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Andrew's avatar
Andrew L Community Member

New freelancers are easy pickings for Telegram scammers

I've only been looking through jobs in the last few days and have come across literally dozens of scam job postings.  They invite you to Telegram and then try to get money off of you in one way or another e.g. "enrollment fee" and some such NONSENSE.

 

Why doesn't UpWork simply filter out Telegram links?

 

It's trivially easy to do.


I've wasted connect credits on proposals only to be met with Telegram links to "chat with the HR Manager" on a couple of occasions and then I realise it's a scam.

 

Now I understand that we really should be looking for "payment verified" as a rough filter.  Honestly, we should not even need to do ANYTHING.  These scammers should not be able to share Telegram links with us (how is this allowed to be possible, it's so easy to filter out such links!).  If people can't be redirected to the likes of Telegram, it will put off scammers to some extent.

 

edit to add: I've looked through probably a dozen or so obviously-scam postings just now, and most of them have 50+ proposals.  The idea that we just rely on new people doing their due diligence obviously isn't working. 

45 REPLIES 45
Jhim's avatar
Jhim M Community Member

I agree. I just got scammed today 😞 Upwork please do something about this. Im also new here thats why I dont know anything.

Andrew's avatar
Andrew L Community Member

Ah yes, I just replied to your post!  This kind of thing should be filtered out from here.  People can say "freelancers need to be more savvy".  No.  New people like myself have wasted credits on these scams, because you simply don't know what to look for when initially applying for jobs.  I consider myself quite "streetwise" but it's only AFTER you've spent your credits (as a new freelancer) that you find out they are not serious.  In your case, it went a step further and they got money off you in a more direct way.

These scams do not help any genuine actors here - they clutter up the jobs boards (so genuine job providers get less attention), freelancers waste money on sending proposals to them, and it makes UpWork look bad.  The only people who win here are the scammers - they are gifted so many opportunities on UpWork. 

Robert's avatar
Robert Y Community Member

Just a couple of points:

 

As Sophie already said, you get your connects back when you spend them applying for a scam job (make sure you flag the job).

 

Verifying payment wouldn't solve the scammer problem. In fact, one of the most common scams now is where the "client" has a credit card and "accidentally" pays the freelancer about ten times too much. Then they ask for a refund via PayPal. Shortly afterwards, the money they paid the freelancer disappears, being claimed back by the rightful owner of the stolen card.

 

Removing certain words, such as Telegram, won't work either. The scammers won't use these words, but will wait till they get a reply before they ask you to contact them that way.

 

The only way to stop scammers is to cut off their revenue stream. That can only happen when freelancers learn not to contact people outside of the site before there's a contract, and also keep all payments on the site.

Andrew's avatar
Andrew L Community Member

Robert, there are so many scams posted in the new jobs section of the keywords I search - I would guess 1 out of 5 jobs is an obvious scam (keywords "copywriter", "SEO", article writer").  CLEARLY, their scams are profitable since they are hitting UpWork so frequently.

 


Robert Y wrote:

Removing certain words, such as Telegram, won't work either. The scammers won't use these words, but will wait till they get a reply before they ask you to contact them that way.


I'm not talking about "keywords" to block, but actual URLs.  They use specific shortened URLs e.g. "t.me" - this is very easy to do.  It nips it in the bud and disincentivises these scammers to post in the first place.  Even if NOBODY fell for these scams, having 1 out of 5 jobs as a scam job is awful for everybody - it's such a waste of time, and it's terrible PR for UpWork.


Robert Y wrote:

The only way to stop scammers is to cut off their revenue stream. That can only happen when freelancers learn not to contact people outside of the site before there's a contract, and also keep all payments on the site.


Your supposed "only way" is not working at all when we see so many scams posted.  It's clear they are incentivised since people are falling for these scams (literally there is one person in this thread who was scammed today). 

 

So the scams will go on and people will shake their heads and say "if only new people would read these obscure blog posts first and thoroughly pore over these rules and regs".  This is not how the real world actually works.  People learn the ropes and make mistakes as they go along.  That is actual reality.  Hoping that everyone will do exactly as you please "one day" isn't a strategy - it's wishful thinking.   Anti-phishing software removes links to people don't click on them in the first place. Antivirus software blocks certain URLs because they are known to contain viruses. 

