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expuser
Community Member

Job warning signs

When reading a job description, what causes you to go "Ut-oh!"? What red flags do you see in applications that at least puts you on your guard, if not actually skip to the next one? Here's some of mine (and others):

 

First and foremost The work is yours until you are paid in full. You own the copyright until you have been paid the agreed sum. If you choose to work for 15 cents per hour then that's your problem. If it takes longer than you thought..again, down to you. BUT. If you have done your bit according to the contract that you agreed, then the work is yours until it's paid for.

 

Asking for payment or to use your own accounts (Thanks Dave!) Money comes from the client to you; anything else and you're doing it wrong. Do not ever (unless you know the client really well, and give it second thoughts even then) pay for something for the client unless you have received the money from them first. Deposit for something; webhosting accounts; domain name; subscription for site X that is "essential for the job" etc etc. No money. Ever. Similarly, do not use your own eBay, Craigslist etc. accounts to list things for sale...chances are high that it will end badly and wreck any good karma you have built up there. And it'll be you in the frame if it turns out that it was illegal.

 

"Bait and Switch" (Thanks Selcalmel!) Clients advertise one job and then offer a different job at interview. Now there can be valid reasons for this; but a big difference between the job description and the work you're being offered should be viewed with extreme suspicion. Mostly on oDesk it's either jobs that you wouldn't have applied for if the job was described honestly or changing the rules to try and get the price down.

 

Too many people being interviewed This can be a sign that the buyer is dividing the job up and giving the various parts as a 'test' to applicants...with the intention of getting the job for free. It could just be that the buyer is looking for a very specific set of skills, or other innocent motive, but maybe not.

NOTE: (Thanks Brandon!) This also applies to the client's history...check the total number of jobs posted versus people hired. If there are a load of jobs posted but few contracts awarded, then proceed with caution.

 

Only low bidders being interviewed If you're not one of the low bidders on that job then it's probably not worth applying.

 

Long list of demands, silly budget We've all seen them; the jobs for an all-singing, all-dancing website for $100, followed by either a HUGE feature list and/or a long list of qualities required by the contractor. Luckily for you, the buyer is advertising the fact that they are a wanker (behaviour which is unlikely to change if you were unfortunate enough to land the contract). This buyer knows the market well enough to know exactly what they want; and must therefore know that the budget is exploitative...move on. And as a corollary to the above (Thanks Louis!):

 

People who bellow orders, often in capitals "SUCH SUCH WILL NOT BE READ I IF [insert term].... OTHERWISE I WILL DELETE YOUR APPLICATION IMMEDIATELY". Or "MUST ATTACH SUCH AND SUCH OTHERWISE YOU ARE WASTING MY TIME". Some people -presumably after watching Alan Sugar or that twat Trump- think that this is how bosses should behave. I see it mostly as a sign of either someone being new to being in a position to call the shots and is a bit insecure about it, or someone who is a natural git. In either case your job will be more difficult because of it. Also, these types of application are frequently paired with a ridiculous budget. Any buyers who are reading this should note that this isn't the way to go about things...also all capitals make it harder to read and you're increasing the chances of applicants missing an important detail. Annoying people before they've even applied for your job cannot possibly help. Am I the only one, by the way, who feels the impulse to reply in kind?: "Listen up bitch. I reckon I can do it in 10 hours which'll cost you $450 and if that isn't good enough then you can just **Edited for Community Guidelines** would be a fairly short application, probably.

