Will my JSS get impacted because of this issu...

aroraprince05 · ‎11-16-2020

I had started working for a client.

He gave me work after 2 weeks of wait, and was still unclear of the requirements, started immediately and then the client became unresponsive for 2 weeks.

I tried connecting on their Product Management tool, via skype and Upwork messages, there was no response.

I had to pick up other full-time work under these circumstances, I had communicated this to the client too, still no response.
Now the client suddenly came back and told me that he needs to get the work done ASAP.

I was unable to do that, so I proposed a refund and gave the money back.

Will my JSS drop because of this?
Can I raise a dispute with Upwork for the same.

martina_plaschka · ‎11-16-2020

Prince A wrote:
I had started working for a client.
He gave me work after 2 weeks of wait, and was still unclear of the requirements, started immediately and then the client became unresponsive for 2 weeks.
I tried connecting on their Product Management tool, via skype and Upwork messages, there was no response.
I had to pick up other full-time work under these circumstances, I had communicated this to the client too, still no response.
Now the client suddenly came back and told me that he needs to get the work done ASAP.
I was unable to do that, so I proposed a refund and gave the money back.

Will my JSS drop because of this?
Can I raise a dispute with Upwork for the same.

1. yes

2. no - I did not find anything in your descriptions that could even remotely be a subject of an dispute. Do you want to dispute that you refunded him?

aroraprince05 · ‎11-16-2020

My concern is I could not work because the client was not responsive and had no clear requirements.
I was on weekly retainer and had not logged in any hours yet, even though I had worked for a few hours.

So I refunded the money earned.
In the end there is no work done, and no money paid.
By dispute I mean, am I wrong here?
If not can I ask Upwork to not include this contract in my JSS calculation if it makes it drop significantly.

martina_plaschka · ‎11-17-2020

Prince A wrote:
My concern is I could not work because the client was not responsive and had no clear requirements.
I was on weekly retainer and had not logged in any hours yet, even though I had worked for a few hours.

So I refunded the money earned.
In the end there is no work done, and no money paid.
By dispute I mean, am I wrong here?
If not can I ask Upwork to not include this contract in my JSS calculation if it makes it drop significantly.

There is no wrong or right here, that I can see. You made the mistake of accepting an offer without being able to begin working. Or you began working without recording the hours. These are your mistakes, nothing the client did or didn't do. You can ask upwork for whatever you want, but there is nothing they can/will do here.

You need to understand what you need to do to avoid these mistakes in the future.

aroraprince05 · ‎11-17-2020

Thanks, Martina, I understand your concerns.
I was not able to log hours as the client told me that he will enable manual time tracking, then stopped the conversation.
I understood and started the work, but the client was never responsive or available for the discussions.
He would tell me let's meet today and then would not reply for a week.

And under these circumstances, I felt it is better if I keep the contract empty instead of taking up something such.

petra_r · ‎11-17-2020

Prince A wrote:
Thanks, Martina, I understand your concerns.
I was not able to log hours as the client told me that he will enable manual time tracking, then stopped the conversation.

Huh? Why would the client have to enable manual time tracking?

1) It is enabled by default, unless a client specifically and deliberately turns it off. It is also only on hourly contracts.

2) When you say you gave a refund, what did you refund? Escrow funds? If so, why would you talk about manual (or ANY) time tracking?

aroraprince05 · ‎11-17-2020

Okay, I will add more details.
It was a 10/hr a week retainer, and the client was expecting me to do 20 hours of work this week, because supposedly he has paid me during the last 2 weeks.
So I proposed a refund and returned the money I got during the 2 weeks as a retainer.

I had asked the client to enable manual time tracking, he said he will do it.
I started work, but then he did not enable manual tracking.

petra_r · ‎11-17-2020

Prince A wrote:

I had asked the client to enable manual time tracking, he said he will do it.
I started work, but then he did not enable manual tracking.

Why in the world would you do that if you are already paid a retainer?

Why manual time? Why at all? Manual time is enabled by default, unless a client turns it off. Why did you ask the client to enable it? Why did you not use the tracker if you wanted to track time on top of the retainer?)

Also, why did you want to be paid double? (the retainer AND manual time?)

aroraprince05 · ‎11-17-2020

So it was my first retainer contract and I was unsure of how it works.
I did not intend to get paid double, just keep a record of the hours spent.

I did not use the tracker as the client had told me he will enable manual tracking in some time and I started work on my end.

In such cases how would I add hours if my work exceeds the retainer limit?

Sorry, this is a bit confusing for me now.

petra_r · ‎11-17-2020

Prince A wrote:
So it was my first retainer contract and I was unsure of how it works.

Then you should have asked, rather than tried to muddle through.

Prince A wrote:
I did not intend to get paid double, just keep a record of the hours spent.

And why by manual time?

Prince A wrote:
did not use the tracker as the client had told me he will enable manual tracking

But only because you ASKED him!

