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Where is the newly launched "US only" website????

mtngigi
Community Guru
Virginia F Member Since: Feb 15, 2016
11 of 16

@Albert B wrote:

Don't really see the point of a US website, I've had a fair share of potential clients who flat out tell me that my time isn't worth as much because I'm not in the US or Europe. Yay for instituionalized racism!

 

My answer is still always no when they come back asking to hire me because lower-cost writers have terrible writing skills.

 

 I don't know, I just find the whole concept of a US only website racist. People should be valued based on their skills, not their geographic location. The only time this isn't the case is if there's a need for the person to be at or near the physical location of the job and those times are pretty rare.

 

I mean, this is an online platform, the whole purpose of an online platform is that you can be anywhere.


There is no US only website, as has been pointed out. There is, however, the ability for clients to pick and choose whom they want to work with, and that is most certainly not "racism".

 

As a freelancer, I get to pick and choose who, what, when and where in my search for clients and jobs - that too is most certainly not racism on my part. It's called choice, that's it. If a client chooses to hire from within a specified country, for whatever reason, they should be allowed to do so. If a freelancer prefers to work with clients from a specific locale, they should be allowed to do so. The word "racism" should not be bandied about lightly, or in this case ... at all.

yitwail
Community Guru
John K Member Since: Feb 17, 2015
12 of 16

@Virginia F wrote:

@Albert B wrote:

Don't really see the point of a US website, I've had a fair share of potential clients who flat out tell me that my time isn't worth as much because I'm not in the US or Europe. Yay for instituionalized racism!

 

My answer is still always no when they come back asking to hire me because lower-cost writers have terrible writing skills.

 

 I don't know, I just find the whole concept of a US only website racist. People should be valued based on their skills, not their geographic location. The only time this isn't the case is if there's a need for the person to be at or near the physical location of the job and those times are pretty rare.

 

I mean, this is an online platform, the whole purpose of an online platform is that you can be anywhere.


There is no US only website, as has been pointed out. There is, however, the ability for clients to pick and choose whom they want to work with, and that is most certainly not "racism".

 

As a freelancer, I get to pick and choose who, what, when and where in my search for clients and jobs - that too is most certainly not racism on my part. It's called choice, that's it. If a client chooses to hire from within a specified country, for whatever reason, they should be allowed to do so. If a freelancer prefers to work with clients from a specific locale, they should be allowed to do so. The word "racism" should not be bandied about lightly, or in this case ... at all.


US only could hardly be racist, when the US is one of the most ethnically diverse nations in the world. 

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"No good deed goes unpunished." -- Clare Boothe Luce
sergio-soria
Community Guru
Sergio S Member Since: Dec 19, 2017
13 of 16

What I find strange is this idea that has been around since the option was launched. The idea "If you are a freelancer in the US you can charge $50/h or more, and if you are outside you should charge no more than $15/h." I don't know where that came from, maybe from the CEO himself? I don't know, but I think that is what Albert is calling "racism."

 

In my opinion, a US-only option should be really useful when you are publishing a job where the freelancer needs a native insight, for example when it's a translation with lots of jargon/slang or maybe something about meals or habits from the country. It should not be a way to set rate criteria.

lakitel
Ace Contributor
Albert B Member Since: Apr 11, 2016
14 of 16

@Sergio S wrote:

What I find strange is this idea that has been around since the option was launched. The idea "If you are a freelancer in the US you can charge $50/h or more, and if you are outside you should charge no more than $15/h." I don't know where that came from, maybe from the CEO himself? I don't know, but I think that is what Albert is calling "racism."

 


 Exactly what I'm calling racism.

 

@Virginia F wrote:

There is no US only website, as has been pointed out. There is, however, the ability for clients to pick and choose whom they want to work with, and that is most certainly not "racism".

 

 Never said there was a US only website, I said I don't see the point of one if there was.

 

I also never said that the ability of picking the freelancer a client wants is racist, I said that picking freelancers from a *specific* location because a client thinks their quality of work is better is racist. Since you are in the US, it's very likely you've never come into contact with a client who wants to massively undervalue your work because you are not a US or European citizen.

 

To give you an example: the generally accepted standard for writing a basic 1k word article is, on average, around $20-$30. I've had people tell me, and I've seen several contracts, that they are only willing to pay $1 per 1k words, because I'm not a US or European Citizen (Which incidentally is technically not true, I have dual nationality, but because I'm based in Egypt I can't put another location). I've also seen lots of contracts where the client clearly says "I don't want to deal with non-US citizens because I've had a bad experience with a foriegner before" (And yes, sometimes literally "Non-US citizens need not apply").

 

 Clients offering less money because of where you come from, rather than your actual skill, is racist. Clients saying they don't want to deal with specific nationalities because of previous experience is also pretty racist.

 

@John K wrote:


US only could hardly be racist, when the US is one of the most ethnically diverse nations in the world. 

So you're saying that there's no racism in the US? Smiley Tongue

 

 

yitwail
Community Guru
John K Member Since: Feb 17, 2015
15 of 16

@Albert B wrote:

So you're saying that there's no racism in the US? Smiley Tongue 

 No, I was saying US only doesn't discriminate by race. I never said it doesn't discriminate by geographic location. By the way, it also discriminates against predominantly caucasian countries like Canada, Australia, and all of Europe.

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"No good deed goes unpunished." -- Clare Boothe Luce
browersr
Community Guru
Scott B Member Since: Nov 20, 2015
16 of 16

No one knows the intentions of the client when they select a preference for a specific country or region. I also don't think it's up to UW to sort that out. I see stated preferences for India based freelancers, Eastern Europe, etc. I just assume it's because of language, distance, cultural understanding, etc. I suppose I could also think it's because there is a bias against Americans. It's easy to tease out a narrative either positive or negative to suite the bias or agenda of anyone. I don't think any of that has a place on this site and I also see no evidence that UW is supporting that idea. They have stated prior that there is a huge US client base and a large enough percentage has asked for a better way to filter for US based freelancers. If there were a huge base of say Romanian clients asking for a way to filter for Romanian freelancers, I'd bet UW would support that. Geographic filters, while perhaps suiting the needs of the ill-educated, have enough good business reasons for the vast majority, that I don't think it's fair to paint it as a racist function (even if some may use it that way). 

 

With regards to global rates. A good part of the issue here is that there are freelancers in areas of the world who - in great numbers - choose to offer what other areas may deem to be ultra low rates. There are a lot of reasons people may do that including cost of living and competition, but the fact is that when you have such a massive majority willing to work at those rates, an expectation is formed. So if you ask why does a client feel they can offer X in my part of the world? Some times it's just an ignorant or cheap client which you can find a significant number of in the US looking for US based people. On the other hand, it can also be a conditioned response to that the fact that the vast majority in the region are charging those very low rates. You may also get the notion of the client feeling that if they are going to work with someone who doesn't speak the language well and is in an inconvenient time zone (from the client's point of view) that there should be an extra incentive which in this business is typically in the form of lower rates. In the end only the freelancer can allow things to become a "race to the bottom". Set your rates commensurate with your experience and how well you can sell your services. If you allow others to dictate your value and worth, success will continue to allude you as you race with the many like-minded folks to the bottom.

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