 

Mention of half-finished job/previous contractor/s There are two factors here...sorting out what someone else has done often takes longer than just doing whatever it is from scratch. You will very probably be inheriting a hairy-arsed nightmare. The other factor -and a question you should be asking yourself (and the buyer, come to that)- is exactly why the previous contractor didn't finish. It does happen that buyers get a run of bad luck with contractors (often after playing in the lower budget ranges), so it isn't necessarily the buyer's fault. On the other hand, it could be. Rescuing a client from a wall-to-wall catastrophe at the 11th hour is one of the best smug feelings you can get as a freelancer; but these jobs are high-risk...you need to ascertain for yourself that the buyer is genuine before getting in too deep. A note to any buyers reading this: If you've already been through two or more contractors and you still don't have a result, you need to seriously consider throwing a match in and starting with fresh code. I've had jobs where it took significantly longer to find out what the hell the previous guys had done than it would have taken to just bin everything and do the job. And with other people's code, you can never be 100% sure that you haven't missed something important/broken/nasty.

 

One-line descriptions Buyers quite often don't know the information that a contractor needs in order to produce a final product the client will be happy with; that's not a problem and it's the contractor's job to ask the right questions. But when you see a job like "I need a website. Plz replie", just move on. If they can't be bothered, then neither can I.

 

Payment method not verified Sign either of a first-time user or a scammer. If the unverified user is overly familiar with the way oDesk works...warning! If it's a first time user, you may well have to do some unofficial oDesk support and talk them through it. And you might still get scammed at the end.

 

Anything where you have to create a user account on another site (that isn't the site you're working on) before you start. No. Just no.

 

Business plan with failure built in As a webdesigner, I hear 10 plans for world domination before breakfast. Some job descriptions have fail built into the very fabric of the scheme. The worst ones are the ones where you have to mess around with NDAs and soothe the buyer that you're not going to be over the horizon with his masterplan (which often as not turns out to be another bloody facebook or youtube clone). *sigh*

 

Jobs where 'clients' are mentioned I don't really like sub-sub contracting. Firstly there's there's the thought of the buyer sitting on his arse collecting cash for my work; which rankles a bit. Secondly -and more important- is the 'Chinese Whisper Effect'; where the original client's specs is filtered through the middleman's idea of what the end-client wants. These specs may well not be accurate. You *will* be doing extra work because of this. The same applies to large companies where an underling has been given the task and is now offloading it onto you; but in this case the specs are more often written down. The worse case in this latter scenario can be where it's a committee and everyone present has to get a design change in there -no matter how pointless- just to get their name in the minutes of the meeting.

 

"It will only take 5 minutes" No it won't. No job in the history of contracting has ever taken only 5 minutes. It takes longer than that to liase with the potential client, for a start.

 

Jobs that aren't worth it ((Your hourly rate) * (Number of hours you think it will take)) + (Say 10% safety margin for extra missions/unexplained bits) = (Your price for the job). If there's not enough money or not enough time, then it's usually best to move on.

 

Anything that mentions CAPTCHA or removing watermarks It's naughty. Don't.

 

Web scraping Nah. Probably illegal (copyright) and definitely immoral. You're stealing someone else's work. Worse...you're automating stealing someone else's work.

 

Jobs where it looks like a reasonable budget for the job until you read the description and it turns out that the budget is a monthly wage for full-time work of the same type This is annoying and wastes time.

 

Non-profit organisation (Thanks Mahesh!) A non-profit organisation is not the same thing as a charity. Some are, of course, but some are tax dodges, some are for groups of people, with the aim of the organisation being something you don't necessarily approve of..."Mothers in support of the ruthless oppression of Brits in Spain"; "White supremacy"; "Black supremacy"; whatever. Or -as Mahesh points out- it could just be weasel-wording for the fact that they haven't made any money.

 

Buyers asking for free work samples/tests (Thanks Anna!) It is the buyer's right to ask, just as it is your right to refuse. It's also discouraged by oDesk. All the veteran contractors (including me) will advise against free samples and in any case that's what your portfolio is for...to show previous examples of work and the standard that you're capable of. For contractors it just is not worth it...if there's 30 applicants to the job, you're spending time doing work for a 1 in 30 chance of getting a job. You can spend your entire life doing this and not make a penny. Now that I've said all that, a free sample is what landed me my first job on oDesk...someone wanted a graphic vector conversion and -having some free time- I just did it and sent an (unusable) sample graphic in. The buyer didn't demand a sample (I would not have applied if that were the case), but I proved I could do the job by doing it. Traditionally in design work, it used to be the case that the designer offered several alternate designs; but those were for *much* larger-budget jobs. It isn't worth even considering for the sort of jobs that are at oDesk. If you do choose to give free samples, always watermark them (Thanks Ernesto!). In the case of writing samples, send them as a graphic or locked PDF so that the text can't be used without paying you.

