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thebookdoc
Community Member

Professional Ghostwriting Fees

I've noticed part in shock, part in anger and part in dismay that ghost writing fees are near-nuts low. When I contract with a publisher to write a book I get somewhere between 17 and 25 cents a word as an author with my name on the cover and the opportunity to earn even more in royalties once the advance is earned out. Jobs here get offered @ $200 to write a 30,000 word book -- about 2/3 of a cent per word -- or 20 times less than what I get publishing under my own name. Worse, if my name is not going on the book, there will be no royalties and I sell all the rights, I would expect my rate to double (35 to 50 cents a word). 

What are professional ghost-writers on this site charging for ghostwriting? People who invite me to these jobs tell me my rate is beyond their budget even when I charge 10 cents a word. They must then turn around and hire some hack with no experience. Why do they even approach me when my rate is clearly listed on my profile at $30/hour? 

Thanks for any feedback.

Richard

6 REPLIES 6
yitwail
Community Member

Richard, I'm a developer, not a writer, so can only make general observations, but out of curiosity, what is your profile Experience Level setting? Mine is set to Expert, but looking at my profile as a client would, there's no indication of experience level. And when I do a freelancer search, there are a number of filters, but experience level is not one of them. So there's nothing obvious to deter a client looking for an Entry Level ($) freelancer from inviting an Expert freelancer. Cat Sad It might also be the case that Upwork algorithms randomly recommend you to some clients without taking into account your rate, etc. Robot Embarassed

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"No good deed goes unpunished." -- Clare Boothe Luce
lysis10
Community Member

the ebook stuff is trash here. There are a few gems. I had someone laugh when he said he wanted a professional programmer and I said ok $1500 and he was all "hahaha I was thinking $200" and I just said good luck with the ESLs. These people are just making trash for kindle.

 

I did some ebooks in the beginning of last year and have one client that pops up every now and then. Come to think of it, it's been the longest I've heard from her (1 year) since my last one with her. Other than that a majority of ebook stuff here is trash.

tlsanders
Community Member

Richard, I don't charge by the word, but offer a flat rate for book work. For example, I wrote one roughly 40,000 word book through Upwork for a flat fee of $6,000. More than 95% of the content was contained in a webinar series provided by the client, so there wasn't more than 2-3 hours of research involved in the whole project. It took me about 120 hours, which nets out to $50/hour--substantially lower than my hourly rate on websites, blogs, etc., but worth it to me because I much prefer immersing in a larger project. 

 

Had research/interviewing been required, my rate for the same book would have been in the $11,000 range. Though I haven't won a project at that rate on Upwork, I have been seriously interviewed a couple of times with no request to reduce my rates. On one of those jobs, the person who was hired had bid only slightly lower, and I don't believe price was the deciding factor.

 

I've written several 10,000ish word e-books for about $1,000 each, though in areas in which I have a great deal of experience and so little research is required. 

 

A few thoughts that may or may not be of use to you:

 

Upwork (and other freelancing sites) have a large contingent of what I think of as Amazon publishers. They make their money by churning out relatively low-quality content, but taking advantage of the exponential effect of having numerous offerings. They make their money in the aggregate, earning only (in most cases) hundreds of dollars per book, so they have no budget to hire truly qualified writers--and, for their purposes, they don't need us.

 

I think it's unlikely that you will ever see the type of increased rates for ghostwriting that you reference in your post on Upwork, because most serious clients who come to the site looking for someone to write a book are not in the publishing industry and have little sense of "going rates" and how to discern among writers. In addition, many of them are writing books that are intended to enhance and promote their businesses, not to make money. So, unlike a publisher, they are not shelling out $20,000 in hopes of bringing in much more. The expense, for them, is more akin to buying advertising.

 

I also think you may be doing yourself harm by speaking in terms of per-word rates. To people outside the writing and publishing industry, that sounds funny and a little outrageous. Surely you've had friends make jokes to you about making thirty cents for writing down "and"? Same perspective, but it's not so entertaining to the guy who feels like he's paying three bucks for a ten-word sentence.

 

I always bid on a per-project rate. I know other writers here who do well working only on hourly contracts. For the most part, I don't believe that the client base here speaks per-word. There are exceptions, of course, but most Upwork writing clients seem to be from outside the industry. 

datasciencewonk
Community Member

I've severely narrowed down the type of long form content I write for Upwork clients. 

 

A few of my Upwork chums understand why (it has to do with a nasty client issue I experienced). 

 

Have I written e-books in the past? Yes, it was an exploratory data analysis of sorts.

 

Not worth the time nor aggravation (speaking only for me; I notice there are other Upwork writers who seem to love taking on those .01/.02 per word jobs, so this is in no way disparaging their choices). 

 

Admittedly, at first,  I was dismayed by those types of lowball offers; now I just ignore them on my job feed, or immediately decline the invitation. I have the power of choice, and rage/anger about others financial choices in terms of payment only serves to drain that power (there's no such thing as living rent free inside my head; it's like trying to live in Manhatten, supreme $$$ to access my cognitive real estate). 

 

In fact, a client just sent me an invitation with a $50 budget. Now, I don't jump the gun and automatically assume it's not a placeholder, but, if I decide to engage in the interview process (it basically comes down to my interviewing the client more than they're interviewing me), they'll receive a counter offer listing my rate on a per word basis.

 

I also tell clients that, for a fixed rate contract, the parameters of the writing must be precisely delineated. They are responsible for sending a specific topic, I stick to the word count, and provide one copy-edit per milestone. Hourly clients have more wiggle room as to revisions, adding to the word count, additional research, asking me to write a variety of long form or short form content, etc. (as long as it's still within my area of expertise). 

 

discobubbles
Community Member

I am fairly new to ghostwriting, and I found your thread by looking up this topic because I found the rates they charge very low for the most part.

If you type in "standard ghostwriting rate" into google the answer appears to be .05/word for those just starting out. I'd like to work on a fixed rate as well, but on Upwork that's a hit or miss proposition from the client end.  Generally I see offers that are for about .01-.02/word or lower. Though sometimes I see offerings are a fixed rate of say 2000.00/ but they are for multiple books of differing lengths. After all the math is done, the rate is either the same or under the .01/.02/word.

I had one client offer $800.00 for 92,000 words. I could also see from the scope of his project that in order to make it work, and not appear to be redundant or rushed, it would be quite a bit longer, and broken into a book series. At first I thought from the general posting (word count was not included) he could be offering a posting for a short story or novella, but with all the reference materials and epic scope of the fiction, that wouldn't fly. 

As to why they approach you, it's why I approach them, sometimes rates are placeholders, there is wiggle room,and there can be some negotiation. Or they didn't read your rates at all. Sometimes they approach you because they see what your work looks like, they want it, and so they see if they can negotiate on the price.

From what I get, I don't know if the client knows what they are asking for when they offer these small rates. it is puzzling.

That cheap-donkey wannabes use Google for rate guidance, then offer a fraction of that, is no reason we should accept even their baseline, let alone their penny-pinching self-discounts:
Editorial Freelancers Association Rate Survey 

Bid your worth, however you determine it. Don't negotiate except under extraordinary circumstances (where you have a net gain in some form, if not monetary). Ignore implausible clients. The more unrealistic their rates, the likelier their expectations will match.