Students ... impossible to be hired

[n_veronesi]

Hi everyone ! I’m Nicole and I am 21 years old and I came drone Italy but I am at my first year of international communication in Groningen .
I feel a bit frustrated because I have applied to a lot of jobs but I think I am not considered because I am a student !
Even thought I have many certifications with languages ( of course from external institutions verified ) no one picks me !
I feel so disappointed ...
What can I do ?
Thanks

[sergio-soria]

Well, I am not a translator but there are some experts on that matter here in the forum that will surely help you.

First of all, don't get discouraged. It's really hard to get hired here when you don't have a job history, but it's not impossible. It doesn't matter if you are very young or are still a student, you still can get some jobs.

Second, you will need to revise your profile. With all due respect I find it a little sloppy, even your post here reads a little sloppy. For instance, you leave a white space between a word and an exclamation mark. That's a rule in French but not in English! If you write your overview in English you must follow the English punctuation rules, not French ones. This may sound as a silly detail but it's not. When prospective clients screen freelancers they do care, especially in your area. in other areas, let's say software development or illustration you don't need to be an ace at languages but in translations you must be almost perfect. If you are sloppy in your overview they will not take you seriously.

One more thing, it's said that a translator should translate documents only to his/her native language. In your case that would be Romanian; however, if you have lived many years in Italy I guess you have enough background to translate into Italian as a native speaker, I don't know for sure. Don't try to cover too much. If you are really good at Italian stick with that one and you will get more credibility doing so that trying to translate to every language you are fluent at.

[n_veronesi]

Hi! Thanks for the answer. Now I know what I have to change to be considered more.
Thanks!
Long story short, I was only born in Rumania, I am adopted. I lived in Itlay for 10 years and 5 years in Germany and 4 years in England because my dad’s English.
And now I am doing the university in the Netherlands.
By the way many thanks!

[petra_r]

Your overview is really poor with lots of mistakes.

The fact that you are marketing yourself as a student rather than as a professional has been mentioned already.

Also, living in a country for a few years does not make you fluent. I've lived in England / Scotland for decades and don't (usually) translate into English.  I've lived in Italy for over 5 years and would not even try to translate from Italian, let alone into it.

A client will see the sloppy English on your profile and assume that your other languages you declare to be fluent in are equally not really up to par for a translator.

I also see no indication on your profile that you actually *are* a translator.

Someone who speaks several languages is not automatically a translator any more than someone who has bought a scalpel is a surgeon.

You haven't taken a single language related test. The two tests you have taken are entirely unrelated to what you are trying to sell and have poor results (never show tests with below average results. You want clients to see what you can do well, not what you can't!)

[n_veronesi]

In fact I am not an official translator ! Since i’ve Not completed my study yet ( at the university ) I know italian really well ( since I am italian and I know the language !

But I kinda am a student at the university what else should I put ? I am not that kind of girl that lies on the curriculum.

My overview of course is poor since I just finished school and I don’t have a lot of experience otherwise I won’t be here.
Well but when you live in a country for a few years you get you passport and citizenship ( things that I have from both England and Italy)

As regarding the last sentence I apriciate the tip but it seems kinda rude... maybe in a way that you didn’t mean to but I feel like it is , sorry if I misunderstood thought.

Thanks for the feedback , have you got any tips for me ?

[petra_r]

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@Nicole V wrote:

Well but when you live in a country for a few years you get you passport and citizenship ( things that I have from both England and Italy)

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 Neither a passport nor citizenship makes you fluent in a language or able to translate (which is not, in any way, shape or form the same.)

Your English is not anywhere near good enough to translate into it.  If your German is at a similar level, the same goes for your German. I have no idea what your Italian and / or Spanish are like.

There is nothing on your profile that hints at you being any kind of translator. (Official or unofficial)

There is no portfolio showing the translations you have completed. There is no hint anywhere of translation experience or competence.

You are trying to get people to pay you for a professional service.  At the moment there is nothing on your profile that even faintly suggests that a client should pay you for their translations over any of the other candidates.