 

Free work samples - Part II If the buyer is asking for free samples and if it's the sort of job that can be broken up into smaller tasks then pay extra attention; and also look closely at the number of people being interviewed.

 

"Great opportunity for newbies" (Thanks Judith!) This means that a buyer is offering a risably small budget for work in exchange for giving you feedback. This is either feedback blackmail or investing time in order to get in the game, depending upon your point of view. You are definitely being taken advantage of; but really it's your decision...as long as you go into it with your eyes open and as long as it's all agreed at the start. Buyers trying to use feedback to change the terms after the job has started, however, should be reported.

 

Vague specifications (Thanks Louis!) It's harder to work with vague specifications, mostly, but you see quite a lot of jobs with insufficient detail. If you're extremely lucky, it's a buyer who wants this Thing to perform this Function; is busy; has correctly assessed your level of competence; and trusts you to get 'er done. This is rare. It is, however, also difficult to write job descriptions with exactly the right amount of detail. Insufficient detail could be due to laziness; unfamiliarity with the oDesk system; lack of knowledge (which is after all why the buyer is getting a professional in)...lots of reasons. The best way of approaching this -I believe- is to use the application letter and interview to clear up any ambiguities and to focus in on the specs so that you and the client both agree on what the job actually is and where the boundaries are. If you start the job and only have a vague idea of what the client wants, you are going to have problems. Possibly big problems if the job description also states...

 

Unlimited redo A job description containing these words should be approached with caution. Particularly with website work, as you're essentially agreeing to maintain it forever as part of the deal. Add a bit of mission creep to a contract like this and you're in a world of hurt. I always specify 'reasonable amount of re-do' in the cover letter. It's a contract and you should never agree to something that can suck up an infinite amount of your time for free. I understand that buyers want their work the way they want it and the 'unlimited' is mostly just a way of ensuring that their needs will be met. You, the contractor, also needs to ensure that you're covered, so best to renegotiate this phrase.

 

"Send us ID" This is not needed to work at oDesk. Don't do it or you will be very sorry. Verify who you are through oDesk, if you must, but ***NEVER*** send ID; bank account details, PayPal, eBay or any other information that can be used by ID-theft types.

 

Write to me outside of odesk This isn't necessarily a problem...everyone has their preferred methods of communication. At the first hint of paying outside of oDesk you should run away quickly: It's against oDesk rules; will get your account terminated if you're caught; and you will probably get stiffed by the buyer anyway.

 

Phishing (Thanks Santos!) The way this works is that someone sends you a link (usually an obscured one like "http://bit.ly/whatever"). This takes you to a page that *looks like* a login page to a common internet service (Gmail, Paypal, Amazon, whatever), but isn't. What the page is, is a copy of that login screen and the idea is that you type your password in and it gets captured by naughty people. It's then standard practice to use that email/username/password on lots of other common services to see if they work. If you 1) fall for it and 2) use the same password everywhere, you're stuffed. Don't trust an obscured link; and ALWAYS check the URL on a login screen, just to make sure you're in the place you think you are. Personally, I go a little further than that and keep a link with my (encrypted) password file and I only use my local link to visit web services.

 

Good luck out there!

