Upwork: What the heck does this claim mean?

[tjmisny]

I would like someone from Upwork to explain this seemingly outrageous claim that pops up every time I open the platform:

"Rise to the top of the client's list.  Boosted Proposals deliver 10x more earnings on ad spend"

What does this mean?  Where is the data to back this up?  Boosted Proposals deliver 10x more earnings on ad spend... COMPARED TO WHAT? 

When it comes to the context of a client's list, which is the only place Boosted Proposals are relevant... there are no other ways to spend money for advertising.  So it could not possibly be a valid comparison (even if Upwork shared what they were comparing to).  Is this a comparison to other forms of advertising (paid social, TV/radio, street teams??), in a totally different context?   

Also - there's no way of confirming whether or not Boosting was the coefficient that drove the higher earnings.  Higher-earning Freelancers are more likely to spend more on Boosting, but those higher-earning Freelancers are more likely anyway to get higher-paying projects, whether they boost or not.  

This "statistic" seems specious at best and seriously misleading/nefarious at worst.... 

Upwork, please provide source and proof for this statistic claim, since I have to look at it every time I log in!  False advertising is not something I think you would want to be associated with.  

[the-right-writer]

It means you are supposed to boost like mad, seemingly because you will have a 10X increase on your ROI. It sounds like compared to non-boosting. I'm quire sure that's their desired implication.

I thought it was Upwork trying to be entertaining. There is no way they can pretend to be serious. But hey, if you are new and inexperienced, you might believe it, especially when we have "gurus" telling the new ones all kinds of wrong information.

[tjmisny]

I totally agree with your sentiment... but I'm not sure that's what UW intended, because the wording is "10x more earnings on ad spend".  When I read that sentence, the "on ad spend" seems like it means "10x more earnings compared to other forms of ad spend".  

If they meant the statistic based on your intrepretation, they could have just said "Boosted Proposals deliver 10x more earnings".  Why include the words "on ad spend" which qualifies the 10X claim to be related to ad spend expenses?  

Either way it reeks like a nonsense pseudo-statistic and I demand Upwork clarify this... 

[tjmisny]

And even if your interpretation is correct, it's still an extremely misleading claim because naturally, Freelancers are more likely to Boost jobs with larger budgets than the sweatshop $2/day jobs you see all the time.   If you pay to Boost a job, you had better be making 10X more than extreme poverty wages!  

[feed_my_eyes]

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 wrote:

And even if your interpretation is correct, it's still an extremely misleading claim because naturally, Freelancers are more likely to Boost jobs with larger budgets than the sweatshop $2/day jobs you see all the time.   If you pay to Boost a job, you had better be making 10X more than extreme poverty wages!  

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Or you just keep creating new accounts in order to get free connects.

[the-right-writer]

I'm sure the ad people meant in whatever way it would garner more connects. No matter how you spin it, I don't see the stats carry over into reality. Of course, without some context, and support, stats are what you say they are. It wouldn't be difficult, while they are looking at their stats, to add a fact there, but, of course, they don't.

I support your efforts to get Upwork to explain their methodology, but it won't happen, and it might scare the shareholders, and everyone else.

I know no one cares, and it is literally about the money, but how awful is the business plan, that they never, ever, earned a penny?

[wlyonsatl]

10X!!! Yikes, I am clearly missing out by not boosting my proposals without limit!

Or not.

In early November 2023 I received an email from Upwork saying, "“Boosted Proposals increase the chance of getting hired by 24%.” That's only an average six percent higher success rate per freelancer proposal for each of the four freelancers who boost themselves to the top of each project's boosted proposals list.

The only sure winner with proposal boosting is Upwork. The company's quarterly report for the three months ended March 31, 2023 is likely going to show a big bump in revenue and net income with significantly higher connects-related sales without any associated extra expenses. Connects are creating significant income that doesn't cost Upwork a thing - it's the perfect product.

[tjmisny]

It's one thing for Upwork to implement this system to increase their profitability, but it's another thing for them to be making misleading / confusing / impossible to verify claims to pressure Freelancers into over-spending on a product that offers questionable value to everybody except the shareholders of Upwork. 

[wlyonsatl]

We've seen exagerated claims before:

Average Client Ratings of Freelancers, Accord... - Upwork Community

[tjmisny]

Wow, I had not seen that before.  That doesn't pass the smell test for me... 

[celgins]

They're referring to the different ways freelancers can use Connects to pay for potential attention (i.e., boosted profiles, boosted proposals, Availability badge).

