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rocobo
Community Member

Which format is best for delivering client content?

Hi everyone,

I've finally landed my first client; I want to really nail this first contract and knock it out of the park. It's a modest task of writing a short 300 word blog post with only one header image, so it's an excellent opportunity to make a strong positive JSS impression.

 

I wasn't given credentials and I'm not accessing the client's site directly to draft nor to publish--so I wonder--should I construct the post in (my own) WordPress editor, or is it just as well if I use Microsoft Word or OneNote and export the completed post? How can I provide the smoothest experience for my client when I deliver the completed article? 

 

Thanks in advance! (:

ACCEPTED SOLUTION
florydev
Community Member

Good grief.

It wasn't a stupid question, it was one with a bad default assumption that she tried to correct.  Even by saying obviously she was hinting at it is much simpler than you are trying to make it.

 

I can't make you a pizza for you until you tell me what you want on it.  I can make a pizza for me and you can either eat it or starve but that isn't the same thing is it?

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30 REPLIES 30
petra_r
Community Member

Obviously you'd ask the client what suits them best?

rocobo
Community Member

Nonsense, it seems too intuitive to do it that way. Does anybody have any more contrived advice? /s

Forgive me,

I just thought somebody who has completed a contract already could offer some insight, tips, past experience etc. hence why I came to the community forum and asked a simple question. to no avail

 

BUT  I'm already finished writing it and I'll be sure to ask the client how they would like it formatted. Thanks for the advice.

 

Deuces.

petra_r
Community Member


Robert wrote:

Nonsense


Huh?

 


Robert B wrote:

Forgive me,

I just thought somebody who has completed a contract already could offer some insight,


I've completed over 300 on Upwork 

 

The only answer that makes any sense is to ask the client what they prefer.

 


Robert wrote:

I'll be sure to ask the client how they would like it formatted.


Good. Glad you're taking my advice and you're very welcome.

florydev
Community Member


Petra R wrote:

Robert wrote:

Nonsense


Huh?

 


That whole response was bewildering.

rocobo
Community Member

That whole response was sarcastic. Didn't mean to bewilder you, my guy.

 

I should have been clearer; I know exporting different file types often impacts the formatting of the typography/images. I was just wondering what kinds of experience others might have had building content in one place and then transferring it to a client who intends to post it through WordPress.

 

I thought this place was for asking for and giving help--not for elitist Upworkers to stroke each others' egos. Guess I'll just learn by experience, the way ya'll wise Gurus did.

florydev
Community Member


Robert B wrote:

That whole response was sarcastic. Didn't mean to bewilder you, my guy.

Sorry, I didn't catch that. I prefer my sarcasm to be clearer and funnier. Self-deprecating is nice too.


 

I should have been clearer; I know exporting different file types often impacts the formatting of the typography/images. I was just wondering what kinds of experience others might have had building content in one place and then transferring it to a client who intends to post it through WordPress.

 

I thought this place was for asking for and giving help--not for elitist Upworkers to stroke each others' egos. Guess I'll just learn by experience, the way ya'll wise Gurus did.


So here is the thing, you are a writer and when something you wrote is misunderstood by the reader you blame the reader? You aren't Humpty Dumpty, you can't just throw around a word salad and expect people to understand what you want.

 

You did a p-poor job of asking for help, you did an even lousier job of accepting it. 

 

The answer she gave is spot on, I still don't know if you understand it because again you insist on using all the words. 

rocobo
Community Member

I app-ppreciate your ins-sight now g-good day sir.

rocobo
Community Member

I know. Actually, Petra, I've seen Upwork memes about you before I ever posted here. That was kind of my point--that someone with all that XP could provide more valuable perspective than "ask the client" but okay. It's my first contract. Average value not much under $30.

petra_r
Community Member

Robert, I'm trying to figure out just why you are so hostile.

The answer to your question is to ask the client. Simples.

 

I have no idea what you actually expected. There is no "more valuable perspective" - it's a no-brainer. You ask the client what they prefer. Doh.

 

It's like me posting "A client sent me an Italian document. I could translate it into German or English. What do you think would be best?"

 

You could also have asled your question with a bit more detail and nuance.