 

edit to add:  I checked just now and I have NOT had any connects refunded for 2 scams I made proposals for (that I could not know they were scams until I made the proposals in the first place). 






Jeanne's avatar
Jeanne H Community Member

"So the scams will go on and people will shake their heads and say "if only new people would read these obscure blog posts first and thoroughly pore over these rules and regs". 

 

Please look up the definition of "obscure."  The scams will continue as long as people who want to be freelancers without skills throw up a bad pic and a couple of alleged jobs with fantasies about their skills in their mother tongue - the scammers will be lined up and waiting for those who think they are so special they have been chosen for big bucks.

 

I have used this anaolgy before but it works. If you are going down the street and someeone comes out of a dark alley and says they want you to do a job because you are so special, and you just walked by all the giant signs saying "Don't go into the alley with strangers." Then the person offers you a whole lotta' cash for just helping them out. Well, if you want to go down that alley, be prepared for the consequences without complaint.

 

"This is not how the real world actually works."

 

Yes, it is when you are a responsible adult.

 

"People learn the ropes and make mistakes as they go along.  That is actual reality."

 

I have no idea where or with whom you might have ever worked with this attitude.

It is one thing to learn more about a job as you go. It is quite another thing to come in and announce you don't need to learn the ways of the business because you don't want to bother. The business will just have to let you mess up as many times as you want, because you want to be taken care of by someone.

 

 

"I checked just now and I have NOT had any connects refunded for 2 scams I made proposals for (that I could not know they were scams until I made the proposals in the first place)."

 

As you have been told repeatedly, you will get your connects back. You couldn't have used more than 6, so get more or become a member. If you are trying to be a freelancer, with your profile and your attitude, you will have great diffiuclty finding a legitimate job.




 
Andrew's avatar
Andrew L Community Member


Jeanne H wrote:

The scams will continue as long as people who want to be freelancers without skills throw up a bad pic and a couple of alleged jobs with fantasies about their skills in their mother tongue - the scammers will be lined up and waiting for those who think they are so special they have been chosen for big bucks.


 

If 20% or so of jobs posted are bogus and actually looking to rob the very users of Upwork, at the very least you have a spam problem.  The "nothing to see here" attitude is strange to me.  I am providing feedback as a new freelancer to UpWork,  You're implying it's OK to spam the jobs boards and we should do nothing to stop such spamming (when there's obvious solutions).  I just spotted a problem that's easily fixable by disincentivising scammers in the first place (prevention). Take away the scammer's tools and you have no scammers.  That's easily possible.  Upwork incentivise scammers by allowing Telegram links, and links out to various other sites?  Negotations are not supposed to take place off-platform, right?  It's not hard to blacklist a number of platforms - low hanging fruit.

 

I used Upwork back in 2010 as a freelance hirer (when it was oDesk).  I only had good experiences.  I don't remember the platform being spammed with scam jobs back then.  Perhaps that coloured my view trying it out as a freelancer in 2022.  I assumed jobs posted had gone through at least SOME vetting process.  Surely that would be a basic expectation of a freelancer? A service that UpWork provide, right? Obviously not, and that's been made very clear to me now.  It's an open firehose of jobs postings with zero vetting.  What an opportunity for scammers - no wonder they post here so much.

 


Jeanne H wrote:

I have used this anaolgy before but it works. If you are going down the street and someeone comes out of a dark alley and says they want you to do a job because you are so special, and you just walked by all the giant signs saying "Don't go into the alley with strangers." Then the person offers you a whole lotta' cash for just helping them out. Well, if you want to go down that alley, be prepared for the consequences without complaint.


I'm not sure your analogy works the way you intend it to.  You're insinuating UpWork is "the wrong side of the tracks".  Actually, I agree with you.  It's a far less safe place than I anticipated. 