978 REPLIES 978
chanphan
Community Member

Thank you very much. I applied many application with the average rate hour, instead of receiving an interview from job that I applied, I usually receive an interview with the same message from different client. I think these clients are scam. Is there anyone to receive the same following message ? -------------------------------------------------------- "Hi,I know you're looking for work I have 2 online opportunities for you that will help you earn. Please follow these instructions First opportunity (Potential Income is UNLIMITED): register here for FREE ****** after you register please follow the instructions. 1. Just go to view advertisements. click all advertisements 1 by 1 Log in again tomorrow. Because there always new advertisements everyday. Second opportunity (Potential Income is UNLIMITED): ********** please follow the instructions. 1.go to view ads. click ALL ads 1 by 1. After you click all ads. Log in again tomorrow. Because there are always new ads every 24 hours. P.S. People are sending me thank you messages for giving this opportunity. ----------------------------------------------------------- That is scam client. They just want you to click ads to get money. If you are MMO person, of course you know what is that sites. I love the online job, but I always apply an application unsuccessful. What is the problem? Is there anybody give me an advise? *[Removed by Admin]

Why don't you flag it. Report it to the support. Simple open ticket and copy paste the job url. oDesk team would handle that.

dont EVER respond to 'interviews' like those...thats scam city man.
lavie
Community Member

I'm really glad to have read this. This is very helpful for people like me who are new in the site. Thank you!
dbeczuk
Community Member

Hourly Rate: $2.00/hr - $4.00/hr Web Ad Print Ad Flyer The client specifies two times in his posting "you must work fast" How lower can he get? He wants someone to work with 5 pennies / hours or what? I don't understand why is this kind of jobs permitted on Odesk?. If the client pays 1$ odesk gets 10c is that even cover the power necessary to run the Odesk servers for 1 hour? The clients get cheaper by the day.
ncalee
Community Member

https://www.odesk.com/jobs/Logo-Design-Contest_~014cf28859ede06dd6?tot=862&pos=13 Well I did read the post, and some warnings apply to this^ job, like "Payment method not verified". This thread is very long, and I don't think there's a similar case.. But I would really want to know anyone's thoughts about this. I don't know, but I do want to apply.. or do I even need to apply? It's not obvious to me if it's a scam or not.
expuser
Community Member

"Competition" jobs are sort of OK by oDesk rules; but are usually ignored by experienced contractors...if there are 100 applicants, you do all of the work for a 1:100 chance of seeing any money for your efforts. It's just not worth it.
amilosevski
Community Member

"Our previous coder has coded almost 80% of the software (but he had to leave our company because of some personal family issues) " Avoid this kind of contracts. 1)Big probability of scam customer didn't pay for the job so contractor left 2)Big probability of contractor have left to more paid job or was to complex for him to evaluate I first case you are would probably encounter scam customer paying very little or in second edgy customer cos he already paid and didn't get the job done so you are getting into fire and to finish something(80-90%) done on bad foundation. Regards folks
mohinipuranik
Community Member

Thanks for the warnings Darren. I am new to oDesk and this is really helpful for me. 🙂
paris-walker
Community Member

Has anyone thought that requiring a Skype conversation can feel like harassment. Every day I'm refused for at least one job because I don't want to do Skype. But there was no requirement in the ad for Skype. I just think I shouldn't have to talk on Skype to win a $5 or $10 job. In the end it wasn't about the job or me, it was about Skype. If the client wanted to call me on my cell phone I wouldn't like it either. This is what I call Skype harassment. There was a time I did maintain a pay-in account for Skype. I used it a few times for a dating club. But I stopped paying in because it's not a necessity, just a trend. Paris Walker U.S.A.

You can insist on text-only. I don't do video at all; and rarely voice.

Why are you going after those $5-10 jobs in the first place? I often Skype with my international clients because its cheaper and easier than a phone call. Plus, I want to make sure that my client is the person I'm actually dealing with, not some fraud or flunky, and I'm pretty sure it's the same for them. I would think if you could use it for a "dating club," you could certainly use it for business.

