Hourly payment protection – limits

[e_luneborg]

Hey!

I have a question about the payment protection for hourly contracts. It's not like I have an issue with this now, but as I've just started a contract with a new client, from a location where I usually don't take clients from(....), I just wanted to have something confirmed before I track a lot of hours.

So, the t&c says this: 
"The maximum rate per hour protected by Upwork to Freelancer under the Hourly Payment Protection for Freelancers is the lesser of: (i) the rate provided in the Hourly Contract terms; (ii) the usual hourly rate billed by Freelancer on the Site across all Clients; and (iii) the going rate for the same skills on the Site in Freelancer's area (such determination to be made in Upwork's sole discretion). The maximum amount of coverage under the Hourly Payment Protection for Freelancers for the life of a relationship between the same Client and Freelancer is $2,500 or 50 hours logged in Work Diary, whichever is less."

So it's part (iii) I have a question about. It clairly says that this is up to Upwork to determine, but I just want to know which "Freelancer area" I would be grouped into. Would it be just all writers on Upwork, all web content writers, all Norwegian writers, or all writers within my specific niche? Basically, which metrics does Upwork use to determine this? Is it very general, or do they actually put some effort into narrowing it down a bit? 

I know no one can give me a 100% answer to this, but if any freelancers have some experience with this they would want to share, of if a mod could clarify a little bit at least, it would be much appreciated.

[VladimirG]

Hi Eve,

Thank you for the question. I don't have the information you're looking for at the moment but will check with our team and follow-up with an update and share any available information as soon as possible.

On a related note, congrats on the new contract!

[gilbert-phyllis]

Vladimir, you may anticipate a couple of follow-up questions, which may need input from your team
:

- What if a client contracts with a FL for a higher rate and the FL conforms to all requirements for tracking and documenting hourly time (using the desktop tracker, meaningful activity memos, not exceeding the weekly cap set by the client), is their protection still limited to the parameters specified in the ToS clause that Eve quoted?

- What would be the timeframe for "(ii) the usual hourly rate billed by Freelancer on the Site across all Clients"? Many of us have raised our rates over time, so how would our "usual rate" be determined?

thx!

[petra_r]

I believe this part of the rules is mainly for cases where there is bad intent. Remember the client who hired a bunch of freelancers at 10 x their profile rate, or the girl who was hired at $ 720 an hour and surprised it was not covered by the protection when the client (of course) failed to pay for the logged hour... (he profile rate was $ 20 if I recall correctly, it was low anyway)

I know that friends of mine who have hourly rates far in excess of the average have been covered at their hourly rate so I'd not worry too much about this, it has been part of the terms for years, as long as I can think back.

[e_luneborg]

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Petra R wrote:

I believe this part of the rules is mainly for cases where there is bad intent. Remember the client who hired a bunch of freelancers at 10 x their profile rate, or the girl who was hired at $ 720 an hour and surprised it was not covered by the protection when the client (of course) failed to pay for the logged hour... (he profile rate was $ 20 if I recall correctly, it was low anyway)

I know that friends of mine who have hourly rates far in excess of the average have been covered at their hourly rate so I'd not worry too much about this, it has been part of the terms for years, as long as I can think back.

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Good to know. Thanks Petra!

I've always knows these terms were there, but it's just something about this new client of mine that made me wonder a bit, and thought I would just ask to see what I could expect if things turn to **bleep**. (All though, I have no reason now to think it would.)

I just hope that Upwork wouldn't come with some bs about "the average rate is $10 an hour, so that's what you'll get". Just the fees they would get from me on this project would be worth more, so I hope I would get a little bit more at least. 🙂

[feed_my_eyes]

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Eve L wrote:

So, the t&c says this: 
"The maximum rate per hour protected by Upwork to Freelancer under the Hourly Payment Protection for Freelancers is the lesser of: (i) the rate provided in the Hourly Contract terms; (ii) the usual hourly rate billed by Freelancer on the Site across all Clients; and (iii) the going rate for the same skills on the Site in Freelancer's area (such determination to be made in Upwork's sole discretion). The maximum amount of coverage under the Hourly Payment Protection for Freelancers for the life of a relationship between the same Client and Freelancer is $2,500 or 50 hours logged in Work Diary, whichever is less."

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Wow, I had no idea that this was the case, so I, too, am curious about it. Since my hourly rate is higher than the "going rate for the same skills on the site", that means that when I work on an hourly contract, I do NOT actually have full payment protection?

[e_luneborg]

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Christine A wrote:

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Eve L wrote:

So, the t&c says this: 
"The maximum rate per hour protected by Upwork to Freelancer under the Hourly Payment Protection for Freelancers is the lesser of: (i) the rate provided in the Hourly Contract terms; (ii) the usual hourly rate billed by Freelancer on the Site across all Clients; and (iii) the going rate for the same skills on the Site in Freelancer's area (such determination to be made in Upwork's sole discretion). The maximum amount of coverage under the Hourly Payment Protection for Freelancers for the life of a relationship between the same Client and Freelancer is $2,500 or 50 hours logged in Work Diary, whichever is less."

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Wow, I had no idea that this was the case, so I, too, am curious about it. Since my hourly rate is higher than the "going rate for the same skills on the site", that means that when I work on an hourly contract, I do NOT actually have full payment protection?

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Yeah, my rates are higher than what I assume the average is on Upwork, so that's why I was wondering how protected I really am. If they would cover what is a fraction of my rate, they could just not bother with it at all.

I don't have a problem with this now, but since I took on a new client from a location which in my opinion is a bit shady, I just wanted to know what would happen before I track a lot of hours in my first week. If they would cover my average hourly rate for the last year or two I would be fine with that, and just not bill more than $2500 the first week (so  I'm fine with all other terms than (iii)), but if they would cover less, I might not want to work that much before I know the client is paying...