angry. They don't help. Not even one bit.

 

If I couldn't wrap my mind around their problems, I wouldn't bother to answer and try so hard and so repeatedly to get them focused on the things I know for a fact would help them make more money instead of the thing I know for a fact never will. I've been freelancing for 30 years, and I've spent countless hours mentoring freelancers online and off. For every delicate flower who has to run and hide behind a moderator's skirts because I'm a big old meany head, there's a grown up who truly wants to improve his or her business, listens, and has greater success because of it. No way to tell in advance who will be worth offering advice to and who just wanted to be patted on the head and told that nothing was his or her fault.


 

Community Guru
Kelly B Member Since: Jan 1, 2016
BEST ANSWER
30 of 56

Ozan S wrote:

Tiffany S wrote:

Ozan S wrote:

**Edited for Community Guidelines**

 

Nah, we want you to win. We just define winning differently than you do. You all seem to define it as "proving that Upwork sucks," whereas we define it as "making many thousands of dollars per month on our own schedules from the locations of our choice."

 

I think many of us just can't get our minds around the fact that so many people would rather prove all of their problems are Upwork's fault than solve them.


 

You're proving my point well Tiffany, thanks. Thanks for pointing out that there's actually a "we" versus "them" mentality here, and thanks for including me in the latter group, too. And while you went as far as claiming that we lot have been claiming that Upwork sucks, "I" can personally tell you that I have never involved myself in such talks, and have always solely pointed out the (albeit unintentional) unfairnesses I've observed in the system, like the fact that higher chance of winning a proposal war being skewed towards existing users with established profiles, regardless they're better than others or not. This is NOT saying that Upwork sucks -- this is calling Upwork to action, so that maybe they would do something to balance things out. This applies to pretty much every other issue I've raised myself or kudoed till today.

 

See, "making many thousands of dollars per month" and all other things you mentioned are not things that everyone here gets to have. I can assure you though, it's not because these people are any lesser, but because they're just "not there yet". This platform is just, but it's not equal to everyone, simply because luck and a thousand other things play a big role. Some people may not understand this because they're in need of money and losing patience, and they may then (unfairly) say "Upwork sucks". Of course, this is not nice, and of course, they're not right. But if you were true "community gurus" (lol), you lot would rather explain this to them instead of saying "you should STFU or find a different platform". I don't see that sentiment here. I don't see even minuscule of it honestly.

 

And I wonder -- if you can't wrap your mind around people and their problems, why even comment? There are dozens of responses here and all they do is to make the OP angry. They don't help. Not even one bit.


We all started out as new users with new profiles. I have only been here since 2016, but I worked in the brick and mortar world for 20+ years before that. I had to take jobs at significantly lower rates and sometimes even jobs not in my field to get a good JSS and gradually increase my rate. The trick is hard work and figuring out how to work *within* the system. I think my first gig paid 50 bucks and one of my best paying gigs at the time was hand writing letters, even though I'm a graphic designer, like the OP.

 

The fact is the OP has had what MOST freelancers just starting out here would consider GREAT success, and he himself appears on track to make thousands of dollars per month. And no, not everyone here gets to have that, but my advice to him remains: keep doing what you're doing, have patience, and choose projects to apply to very carefully. Once you start getting invitations and repeat clients, the connects system will no longer seem like such a huge problem.

 

(Also feel free to share your suggestion directly with UW, because I don't think the best way to effect change in their business model is by posting in the forums.)

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