[n_veronesi]

I actually think that this says it all. I have an IELTS certification ( in order to get the citizenship you have to pass an English test.
About the portfolio .... just one thing I don’t know if I have to include the name of the companies .
Should I also post my I’d card ?

[petra_r]

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@Nicole V wrote:
1) I actually think that this says it all. I have an IELTS certification ( in order to get the citizenship you have to pass an English test.
2) About the portfolio .... just one thing I don’t know if I have to include the name of the companies .
3) Should I also post my I’d card ?

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 1) That doesn't mean you speak English at an advanced native level. You don't. If you don't, you should not attempt to translate into it. 

2) You don't have to include the names of the companies, no.

3) Absolutely not! Unless you want your identity stolen, that is.

[n_veronesi]

Ok thanks a lot ! Sorry if you felt disrespected I didn’t mean to .
So you think I should include the documents that I have already translated !
Thanks really appreciate

[petra_r]

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@Nicole V wrote:
1) Ok thanks a lot ! Sorry if you felt disrespected I didn’t mean to .
2) So you think I should include the documents that I have already translated !
Thanks really appreciate

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 1) I don't feel disrespected at all 🙂

2) Yes! As long as you have the right to use them.

Your profile is now worse than it was before.  PROOFREAD! It is crawling with mistakes. You can NOT!!! translate into any language other than your native one (presumably Italian) - it will go terribly wrong and you'll end up in serious trouble.

Reset your language  proficiencies. Your English is not "Native - bilingual" - in fact even "fluent" is stretching the truth.

[n_veronesi]

What do you mean by worst than before ?

[petra_r]

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@Nicole V wrote:
What do you mean by worst than before ?

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 I mean that your profile was bad before you tried to fix it, now it is worse (not "worst".)

[n_veronesi]

Yes sorry but I am dislexic and sometimes I read one thing from another ..... I know it was but that’s why I am asking for help

[n_veronesi]

ok what do i have to improve ?

[colettelewis]

Nicole,

If you are dyslexic, then really, you should not be offering any kind of writing skills including translation. This is nothing against dyslexic people. I know two who are technological experts at governmental level, and I work for a dyslexic writer. But if you are offering written language skills on Upwork, your dyslexia is likely to prevent you from seeing written mistakes and clients will not like this. 

Being a student has nothing to do with your not getting a job. There are many very successful students on Upwork. However,your English is certainly not at native level and your overview and profile are simply not believable at your age.I would suggest that you finish your studies and then get some real job experience in the real world before becoming a freelancer.  

[n_veronesi]

1) I'm not dyslexic is a joke we make in Italy
2) what is unbelievable in my profile?

[gilbert-phyllis]

"I don’t have a lot of experience otherwise I won’t be here."

It seems that you misunderstand freelancing and/or the Upwork platform. Freelancing is not an arena to gain initial work experience. To succeed, you need to have already mastered the discipline in which you are offering professional services. On Upwork, you are competing with thousands--or tens of thousands, or more, depending on your field--of people with decades of success under their belts.

[n_veronesi]

With all due respect to you, a freelance can also be someone who has no experience but has some skills. It’s written nowhere that I can’t be a freelance writer, translator.

And all the comments on this post really offends me because have you seen how I work? No
Do you personally know me and can tell that I don't know the languages I claim to know?
Do you know my personal life, and me in general?

[katrinabeaver]

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@Nicole V wrote:
With all due respect to you, a freelance can also be someone who has no experience but has some skills. It’s written nowhere that I can’t be a freelance writer, translator.

And all the comments on this post really offends me because have you seen how I work? No
Do you personally know me and can tell that I don't know the languages I claim to know?
Do you know my personal life, and me in general?

---

 There's no reason to be offended. Sometimes the truth is a hard pill to swallow. You have gotten a lot of great advice from seasoned freelancers here, some of which are also clients. It is hard to get started here, most don't ever make a dime. The advice you're getting is golden and you shouldn't be offended by it but learn from it. 