 

rocobo
Community Member

Not hostile, just confounded. Simply put: even if the question was stupid, I've seen forums where the 'Gurus' are polite and informative through-and-through. Even to the most asinine queries, they try to consider the perspective of the person asking and what other indescript meaning they might have intended, if any. I'm not saying you ought to try to answer questions I didn't ask, I'm just trying to understand why this feels more like the early NB4 stage posts of a 4Chan page, in that I'm getting terse responses bordering on sarcasm rather than well-thought-out, thorough, actually helpful content.

 

In any case, I'm just keeping the banter going; I'm not upset at all and certainly not hostile. I will say, however,that if I had been doing this for nearly a decade and somebody asked the same question, I would understand that, considering it is ther first contract, maybe they wanted some perspective from the community, instead of potentially asking the client something that the client may assume they should 'already know'. (Remember, first contract)

 

The goof-up I made was assuming that the community was 'n00b-friendly' and that silly beginner questions wouldn't be mocked. If this is at all like the translation metaphor you used, it is in that most translators would guess that the client would have told them in the first place which language they wanted--and if they didn't--were they supposed to know already which?

 

By the way, I lost the game.

florydev
Community Member

Good grief.

It wasn't a stupid question, it was one with a bad default assumption that she tried to correct.  Even by saying obviously she was hinting at it is much simpler than you are trying to make it.

 

I can't make you a pizza for you until you tell me what you want on it.  I can make a pizza for me and you can either eat it or starve but that isn't the same thing is it?


Mark F wrote:

Good grief.

It wasn't a stupid question, it was one with a bad default assumption that she tried to correct.  Even by saying obviously she was hinting at it is much simpler than you are trying to make it.

 

I can't make you a pizza for you until you tell me what you want on it.  I can make a pizza for me and you can either eat it or starve but that isn't the same thing is it?


And now he accepted this a a solution.  So odd.  This is probably one of the weirdest encounters yet.  I almost feel like it's a setup for someone to write an article somewhere about how nasty the "gurus" are.  

rocobo
Community Member



And now he accepted this a a solution.  So odd.  This is probably one of the weirdest encounters yet.  I almost feel like it's a setup for someone to write an article somewhere about how nasty the "gurus" are.  


No setup here, friends. Just got to get back to work. I wish you both good health and thanks again for the advice.

a_lipsey
Community Member


Robert B wrote:

Not hostile, just confounded. Simply put: even if the question was stupid, I've seen forums where the 'Gurus' are polite and informative through-and-through. Even to the most asinine queries, they try to consider the perspective of the person asking and what other indescript meaning they might have intended, if any. I'm not saying you ought to try to answer questions I didn't ask, I'm just trying to understand why this feels more like the early NB4 stage posts of a 4Chan page, in that I'm getting terse responses bordering on sarcasm rather than well-thought-out, thorough, actually helpful content.

 

In any case, I'm just keeping the banter going; I'm not upset at all and certainly not hostile. I will say, however,that if I had been doing this for nearly a decade and somebody asked the same question, I would understand that, considering it is ther first contract, maybe they wanted some perspective from the community, instead of potentially asking the client something that the client may assume they should 'already know'. (Remember, first contract)

 

The goof-up I made was assuming that the community was 'n00b-friendly' and that silly beginner questions wouldn't be mocked. If this is at all like the translation metaphor you used, it is in that most translators would guess that the client would have told them in the first place which language they wanted--and if they didn't--were they supposed to know already which?

 

By the way, I lost the game.


No one mocked you. The answer to 50% of the questions on this forum is "ask the client"  or  "did you talk to the client."  And nearly 99% of the time the freelancer has not talked to the client. 

rocobo
Community Member


 

You could also have asled your question with a bit more detail and nuance.

 


Yes, I could have, and should have done that. Thank you for your help.

Not posting here while drunk did wonders in my case. I wish everybody would do that.