I'm not sure why they call it "ad spend," but I suspect it's because they want to push the narrative that buying and spending Connects is a business investment (i.e., marketing and advertising). See Get Started With Ads

The "10x more" statistic is just an attention-grabber to get more freelancers to boost.

[tjmisny]

If "10x more" is merely attention-grabbing line... how is that not false advertising?  You can't make up a statistic to grab people's attention and hype them up to spend on something that isn't guaranteed to bring results. 

And how can you compare the earnings from Boosted connects and say the Availability badge, or Boosting a profile?  Those are apples and oranges.  One is invitation-based, one is proposal based... you are spending different amounts on each... I just don't see how you can make that comparison in good faith without actively trying to manipulate data.  

[celgins]

I mentioned the "10x more" statistic is an attention-grabber to get more freelancers to boost because I think it is.

However, I'm not implying their "10x more" statistic is false. It's like a lot of marketing tactics we hear throughout industry: "Our research shows that XYZ hand sanitizer destoys 5x more bacteria than the other leading brands," or "Users of XYZ's sleek new gadget are 10x more satisfied with its throughput when compared to our three older devices."  When I hear claims like these, I have no idea if they're true, but I also can't prove they're false. Just because the hand sanitizer didn't feel like it did anything different for me, or my new gadget's throughput seems just as bad as the older gadget, it doesn't mean others didn't see positive results.

There is no way for freelancers to verify Upwork's claims of 10x more earnings on ad-spend. My guess is, Upwork monitors freelancer ad-spend across the Availability badge, boosting proposals, and boosting profiles, and has a way to determine if/how each one leads to increased earnings. For example:

• Maybe they looked at a random (or selected) group of 10,000 freelancers who turned on their Availability badges, and Upwork saw those freelancers' earnings increase by $20 over a 3 month period.
  
  
• Then, they looked at a random (or selected) group of 10,000 freelancers who boosted their profiles, and Upwork saw those freelancers'  earnings increase by $100 over a 3 month period.
  
  
• Similarly, they could have looked at a random (or selected) group of 10,000 freelancers who boosted their proposals, and saw that group of freelancers' earnings increase by $1,000 over a 3 month period.

I'm just speculating because Upwork doesn't reveal how they make such calculations and claims. I think it's risky to use phrases like "false advertising" simply because we (freelancers) might not be able to prove Upwork's claims. I'm sure Upwork's CMO and legal teams look at such statistics and determine what can or cannot be proven, and what they can get away with.

[tjmisny]

Genuine question, are you getting paid to shill for the Upwork corporation? 

Why is it acceptable for UW to make vague, impossible to verify claims with no data to backup, so freelancers will be enticed to spend money on a product with questionable value?   (2 of the last 10 boosted proposals I sent were viewed and I am in the top <1% of my field here).  If a company cannot provide un-manipulated data to back up a claim, it is false.  Because it had the intention of being an attention-grabbing marketing tactic, does not make it acceptable!  In fact... it makes it worse, beacuse the pseudo-statistic is being deployed to alter customer behavior for corporate profit.  

[feed_my_eyes]

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 wrote:

Genuine question, are you getting paid to shill for the Upwork corporation? 

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More baseless accusations. You must have a pretty high opinion of yourself if you think that nobody could possibly disagree with you unless they were being paid to do so. 

[tjmisny]

Anyone is welcome to disagree with me, but the opinion that a corporation should be given the benefit of the doubt... in 2024... in today's capitalist society where daily we see everything from shrinkflation to union busting to jets falling apart in mid air due to deregulation to cancer causing chemicals in household products to lobbyists weilding the levers of power....   is an opinion that I can't get behind. 

I think it's our responsibility as users of Upwork to think critically rather than accept everything being told to us at face value.  

[celgins]

Genuine question, are you getting paid to shill for the Upwork corporation?

It's not a genuine question; you're being coarse because you don't like what I've posted.

Why is it acceptable for UW to make vague, impossible to verify claims with no data to backup, so freelancers will be enticed to spend money on a product with questionable value?

Because I believe most for-profit businesses make similar claims in their marketing and advertising statemetns to boost credibility, sales, or both.

It sounds as if you're expecting Upwork to provide internal data on freelancers, and also guarantee a 10x increase in earnings when boosting proposals. I'm sorry the platform no longer works for you, but claiming Upwork engages in false advertising because you can't confirm their data doesn't make much sense.

[tjmisny]

Many businesses that have made similar claims (that the company is unable or unwilling to back up with concrete data) have been sued for misleading advertising.  Some here seem to think that because it's used by a company in advertising, that a claim therefor must be truthful.  Companies lie and manipulate data all the time.  Sometimes they are held accountable, sometimes not.  (I've worked in advertising so I can speak to this).