[n_veronesi]

There are several reason to be offended.
1) I’ve practically been told that I can't write in English, even if I am a mother tongue.
2)I’ve practically been accused of lying on the languages I know and in which I am the mother you tongue only because I don't take tests up here because I already have most serious certifications
3) I’ve been told that practically my profile sucks but no real solution came.

I consider all this an insult, maybe is a cultural thing but to me yes these seems insults

[colettelewis]

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@Nicole V wrote:
There are several reason to be offended.
1) I’ve practically been told that I can't write in English, even if I am a mother tongue.
2)I’ve practically been accused of lying on the languages I know and in which I am the mother you tongue only because I don't take tests up here because I already have most serious certifications
3) I’ve been told that practically my profile sucks but no real solution came.

I consider all this an insult, maybe is a cultural thing but to me yes these seems insults

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 ____________________________

Nicole,

Your profile "sucks" because it is not realistic. You have stated that you are a native speaker in three languages. We can judge your English from the way you write in this thread. If English is your native language, then you need to go back to school and learn how to write it.  

Nobody wants to "insult" you, but you are setting yourself up for a monumental fall unless you change your attitude, and streamline your profile to make it believable. If you are young, and a student, then it is highly unlikely that you have much experience in any job or any language. I would suggest you cut down the languages to the two that you are most comfortable in - and work on them - certification does not make you a native speaker. Also you have three below-average scores for your tests in a language you claim to be native in. This does not look good to a potential client. I suggest you hide these results until you can achieve at least an above-average score. 

You also need to add a portfolio, which highlights your skills as a translator. 

There are some very good tips about how to get started on Upwork written by Upwork's team. You should read it and follow their advice on how to write a profile. 

https://community.upwork.com/t5/New-to-Upwork/Getting-Started-on-Upwork/m-p/264214#M2460

[n_veronesi]

Very kind and respectful person that wrote the comment thanks!!!

[n_veronesi]

I am a native of all the languages I have written!!!! Every one has his own opinion.
Is no secret that we Italians don't know the grammar you foreign people learn too much the grammar but in the day we use a lot of colloquial expressions etc... No one really cares about grammar in Italy

[gilbert-phyllis]

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@Nicole V wrote:
With all due respect to you, a freelance can also be someone who has no experience but has some skills. It’s written nowhere that I can’t be a freelance writer, translator.

And all the comments on this post really offends me because have you seen how I work? No
Do you personally know me and can tell that I don't know the languages I claim to know?
Do you know my personal life, and me in general?

---

 It's written in metaphorical stone that you can't be a successful freelance anything unless (1) you are able and willing to present yourself and your capabilities in the best possible light, (2) you are quick to learn and adapt, and (3) you have a thick skin.

None of us need to see how you work, we see how you are positioning yourself. I am not multilingual myself but I can tell you that your written English is nowhere near good enough to attract quality clients who are looking for someone fluent in English. As for your personal life, that's completely irrelevant and the fact that you bring it up in this context underscores your lack of readiness to succeed here. Does that mean you never can? Of course not. But you have zero chance until you make some changes.

The smartest thing you've done is come here seeking input. You've been offered a lot of sound advice from some of the most successful FLs on the platform--for free. As the essence of freelancing is individual choice, you can get down off your high horse and pay attention, or not.

[n_veronesi]

Ok fine thanks for your opinion!

[versailles]

I've noticed that people very, very often, overestimate their skills in their foreign languages. Not always out of dishonesty by the way, but sometimes because they do not realize their flaws in a language.

I understand that it may be a hard pill to swallow when native speakers of your foreign language tell you that your fluency is not really as strong as you thought it was.

I speak two mother tongues, and I'm fluent in a third one. Sometimes I run into people who are very confident about their command of one of them. They are often wrong.