It is far from being just a trend. I prefer interviews via Skype. A lot more can be assessed about the client, as they can you.
mdsujon71
Community Member

dear sir , when i apply for job then it show me this-- This Page is for Contractors Only We're sorry, you do not currently have a Contractor profile. If you would like to apply to this job, please setup your Contractor profile. whats my problem.
manocon
Community Member

What did you mean by naughty when you added comments about captcha's and watermarks?
cpalmatier
Community Member

ive exp a few of them myself...lol. ive been using odesk for awhile now and consider myself a veteran of odesk. i know what helps get me jobs, i can tell if the client is on the up-n-up, if the pay is right for the work being asked for, etc., etc... for the noobs out there, sometimes it just takes a lot of trial and error, and a whole lotta common sense with basic professionalism thrown in too.... anyways...really good post man...i gave ya a '10'! 🙂

You've mentioned that you're already a veteran here in Odesk. Please give me some advise how will I know or feel if the client is legal and not scam? Thank you.
charliday
Community Member

Also clients who try to chat you up on interview and tell you what to wear .... :0)

wear? As long as it is a female client.... ( will not complete the rest ) 😞

Hmmmph. Everyone gets improper sexual advances but me. *Grumps*

wait! what? what to wear at an online interview? it it's on skype withthe camera on, sure, you dont want to show your trousers that have coffee spots and cigarette holes, and a witch like hair, but otherwise? LOL
madelinefoster
Community Member

I reply with over ten links to things I have written, clearly shows my writing abilities and the contractor insists that I write an article to show them my writing style. Articles are a hot commodity and web owners need tons of content, what better way to get some than having a bunch of free blogs or articles with keywords written for free. I like the suggestion above - however PDF is easily converted so the graphic is a better choice in that instance, but here is what I do, I write the article and before I send it,I place it on my own article site. When I send it, I tell the contractor this is now on the website and will not pass copyscape. The article is no longer useful to them and lets them know that you are not easily taken for. You have not written it for nothing then. I get so aggravated when people expect the moon for a dollar, like take a hike for real, you would not even pay your dog those wages why do you think anyone should work for them.......any way I digress, I could go on forever. Just venting lol

And that is still a waste of your time -- when you could be writing and getting paid for it. If a client can't see that you can write by viewing your portfolio, then do you really want to work for someone who is likely to reject everything else that you do? Not me.

Hey I just signed up today and thank God this is the first place I came before applying for any jobs and get scammed. Please help know how to convert an article to graphic? Much appreciation.

You'll need a graphic program. Get your article up on screen so it's readable, press the printscreen button and then open your graphics program (The Gimp does the job and is free) and press file --> new --> edit --> paste...with a bit of luck you will now have that screenful as a graphic, then you just save it. You may need to do this several times if you have several screenfuls. The non-free option (and the one I use) is Faststone Capture, because it can auto-scroll and capture long documents in one hit. At $19.95 for a lifetime licence it's well worth it (for me anyway, as I also use it for knocking up client tutorials...with 'long page' capture and a few tools for annotating those screencaps it's ideal for this sort of thing).

Is it similar to saving the print screen image using paint? I did that recently in a contest on freelancer.

It's exactly that. The best file formats to save text in are .GIF and 8-bit .PNG (because you can limit colours to save on filesize, seeing as it's (probably) black and white text, with a few greys thrown in for feathering), so any graphic program that can output in one of those formats. The only downside to the screen print option is you have to do it multiple times if it's a long document. Faststone Capture makes it a painless 1-click operation -however long the document is- but does cost a little money. As an alternative, you can use Libre Office (free), export as a PDF and add a password and disable copying from the document. Neither of these methods are foolproof, though...you can use OCR on images and there are ways of ninja-ing PDF files too.
rargana
Community Member

Thanks Darren for the list of things to remember. Just one question: if the client do an interview, sending me message through Odesk, verifying payment method, not asking for initial payment to them..can I consider it as legal and not scam?
expuser
Community Member