 

I'm just saying - "hey, I noticed this".  It's feedback.  I didn't expect so much spammed scams on the jobs boards.  People who've used UpWork for some time now have become enured by them and criticise a new person for daring to point it out.  The attitude is "nothing can be done, why are you even asking for change?".  And so from that there's an ecosystem within UpWork that is enabling scammers to do as they please.  It's a strange attitude - spam is usually tackled in one way or another - it's not merely tolerated as if "nothing can be done".  My point isn't that new people are idiots or victims, it's removing the incentive for scammers in the first place.  Obviously, that's impossible 🤷‍

 

As for your other comments, I'll just say: I'm offering feedback. You seem insistent on shaming new people here.  I think UpWork do bear at least SOME responsibility on what is posted on their platform.  I don't think that's an unreasonable point of view.


Christine's avatar
Christine A Community Member


Andrew L wrote:

My point isn't that new people are idiots or victims, it's removing the incentive for scammers in the first place.


The fact that so many freelancers don't know what they're doing IS the incentive for scammers in the first place. 

 

You keep saying that Upwork should block Telegram links, as if that'll make the scammers give up and go away. They won't - they'll just post normal-looking projects and then PM freelancers to contact them on Telegram (most of them are doing this already). Or they'll simply come up with new scams; many of the latest cons are from clients who have verified payment methods through using stolen credit cards, and are keeping communications on Upwork right up until the point that they do a chargeback. The only way to avoid scams like that is to use your common sense. If you don't have any - e.g. if you seriously think that a total stranger is going to buy you thousands of dollars worth of office equipment, or that you can make hundreds of dollars by doing something really simple for a few minutes - then you aren't ready to be a freelancer, and should get a job in the real world. 

 

Nobody here is denying that scamming is a problem. We only disagree on what can be done to solve it without scaring off real clients or putting roadblocks in the way of freelancers who do know what they're doing.

Andrew's avatar
Andrew L Community Member


Christine A wrote:

Andrew L wrote:

My point isn't that new people are idiots or victims, it's removing the incentive for scammers in the first place.


The fact that so many freelancers don't know what they're doing IS the incentive for scammers in the first place. 


This is a moot point, since there will always be either new freelancers or freelancers "who don't know what they're doing".  Your expectation of every freelancer being able to spot a scam isn't met by reality.  These scam jobs usually have 50+ proposals.  They are amongst the most-replied-to jobs postings that I've seen


Christine A wrote:

Andrew L wrote:

My point isn't that new people are idiots or victims, it's removing the incentive for scammers in the first place.


You keep saying that Upwork should block Telegram links, as if that'll make the scammers give up and go away. They won't - they'll just post normal-looking projects and then PM freelancers to contact them on Telegram (most of them are doing this already).


I'm a programmer with 30+ years experience.  It's trivial to identify URLs even if they try to obfuscate them.  UW don't even filter naked URLs.  Someone types in a t.me link, and it's an obvious red flag UW can see and capture before the reply is even made: suspend the poster, remove the job, recredit all proposals (all automatically).  No genuine jobs poster will reply to a freelancer saying "hit me up on Telegram via t.me/blah" - we know this, right? It's such an obvious filter to put in place.

 


Christine A wrote:

Andrew L wrote:

My point isn't that new people are idiots or victims, it's removing the incentive for scammers in the first place.


Or they'll simply come up with new scams; many of the latest cons are from clients who have verified payment methods through using stolen credit cards, and are keeping communications on Upwork right up until the point that they do a chargeback.


I wasn't aware of these scams, nor am I referring to these.   I'm talking about the more "low hanging fruit" scams that 50+ proposals are sent to each and every time.  If proposals were not in those numbers, it wouldn't be such an issue.  I am new here, but I am guessing that the kinds of scams I'm talking about are way way more prevalent than the types you've mentioned above (I'm talking about 20% of all postings!).  If the scam you mentioned is as prevalent as the one I am talking about, UW have some big issues (but I doubt/hope that's not the case).

 


Christine A wrote:

Andrew L wrote:

My point isn't that new people are idiots or victims, it's removing the incentive for scammers in the first place.