I am not asking Upwork to provide internal data on freelancers or for guarantees regarding 10x increase on earings.  That is a silly accusation that you are using to make me seem unrealistic or stupid.  I am asking UW to explain what this particular claim means and how they came to this conclusion.  And if the claim is not reputable, I would ask that they refrain from using misleading data to entice Freelancers from buying a product that does not live up to those claims.

[yofazza]

In that case there seem to be nothing wrong with it.

If spending connects on proposal compared to spending it on profile and availability, the 10x makes sense. Can't sue them. 😁

And the business expense narration is great to prevent lawsuit for being a casino without proper permit.

[tjmisny]

Your sarcasm is noted... but seriously - how can anyone claim that stastic is legit?  You'd have to twist yourself into a pretzel to make that claim. 

[yofazza]

seriously 

Yes they need to 'twist it hard' but I think it will still be legitimate. They can show data, stats, about how spending on proposals resulted in 10x more earnings compared to the others.

It's similar with a lot other things, including the casino part, or fake job posts, where they will be able to proof that they are not doing anything wrong.

[tjmisny]

I'd like to see the proof nonetheless.  Also... if the correct interpretation is "Boosting Posts leads to 10X more earnings than other forms of spending on Connects", that is such a lame, empty-value, designed-to-mislead statistic.  

Hey, buy this piece of junk.  It's 10X better than these two other pieces of junk I'm trying to sell you.  

[crart]

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 wrote:

And the business expense narration is great to prevent lawsuit for being a casino without proper permit.

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As the lawyer explained to me, if their narrative contradicts their practices, they can be sued. The current model of predatory monetization of people, to be precise - milking freelancers dry, is hard to defend if they don't provide any relevant data that would prove they don't in fact run casino. Transparency is not their strong feat for sure but there are ways to force the company to reveal their dirty cards.

[tjmisny]

Also, my earnings have went DOWN drastically since the Boosted Connects system came into the picture.  So how can spending connects be worth 10X more in earnings than anything?  

[feed_my_eyes]

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 wrote:

Also, my earnings have went DOWN drastically since the Boosted Connects system came into the picture.  So how can spending connects be worth 10X more in earnings than anything?  

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Obviously, they're not claiming that ALL freelancers are making 10X more when they boost. It's pretty easy for me to believe that freelancers who bid on cheap, relatively easy projects - the kind that attract 100+ bids - do get a significant advantage from boosting, because their clients are unlikely to read the entire list of proposals. Whereas if you bid on more complex projects that require an expert - and have fewer bids - I don't think that boosting makes much, if any, difference. But face it, the latter kind of project is scarce on Upwork compared with the former, so your experience with boosting wouldn't be the same as the average freelancer here. 

You say that Upwork is making false claims, but saying that something must not be true, because it's not true for you personally? That doesn't make any sense. 

[tjmisny]

I am using my own experience as one example (which is true with many of us here, but certainly not 100% of us), that since Boosted Connects rolled out, the platform has not been working for us.  Based on Q1 2024 I'm on pace to make around $35K on the platform in 2024 when in 2021 I made $120K on the platform.  This is just my experience.  I obviously am not trying to claim this is true for every single Freelancer on Upwork.  

If it should be obvious that we're meant to understand that all freelancers are not making 10X more when they boost and that this statistic is meant to reflect specific job posting circumstances.... then again, doesn't this mean that the pusedo-statitic is intentionally misleading (aka a false claim), if it only applies to "cheap, relatively easy projects"?  

[feed_my_eyes]

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 wrote:

If it should be obvious that we're meant to understand that all freelancers are not making 10X more when they boost and that this statistic is meant to reflect specific job posting circumstances.... then again, doesn't this mean that the pusedo-statitic is intentionally misleading (aka a false claim), if it only applies to "cheap, relatively easy projects"?  

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No, because most projects on Upwork fall into this category. My Upwork earnings were also down last year, but I don't think that I'm a typical Upwork freelancer, and I don't think that they care about attracting the kind of clients that I target any more. I don't think that boosting has anything to do with it. Correlation is not causation. If you don't have any data - and you don't - how can you claim that it's false advertising? Or do you just think that Upwork is guilty until proven innocent?