[n_veronesi]

I understand that buy is not my fault of I am mother tongue in three languages! Why would I lie on it? I mean what kind of people does that

[colettelewis]

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@Nicole V wrote:
I understand that buy is not my fault of I am mother tongue in three languages! Why would I lie on it? I mean what kind of people does that

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 _____________________

I think you have simply overestimated your linguistic abilities. The above sentence alone is so full of mistakes, that many people who only have conversational English could write it better. I think you need to study more and stop being so defensive. I'm sure you speak all these languages sufficiently well to get a very good job in the hospitality industry, but you are not -yet - a translator, nor are you ready to freelance. 

[n_veronesi]

Ouhhhhh finally!!!!!!! Good advice! Thanks !
I don't agree with what you say but that’s ok people have opinions and you have to deal with them

[versailles]

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@Nicole V wrote:

I don't agree with what you say but that’s ok people have opinions and you have to deal with them

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Nicole, you don't have to agree with anyone's opinions. But when native speakers of English tell you that your English is not at a native level, it is not an opinion. Honestly.

[n_veronesi]

Well I am a native speaker 😂😂😂 in which language do I have to tell you guys?

[colettelewis]

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@Nicole V wrote:
Well I am a native speaker 😂😂😂 in which language do I have to tell you guys?

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 _____________________

Nicole, you don't have to tell us. We can judge for ourselves. We have given you advice. If you don't want to take it that is entirely up to you.

But in answer to your original question, you are not getting replies to your proposals because you are offering skills that you simply do not have. Your English needs serious improvement. You can believe this or not and act on it or not - but it is unlikely that you will survive on this site as a freelancer unless you do. 

[mtreideheuser]

Scottish ain't englisch. You'll notice that if you try to order Whiskey and Cola in the same order / glass. 

[n_veronesi]

Thanks I really didn’t know 😂😂😂😂 my dad is Scottish but I lived in Southampton for 5 years and half that’s why I said English

[mystudiomke · Accepted solution]

Hi Nicole,

Its because you're marketing yourself as a student. Put yourself in the client shoes, with a large pool of translating freelancers are they going to go with the student or the person with experience. 

Why do you market yourself as a student anyway? When I hear student, I think right of way you're still learning and need a lot of hand-holding. On a client mindset, I just want the job done right and precise. I would remove that completely and focus on your strengths. That will catch your prospective client interest.

Also, your summary needs a lot of work, check your grammar and spelling.  Take a look at other fellow translators and see how they are marketing themselves. 

Hope that helps,

[n_veronesi]

Hi!
Thanks for replying to my post!
I completely forgot that part of marketing! It’s basically the same thing as a product advertisement.
Thanks a lot
Can I ask one more thing?
I don't have a Vat number since I am not a company. What can I do ?
Many thanks

[martina_plaschka]

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@Nicole V wrote:
Hi!
Thanks for replying to my post!
I completely forgot that part of marketing! It’s basically the same thing as a product advertisement.
Thanks a lot
Can I ask one more thing?
I don't have a Vat number since I am not a company. What can I do ?
Many thanks

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 You do not need a VAT number to be paid on upwork, but you will have to pay VAT on your upwork fee, which gets taken out automatically based on your country of residence. 

[martina_plaschka]

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@Nicole V wrote:
Hi everyone ! I’m Nicole and I am 21 years old and I came drone Italy but I am at my first year of international communication in Groningen .
I feel a bit frustrated because I have applied to a lot of jobs but I think I am not considered because I am a student !
Even thought I have many certifications with languages ( of course from external institutions verified ) no one picks me !
I feel so disappointed ...
What can I do ?
Thanks

---

 No reason to be disappointed, you just need to do your homework first.

You have taken 4 tests, and achieved solid below average results on all 4. That looks really bad, hide these results! Take many more tests, and display ONLY excellent results. 

Next research sucessful freelancers and what they do differently.

Lastly, grow a thicker skin, freelancing is not for the faint of heart. Many people take it very seriously and depend on it for their sole income. 

Even if you want to do it as a hobby - which you seem to want to - you still need the same professional approach as the ones who feed their children through this platform.

[kochubei_valeria]

All,

A few posts and replies to them have been removed from this thread for Community Guidelines and this thread has been closed from further replies.