 

 

 

 

 

-----------
"Where darkness shines like dazzling light"   —William Ashbless

Completely sober, just unconventional. I didn't think everyone on Upwork would be so UPtight. haha

petra_r
Community Member


Robert B wrote:

Completely sober, just unconventional. I didn't think everyone on Upwork would be so UPtight. haha


We're really, REALLY not.  We're generally really nice if people don't start throwing hissy fits right away for no reason. Maybe try again without responding to a simple answer with "Nonsense"?

 

And I actually DO have a client who sends me texts and regularly forgets to tell me what language they'd like back.

It goes like this:

 

Client: Hiya, do you have time to translate this for me? It's a bit urgent.

Me: Sure, no problem, looks straightforward enough. What language would you like it in?

Client: Oh, just keep it upbeat and informal, it's a young brand.

Me: Yes dear. But it would help if I knew if you want English or German 😉

Client: Oh, LOL... yes, I guess it would. I keep doing that. Can you do German please? I should have said. They will want it in English at a later date though.

 

(The above is an actual, verbatim conversation...)

a_lipsey
Community Member


Petra R wrote:

Robert B wrote:

Completely sober, just unconventional. I didn't think everyone on Upwork would be so UPtight. haha


We're really, REALLY not.  We're generally really nice if people don't start throwing hissy fits right away for no reason. Maybe try again without responding to a simple answer with "Nonsense"?

 

And I actually DO have a client who sends me texts and regularly forgets to tell me what language they'd like back.

It goes like this:

 

Client: Hiya, do you have time to translate this for me? It's a bit urgent.

Me: Sure, no problem, looks straightforward enough. What language would you like it in?

Client: Oh, just keep it upbeat and informal, it's a young brand.

Me: Yes dear. But it would help if I knew if you want English or German 😉

Client: Oh, LOL... yes, I guess it would. I keep doing that. Can you do German please? I should have said. They will want it in English at a later date though.

 

(The above is an actual, verbatim conversation...)


Wait, so first Petra's  informal remark "did you ask the client" is  too informal, and now everyone is too uptight? You overreacted, man. Just admit it. I think you also came in looking for a fight, considering you mention memes and crap that are  usually posted by freelancers who are failing and mad at those who have learned how to be successful. 

florydev
Community Member


Petra R wrote:

Robert B wrote:

Completely sober, just unconventional. I didn't think everyone on Upwork would be so UPtight. haha


Speak for yourself, I am wound so tight I should be producing coal.  I can see now why ever response was devastating funny and I just failed to miss it in my stoicism.

 

Wait, am I stroking your ego or are you stroking mine?  I can't tell.  

 

Oh well, maybe I will go off and create a meme about you.


Mark F wrote:

Petra R wrote:

Robert B wrote:

Completely sober, just unconventional. I didn't think everyone on Upwork would be so UPtight. haha


Speak for yourself, I am wound so tight I should be producing coal.  I can see now why ever response was devastating funny and I just failed to miss it in my stoicism.

 

Wait, am I stroking your ego or are you stroking mine?  I can't tell.  

 

Oh well, maybe I will go off and create a meme about you.


You know you've made it when you have a troll and/or a meme about you. 

rocobo
Community Member

It's difficult to get the exact intended impression of somebody through the screen--I get that--but I really couldn't imagine how I could be construed as "looking for a fight". My first response shouldn't have even been taken so seriously, hence nonsense and the big /s for sarcasm. It was literally a "Doh" moment when Petra first replied, and my response was reflective of that.

I would love to see a meme of myself successfully make rounds on the internet. I could use a laugh--and the publicity (I'm broke). I also didn't say/suggest that they were negative in nature--the few I've stumbled upon on Reddit are ironic conspiracies, often suggesting she's an undercover Upwork corporate official, or some jive of that nature. No trolls or haters of sorts.

 

Is everybody done picking on me now? /s

Maybe fix the errors in your profile before attacking those trying to help you...


Alice G wrote:

Maybe fix the errors in your profile before attacking those trying to help you...


I'm all ears; let's hear those errors.

rocobo
Community Member

Oh. Those errors.

Thank you for pointing that out! (:


@rocobo wrote:

Oh. Those errors.

Thank you for pointing that out! (:

__________________________

Robert, I think you may have wandered into Upwork without fully understanding what Upwork is about.