[tjmisny]

I can posit that this seems to be false advertising beacuse:

* There are no sources, studies or data cited to back up the claim

* The wording is confusing and vague (there are currently 3 interpretations of what the statistic is actually referring to in this thread)

* From my own experience and from the experiences of many others who post here, we are not seeing anywhere near a 10X increase in earnings related to our boosted Connects (whether it's VS non-boosted applications, VS our performance prior to Boosting program began or VS other forms of Upwork ad spend or VS other forms of ad spend in general).  1 out of the last 11 Boosted Applications I've submitted has been viewed, for example

*A clear financial incentive on UW's part to get more people to send more money on Boosted Connects

*A history of UW using specious language to entice suseptible Freelancers to buy Boosted Connects (for example the e-mail marketing campaign with exact verbiage "You have to bid to win!")

If YOU don't have any data (and YOU don't) - how can you claim this is a legitmate statistic based on non-manipulated data?  

[feed_my_eyes]

I'm not claiming anything, I just like to avoid making completely baseless and ridiculous accusations that border on defamation. Your earnings are down and people are complaining in the forum - that's your proof of wrongdoing? You're going to have to do better than that.

[tjmisny]

You skipped over 4 of the 5 bulletpoints in my above message.  

[feed_my_eyes]

No sources, studies or data? The absence of providing you with a data breakdown isn't proof of guilt. Wording is confusing and vague? Par for the course - Upwork specialises in that. A clear financial incentive? I'm pretty sure that Upwork has to comply with advertising standards, the same as any other company. A history of specious language? They use marketing-speak, the same as every other company, but that's not the same thing as falsifying data, which is a much more serious accusation.

[tjmisny]

Companies violate standards and best practices all the time.  Just beacuse the standards exist do not mean that they are followed.  Millions of dollars are paid out every year in lawsuits involving false advertising... would you consider these marketing-speak as well?  

Clearly neither of us can prove or disprove the veracity of the claim.  But that was not the point of this thread.  The intention of this thread is to try to get an Upwork representitive to respond, to clarify (1) what this claim is supposed to mean (10x earnings improvement compared to what?), since there are multiple intrepretations for its meaning here and (2) how was this figure reached, what is the provenance of the data?  

[atreglia]

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 Thomas J M wrote:

The intention of this thread is to try to get an Upwork representitive to respond,

One would think they'd jump at the opportunity to share their stats just to push the boosting.  But I have a funny feeling that no answer is, unfortunately, your answer.  Pretty much says it all.

[tjmisny]

Exactly.  If there were clear, persuasive statistics, those would be made available (perhaps even a case study or a testimonial), instead of a confusing claim with no citation of source.  

[atreglia]

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 Thomas J M wrote:

Exactly.  If there were clear, persuasive statistics, those would be made available (perhaps even a case study or a testimonial), instead of a confusing claim with no citation of source.  

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Ahh, but they do have three Top Rated Plus freelancer testimonials below that add under “See what the pros say”; Daniel H., Alvin B., and Gianluca N.  Their profiles are not clickable (surprise!) and I was unable to find two of them when I searched using TR+ as a filter.  Some crappioli.  Poor things could have since lost their badge from boosting dead leads and not earning enough.

[tjmisny]

I noticed that as well.  I thought it was funny and interesting that Gianluca N's quote has nothing to do with the value of Boosted Proposals - he just does it because he's competitive.   So of those 3 random quotes, only 2 have actually positive things to say about the program.  

[crart]

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But I have a funny feeling that no answer is, unfortunately, your answer.  Pretty much says it all.

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As usual. I don't understand their mentality of hiding behind silence. If someone accused me of many things we suspect UW is doing, I would step out in public and explain, because I don't like to be associated with scam, slavery of any kind, false advertisement etc. They seem to be absolutely disconnected from reality, instead living in the pink bubble of "boost moar so we can earn moar and keep milking you dry". Disgusting is not even close to what I think of it.

The only reaction can be mods stepping in to "correct" the thread and blur anything that could cast bad light on this platform. But anyone from management? I doubt they even read the forum, let alone know it exists. They see only $$$ in our wallets and they sit in our wallets way too deep.

[tjmisny]

I agree 100%.  Espeically because I'm asking a simple question - what does this statistic mean and where did it come from?  

[atreglia]

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 Olga P wrote:

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But I have a funny feeling that no answer is, unfortunately, your answer.  Pretty much says it all.

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I doubt they even read the forum, let alone know it exists. They see only $$$ in our wallets and they sit in our wallets way too deep.

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Oh, I believe wholeheartedly they know everything that's going on in this forum.  I don't think they respond to us because they know they're skirting just outside the parameter of the law and the less they say the better off they are.  As they say, you're as sick as your secrets.

[tjmisny]

I am certain there's some awareness of our discsussions in this forum.  Otherwise why would the word "Casinno" (spelled correctly) trigger Community Guidelines censorship?