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When clients do not leave any feedback

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Active Member
Zinka P Member Since: Jul 24, 2016
41 of 50

Tiffany S : This is a silly question, since that would be a very extreme case...

I work full time through Upwork and have one client for who I do 40 hours and then I just accept a few small jobs on the side, to keep my JSS, since Upwork only counts the feedback from last 6 months. So, if I am successfully working full time for a client, and lets say get a few contracts on the side, the ratio then stops being 98 jobs and 1-2 no feedback contracts, but more like 10 jobs (in past 6 months) and 2-3 no feedback contracts. This ratio affects the JSS a lot more.

 

If a freelancer is working full time for a client, and is obviously doing well, since they keep him/her employed for a long period of time, then this kind of system doesn't really work..

 

Going to extremes by comparing successful 98 jobs and 98 jobs without feedback doesn't really help the issue in any way.

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Luce N Member Since: Oct 9, 2016
42 of 50

As a freelancer, we are asked to leave feedback about the clients. Most of the time I really don't know what to say, most jobs go well, most clients are nice and communicate well. After a while, it takes a lot of stamina and imagination to cook a feedback to a client, which he's not supposed to see anyway. I would not leave a truly nasty feedback for a client (have not had reason for that anyway) as if he happened to be a freelancer too, he might see it. Why bite the hand that feeds me?

 

Anyway, as I often lack imagination to write a feedback to every client, especially when there is nothing much to say, I quite understand that clients lack imagination to write something about a routine job that went well. I much prefer to get 5 stars than a feedback that has been given just because it was required.

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Zinka P Member Since: Jul 24, 2016
43 of 50

Luce, yes, I agree about the 5 star rating. I think the general complaint is that the "No feedback" part usually consists of the client not even leaving the rating. If they rate you, but don't write any feedback, there is no penalty for that, since they did leave a rating.

The general issue is with clients who don't stick around to even close the contract, so after you close it, if the client doesn't leave rating/feedback within a week (or was it 2 weeks?), it is regsitered as no feedback and it negatively affects the job success score. I have had a few clients who were really pleased with my work, have paid me propely, but after releasing the funds, they simply disappeared and never got back in touch with me to close the contract and leave rating/feedback.

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Luce N Member Since: Oct 9, 2016
44 of 50

Zinka, you are probably right about the stars being considered as a feedback.

 

I have noticed that lately clients tend to work with milestones and then don't close the contracts. I've got quite a few of those. I have been wondering if it was intentional or not. 

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Petra R Member Since: Aug 3, 2011
45 of 50

 


Zinka P wrote: .....and then I just accept a few small jobs on the side, to keep my JSS, since Upwork only counts the feedback from last 6 months.

 Absolute nonsense. JSS is calculated from the best (!) of either your 6 month, 12 month or 24 month metric... The rest of your post is based on a false premise and hence equally nonsensical.

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Tiffany S Member Since: Jan 15, 2016
46 of 50

@Zinka P wrote:

Tiffany S : This is a silly question, since that would be a very extreme case...

I work full time through Upwork and have one client for who I do 40 hours and then I just accept a few small jobs on the side, to keep my JSS, since Upwork only counts the feedback from last 6 months. So, if I am successfully working full time for a client, and lets say get a few contracts on the side, the ratio then stops being 98 jobs and 1-2 no feedback contracts, but more like 10 jobs (in past 6 months) and 2-3 no feedback contracts. This ratio affects the JSS a lot more.

 

If a freelancer is working full time for a client, and is obviously doing well, since they keep him/her employed for a long period of time, then this kind of system doesn't really work..

 

Going to extremes by comparing successful 98 jobs and 98 jobs without feedback doesn't really help the issue in any way.


 Okay, so where do you draw the magical line? Upwork only dings freelancers with a "pattern" of no feedback contracts. So, you clearly think 10% shouldn't constitute a pattern (I actually don't think it does, since at one time I had 11 no feedback contracts out of 83 and 100% JSS--just going off your numbers here) and you think that my suggestion that there might be freelancers with 90% of jobs with no feedback is silly (though it's hardly unheard of among the freelancers who come here to complain about being downgraded for no feedback)...so, what should be enough to have a negative impact in your mind? 20%? 50%? 75%? 