 

I'm not sure why you posted in the forum, but if you feel your expertise is way beyond anyone who has given you solid advice on this thread, then you must find your own way and stop these rather absurd comments. 

 

You may or may not know that anyone and everyone (including clients) on and off Upwork can read these posts as they are in  the public domain. So you should try to rein in your agressivity, which does little to endear you to either your peers or your potential clients - and will certainly give Upwork food for thought. 


 

Nichola, I understand I may come off as a bit unbridled at times, but it's clear my tone has been grievously misunderstood. Yes, you could say I don't fully understand Upwork, and I made the mistake of being myself--odd quips and all, but I certainly don't consider myself above anyone here, and despite my playfulness (which is really all it was) I am grateful for everyone's input and I expressed that already.

I took criticism and advise, and I was genuinely happy to receive it. If my comments seemed absurd, it's because they're misunderstood, not rude or implied to be inappropriate. I was lighthearted in my dialogues here and it seems the consensus was that I was hostile and/or absurd, so everyone, you have my apologies, as well as my gratitude for the insight.

petra_r
Community Member


Robert B wrote:

Alice G wrote:

Maybe fix the errors in your profile before attacking those trying to help you...


I'm all ears; let's hear those errors.


Your profile is all over the place. It's poorly formatted for starters, as well as not really a profile overview at all for the purposes of Upwork. You don't put your name in your overview. Clients can see your name. Your age is irrelevant and the stuff about your middle name is irrelevant and just wastes space again. Clients can only see the first 2 lines of your overview in a list of freelancers, and all they see about you is your name, age and some meaningless stuff about your middle name. Oh and treehugging. And funny formatting. THIS is all they see:

2 lines.png

 

The entire overview is all about you. Nothing tells a client why hiring you brings any value for THEM or what hiring you brings to the table. So many words, so little said.

 

Clients don't care if you are a treehugger or like science or what you have a passion for. Clients don't care about your plans for your mother or your kids or what your father said to you. Or what (unrelated) stuff you plan to do in the years to come.

Barely 3 and a half lines of your profile are even remotely relevant.

 

It's a freelancing profile, not a dating-site one.

 

You want to scrap your overview and start from scratch. Concentrate on a client-centric approach, your unique selling point, what value hiring you will bring to the client and what you can do for them. 


Where is your employment history?

 

Your only portfolio item has nothing to do with what you are offering, so it's irrelevant.

 

Add portfolio items that show your best examples of the kind of work you want to get hired for.

 

Fix the formatting.

 

 

rocobo
Community Member


Petra R wrote:


Your profile is all over the place. It's poorly formatted for starters, as well as not really a profile overview at all for the purposes of Upwork. You don't put your name in your overview. Clients can see your name. Your age is irrelevant and the stuff about your middle name is irrelevant and just wastes space again. Clients can only see the first 2 lines of your overview in a list of freelancers, and all they see about you is your name, age and some meaningless stuff about your middle name. Oh and treehugging. And funny formatting. THIS is all they see:

2 lines.png

 

The entire overview is all about you. Nothing tells a client why hiring you brings any value for THEM or what hiring you brings to the table. So many words, so little said.

 

Clients don't care if you are a treehugger or like science or what you have a passion for. Clients don't care about your plans for your mother or your kids or what your father said to you. Or what (unrelated) stuff you plan to do in the years to come.

Barely 3 and a half lines of your profile are even remotely relevant.

 

It's a freelancing profile, not a dating-site one.

 

You want to scrap your overview and start from scratch. Concentrate on a client-centric approach, your unique selling point, what value hiring you will bring to the client and what you can do for them. 


Where is your employment history?

 

Your only portfolio item has nothing to do with what you are offering, so it's irrelevant.

 

Add portfolio items that show your best examples of the kind of work you want to get hired for.

 

Fix the formatting.

 

 


Thank you. That's some constructive criticism I needed to hear. I don't reach out often to ask for advice on this kind of stuff and I admit I need to work on my approach. I'm going to scrap it and try something new. Thanks again.

petra_r
Community Member


Robert B wrote:

I'm going to scrap it and try something new. Thanks again.

Great. Come back and let's take another looks when we're done.