Prince A wrote:
In such cases how would I add hours if my work exceeds the retainer limit?.

But you didn't work beyond the retainer limit.....

You essentially got paid for 2 weeks without doing the work.

aroraprince05 · ‎11-17-2020

I did not notice the retainer part while accepting the contract, and it was my mistake, I asked him after 2 workdays regarding the same, but he was not responding.

Yes, I got paid for 2 weeks for roughly 5 hours of work, I returned all of that as of now.
I had communicated to the client to clear my doubts so that I can move forward with the work but he was unavailable.

I asked for manual time tracking, as some of my work includes planning etc and during that time I may not be on my laptop, did not know that this big an issue.
I had asked the client to enable it, and he had agreed to it too, so for the hours I worked I did not start the tracker, but had been communicating over their task management tool during that time.

And I don't think it is good for the client to expect more work than the weekly limit, just because he was unavailable during the last two weeks but paid me.

feed_my_eyes · ‎11-17-2020

Prince A wrote:
I did not notice the retainer part while accepting the contract, and it was my mistake, I asked him after 2 workdays regarding the same, but he was not responding.

Yes, I got paid for 2 weeks for roughly 5 hours of work, I returned all of that as of now.
I had communicated to the client to clear my doubts so that I can move forward with the work but he was unavailable.

I asked for manual time tracking, as some of my work includes planning etc and during that time I may not be on my laptop, did not know that this big an issue.
I had asked the client to enable it, and he had agreed to it too, so for the hours I worked I did not start the tracker, but had been communicating over their task management tool during that time.
And I don't think it is good for the client to expect more work than the weekly limit, just because he was unavailable during the last two weeks but paid me.

Yes, you're right, that's not how retainers are supposed to work. The client is supposed to pay you in order for you to keep 10 hours of availability open per week. If they don't use it, they lose it. They can't just pop up in the third week and say that you owe them 20 hours of work because they already paid you for the previous two weeks.

If you're going to work with a new client and you have any doubts about the requirements or their expectations, then you'd be much better off sticking to hourly contracts and tracking your time properly.

feed_my_eyes · ‎11-17-2020

Prince A wrote:
I was not able to log hours as the client told me that he will enable manual time tracking, then stopped the conversation.

A client cannot prevent you from tracking time properly, and if they specifically tell you to only log your time manually, then that's a huge red flag. They can dispute any manual time that you log.

petra_r · ‎11-17-2020

Christine A wrote:
Prince A wrote:
I was not able to log hours as the client told me that he will enable manual time tracking, then stopped the conversation.
A client cannot prevent you from tracking time properly

I am now hopelessly confused now whether this was an hourly or a fixed rate contract and what actually happened....

feed_my_eyes · ‎11-17-2020

Petra R wrote:
Christine A wrote:
Prince A wrote:
I was not able to log hours as the client told me that he will enable manual time tracking, then stopped the conversation.
A client cannot prevent you from tracking time properly
I am now hopelessly confused now whether this was an hourly or a fixed rate contract and what actually happened....

You're not the only one. I honestly don't see how you have the patience to sort through this kind of thing day in, day out. You really ought to be on Upwork's payroll.

aroraprince05 · ‎11-17-2020

This is my first interaction here in the community, I really appreciate the support.
Will definitely be more clear regarding my queries next time onwards.

aroraprince05 · ‎11-17-2020

Thanks Christine,

I had asked the client to enable it for me, not that the client asked me.

petra_r · ‎11-17-2020

Martina P wrote:
1. Will my JSS drop because of this?

1. yes

1. ONLY if the client leaves poor (private) feedback. If the client doesn't leave any (private) feedback, the contract will be excluded from the JSS calculation

Prince A wrote:
If not can I ask Upwork to not include this contract in my JSS calculation if it makes it drop significantly.

Only if you are top-rated (which you are currently not)

aroraprince05 · ‎11-17-2020

Thanks, Petra,
As I had ended the contract after returning the money, the client has to now go and explicitly give me a bad review.
I hope he will not have time for this considering he did not have time to communicate even the work.
This is my first contract with such an outcome and will have to notice how this will impact my JSS.

Really appreciate the support from the community here.

martina_plaschka · ‎11-18-2020

Prince A wrote:
Thanks, Petra,
As I had ended the contract after returning the money, the client has to now go and explicitly give me a bad review.
I hope he will not have time for this considering he did not have time to communicate even the work.
This is my first contract with such an outcome and will have to notice how this will impact my JSS.

Really appreciate the support from the community here.

The confusion continues. I don't see a bad review on your profile?

petra_r · ‎11-18-2020

Martina P wrote:
Prince A wrote:
As I had ended the contract after returning the money, the client has to now go and explicitly give me a bad review.
The confusion continues. I don't see a bad review on your profile?

Nothing paid = Nothing visible.

Also, there is no way to know if the client gave poor private feedback.

Will my JSS get impacted because of this issue?