The only way to avoid scams like that is to use your common sense. If you don't have any - e.g. if you seriously think that a total stranger is going to buy you thousands of dollars worth of office equipment, or that you can make hundreds of dollars by doing something really simple for a few minutes - then you aren't ready to be a freelancer, and should get a job in the real world. 

 


That is not the only way.  Of course there are other ways.  UW can disincentivise scammers in the first place.  They can do this via URL/obfuscated links removal.  It's easy to do.  That makes it much much harder for spammers to lure freelancers off UW, and if they try, they can face automatic suspension.

 

Nichola's avatar
Nichola L Community Member

Andrew wrote: 

"That is not the only way.  Of course there are other ways.  UW can disincentivise scammers in the first place.  They can do this via URL/obfuscated links removal.  It's easy to do.  That makes it much much harder for spammers to lure freelancers off UW, and if they try, they can face automatic suspension."

 

__________________

Now you are being disingenuous. Don't you think that Upwork would already have implented this if it were possible?  It is not possible, because a scammer will always think of other ways of conning people.  Before the Telegram scam, there was the Google Hangouts scam.  As to the 50+ responses to that sort of job, it simply testifies to the unsuitability of some people for the freelancing world, and perhaps they shouldn't be on the site in the first place. 

 

Perhaps you should be concentrating on finding your first gig on Upwork, rather than concentrating on tracking down obvious scams, which shouldn't have interested you in the first place. 

 

Andrew's avatar
Andrew L Community Member


Nichola L wrote:

Don't you think that Upwork would already have implented this if it were possible?  It is not possible, because a scammer will always think of other ways of conning people.  Before the Telegram scam, there was the Google Hangouts scam. 


Honestly, it's not only possible, it's trivial to do via a regular expression that identifies certain string patterns - so even if they try to obfuscate the URL, it's identified.  Even simpler, you could just prevent ANY URL posted from a jobs poster who has spent $0 and isn't payment verified.  Many platforms give privileges to users who've shown they're trustworthy over time.  Except here - where scammers with no history can send t.me links to dozens of interviewees (I looked at a scam job just now interviewing 16 people, UW is providing a hell of a good business for scammers).

 


Nichola L wrote:

As to the 50+ responses to that sort of job, it simply testifies to the unsuitability of some people for the freelancing world, and perhaps they shouldn't be on the site in the first place. 


Looking through the history of this forum, experienced users here have complained about these scams for years.  You might see it as "culling the competition" as people get put off by the platform, but it also clogs up the jobs posting lists, and this forum is full of posts about scams.  I just think it's all unnecessary since there are solutions.  I know you made a personal comment at the end - noted.  I will not respond though. I'm just here to leave feedback.

Nichola's avatar
Nichola L Community Member

May I suggest you write to Upwork with your "solutions".  I am sure they would be interested in adopting them. 

Christine's avatar
Christine A Community Member


Andrew L wrote:

Christine A wrote:

Andrew L wrote:

My point isn't that new people are idiots or victims, it's removing the incentive for scammers in the first place.


The fact that so many freelancers don't know what they're doing IS the incentive for scammers in the first place. 


This is a moot point, since there will always be either new freelancers or freelancers "who don't know what they're doing".  Your expectation of every freelancer being able to spot a scam isn't met by reality.  These scam jobs usually have 50+ proposals.  They are amongst the most-replied-to jobs postings that I've seen


Upwork used to regularly turn new applicants away if a category was already overcrowded, or if they had insufficient skills, poor English, no photo, etc. But a year or so ago, they opened the floodgates and started letting absolutely everybody join, and that's when the scammers started coming here in droves as well. 

 

And yes, those types of job have the most applicants because they're advertised as "simple" and they have high budgets. They're specifically calculated to attract the desperate, the unskilled, and the ill-informed, because those are the best marks. Upwork should go back to turning away such people, since their chances of ever getting a real job here are slim to none; they do nothing but attract more scammers.

 

I don't think that most new people have trouble spotting scams, even if they haven't read the terms of service, because plenty of them come to the forum straight away and report their run-ins with suspicious clients (or they at least recognise that something sounds "off" and ask questions before proceeding). If some newbies are perfectly capable of spotting scams, what does that say about the rest? 