Hard to tell without knowing more. Responsible clients interview; usually over skype...that's just a way of finding out if you and the client can work together and also a good time to ask any questions you have about the job. What's this about a payment to the client though? That should never happen.
kimmiemooo
Community Member

invited to interview for an HR Payroll position. As of this writing there were 46 applicants - all initiated by the client - and 4 interviews. The job involves printing checks. :| Reported. This guy evidently posts this everywhere about every month or so.
nathanklie
Community Member

What about those that tell me that they have 10 hours of work for me to do. Week one went great! I work fast finish in 7-8 hours Week two went good! Work 5 hours Week three went bad. Hey hold on don't do anything yet week four Im going to have to charge you an hour a week even if you don't have work for me.. Week five. Seriously thinking of dropping the contract so I can find other work. Any suggestion ? Thanks
jamolod-umbo-vic
Community Member

I have been one year in odesk, and odesk is really a good site, but we really have to careful to a lot of clients who are unfair and needless to state, liars on the loose. several times, I am placed in a compromising situation, but, the only way is to defend yourself and tell the truth. I am happy we have a way to interact now and share experience. Yes, contractors need to be very careful, other wise we will just be used.
jan-rachelle
Community Member

Boy am going to use this and the forum for reference! I know I am not alone!!
revozex
Community Member

Thankyou very much for a great list! It is really a great 'framework' to discard the potentially bad jobs 🙂
phinepadilla
Community Member

I really appreciate for what i have read here, as newbie, I learned a lot on how to get started here in odesk world. Thanks a lot people!
amilosevski
Community Member

Forcing low price(5$ was budget) for building reputation. "We're looking for individual who are new to Odesk. This is a good opportunity for all the starters who wants to build reputation here. This project involves using Adobe flash and Photoshop. We need a very simple animation intro for our newly created gaming company with sounds. If you're interested please start your cover letter with the word "game". This should be the very first work in your cover letter. Also if you can show us your previous work it would be better. We need something similar to this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhPR0lLqiCg We'll give 5 stars for the candidate that we will hire and won't give any negative feedback"
amilosevski
Community Member

Facebook Zynga Poker game Duplicate Same as that one Fixed Price Project - Est. Budget $500.00 - Posted 5 hours ago Duplicate!!! Ahhahahahaha. For 500 bucks :))))))))))
glhllns8681
Community Member

I am new to Odesk but not to the world of freelancing sites and received an email stating I was "awarded" my first job. In checking with Odesk nothing had been actually awarded and this was a Captcha job stating they would release payment after 12$. Thanks for your post I'd never seen that type of job before but I knew to follow my red flags away.

I am new to ODesk as well. I want to share my experience with everyone, so newbies like me know what to avoid here. I was asked for an interview on Skype. I was ok with it until the (so called) client came online. He/She had a very inappropriate Skype Profile Pic (warning #1). Then the first question he/she asked me was my age (warning #2). Then he/she wanted to have a video interview (warning #3 as it was not mentioned anywhere in the job description). I said my webcam wasn't working, but wanted to ask more about the company just to know if I was missing out on anything. But after few questions the person replied that I've reached the limit of questions that was allowed to ask (warning #4 cos I don't think there ever was a limit). Then the person had some weird racist comments (warning #5). The person claimed to be from USA and was actually kind of mocking me. However, the person's English was really poor and to top it off: that person was VERY RUDE. So I declined the offer and flagged the job post as inappropriate. Please Beware of people who are unprofessional, rude and ask non related questions..
cosgabriel
Community Member

Some people watched too much CSI or other Hollywood action flicks and seem unable to grasp how reality works. Just found this ad and seemed too funny: "I require a photoshop expert (or basically an expert in this field) who knows how to use the functions in photoshop to see through a person's clothing and give me a breakdown on the steps" So, yeah, if you know how to use the "boobs reveal" brush, this guy has some work for you. 🙂
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