 

How would you suggest that Upwork guess what percentage of jobs the freelancer did a great job on if only half of that freelancer's jobs have feedback? Assume all no feedback jobs are excellent? Ignore them completely and pretend that 90% of 50% is the same as 90% of 100%?

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Gwendolyn T Member Since: Aug 2, 2015
47 of 50

Tiffany - yes because there are too many factors to make the calculation as simplified as that.

 

How about if a client doesnt close the contract  themselves (or if the contract becomes inactive and upwork closes it) and hence there is no feedback given, then this doesnt count negatively as part of the in JSS?

 

If they close the contract and dont give feedback, then it would count as they clearly chose not to give feedback for some reason - a very different scenario from the contract going idle.

 

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Monique H Member Since: Jun 30, 2018
48 of 50

Hello Eric...

Your story is quite interesting. I seem to be in the same boat.

I completed the job earlier than specified. It turned out great.

Submitted my work, which was approved by the client.

Closed the job and left positive 5 star ratings for the client,

but the kind feedback gesture was not reciprocated. And

I am unsure as to the reason. It truly mystifies me. I see

that the client has left sporadic feedback for other freelancers.

And yet the client contacts me immendiately following the finished

project to ask if I would do another job. But will not leave feedback.

 

I think Upworks should have a policy in place that if the freelancer

leaves positive feedback for the client over a job that was successfully

completed, then the client ought to have to do the same. It feels quite

lopsided. Doesn't one good turn deserve another?

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Ace Contributor
Gregory John G Member Since: Mar 27, 2018
49 of 50

This topic was raised back in July of 2015 and it's still broken as far as I can tell.

 

I have been getting contracts, getting paid, and receiving praise, but I wasn't paying attention to my Job Success score.  I have received 100% feedback from every client who had the courtesy and knowledge to leave feedback.  However, I just learned that 5 clients who praised my work and rapid turnaround, value, and quality left no feedback, and apparently UpWork's algorithm is generating a low score of 83% as a result against my profile.

 

I have contacted these five clients internally and by email yesterday, and will continue to follow up every two days, but why is this necessary?

 

This could be so easy to fix.  Just require clients to leave feedback when paying, or block them from using the system.  Either that , or ignore people who do not leave feedback in your algorithm.

 

Speaking of 'algorithms' I'm a data scientist.  A few politicians have raised the idea of creating a government or industry commission on algorithms to shine the light of day on these critical influencers upon our modern life.  We shouldn't have to reverse engineer an algorithm to learn it's impact on our ratings, or reputation, or how news is prioritized to benefit one party over another.  Transparency is key, but Upwork fears that people will 'game the system' if they knew the algorithm.  The fact is that transparency is a good thing not a bad thing, and really smart people can reverse engineer any algorithm.  Cryptology is a case in point.

 

Just this fix this please by either requiring feedback from clients or removing no feedback as a component in your well-intentioned but counter-productive Job Success algorithm.  This issue was raised almost two years ago, and I'm guessing that many freelancers have been hurt by the lack of a remedy to this flawed process and algorithm.

 

Upwork has tremendous upside potential, and it will materialize in direct relation to how well you listen to your community and effect positive change rather than excuses.  Even your spell checker algorithm is flawed.  It flags 'Upwork" as a misspelling for these posts.  If you can't fix your spellchecker to recognize Upwork as correct, how can we trust you with algorithms on our Job Success score or prioritizing how clients see our proposals?

 

PS: I really appreciate Upwork and am only suggesting improvements that will make the platform better for all of us, and our clients.


Thank you!

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Ace Contributor
Chris P Member Since: Aug 17, 2017
50 of 50

this.  this exact thing.  very well articulated, considered and heartfelt.

 

no doubt there will still be those who say that you're just bummed that you can't cheat anymore.  to those I would say take your [redacted] and [redacted] it in your [redacted]

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