Andrew's avatar
Andrew L Community Member


Christine A wrote:

Upwork used to regularly turn new applicants away if a category was already overcrowded, or if they had insufficient skills, poor English, no photo, etc. But a year or so ago, they opened the floodgates and started letting absolutely everybody join, and that's when the scammers started coming here in droves as well. 

It seems to have backfired on both UW and experienced people here, who have complained the search feature isn't giving them invites any longer.  Not sure if that is due to the influx of unvetted new applicants, but it's a possibility.  Maybe they just need the platform to be seen as more active? Whatever the reason, it's strange that they won't properly (or EVEN) vet either freelancers or hirers.  For the fees you pay, either (genuine) party would expect some basic entry level. 

 


Christine A wrote:

I don't think that most new people have trouble spotting scams, even if they haven't read the terms of service, because plenty of them come to the forum straight away and report their run-ins with suspicious clients (or they at least recognise that something sounds "off" and ask questions before proceeding). If some newbies are perfectly capable of spotting scams, what does that say about the rest? 

They're the most-replied-to jobs postings from what I see.  I think "50+" is the last description tier, so who knows how many apply - maybe hundreds.  

Jeanne's avatar
Jeanne H Community Member

Andrew, this is the last time I respond because this conversation is going nowhere. You can hide your profile, but I already saw it, and you are not prepared in any way for freelancing. You stand out as a victim. Three days on the platform, and you are already an expert. Amazing. You refuse to look at the rules and listen to freelancers trying to keep you from losing everything; instead of declaring yourself as an expert who can inform us of problems, focus on yourself. If you had read anything, you would know Upwork is flooded with fake freelancers and scams.

 

"If 20% or so of jobs posted are bogus and actually looking to rob the very users of Upwork, at the very least you have a spam problem."

 

How can you read the forum and not see that we have been discussing the scams since last August, especially since January?

 

"You're implying it's OK to spam the jobs boards nd we should do nothing to stop such spamming (when there's obvious solutions)"

 

Do not put thoughts in my messages. In case you have not noticed, I have no problem being direct. If you bothered to read anything - this is not news. We know. Upwork knows. Exactly what do you think you are bringing us?

 

"I assumed jobs posted had gone through at least SOME vetting process."

 

You know what happens when you assume. Assumptions are no way to run a business. Upwork never vetted the clients.

 

"Surely that would be a basic expectation of a freelancer"

 

Only ones who think they don't need to understand how the platform works and the rules. Rules matter - expectations don't. This is a business.

 

 

Jeanne H wrote:

I have used this anaolgy before but it works. If you are going down the street and someeone comes out of a dark alley and says they want you to do a job because you are so special, and you just walked by all the giant signs saying "Don't go into the alley with strangers." Then the person offers you a whole lotta' cash for just helping them out. Well, if you want to go down that alley, be prepared for the consequences without complaint.

I'm not sure your analogy works the way you intend to. You're insinuating UpWork is "the wrong side of the tracks"  Actually, I agree with you  It's a far less safe place than I anticipated. "

 

Upwork is the sidewalk; the dark alley is where you go off the platform.

 

"People who've used UpWork for some time now have become enured by them and criticise a new person for daring to point it out."

 

None of the freelancers would bother to post if they didn't care. If you would look through the posts, no one likes scams. We hate them and want them to go away. The best way to get rid of them is to starve them out. I guarantee that they will fade away if the feasting isn't good here. As long as freelancers don't think they have to read the rules, much less follow them, the scammers will find many easy targets and will stay here as long as the victims line up.

 

"My point isn't that new people are idiots or victims, it's removing the incentive, for scammers in the first place."

 

I never called anyone an idiot. If freelancers refuse to read and follow the rules, they are ignorant of the facts. That's not an insult; it is the truth. All freelancers have the same opportunity to fail or succeed,

 

"You seem insistent on shaming new people here."

 

When you have been here two days, have no profile, no history, and nothing to show you are ready to be a freelancer, what do you expect? Two days and you are complaining about subjects you don't understand. You don't have to be ignorant, you should educate yourself, but you refuse to and want Upwork to take care of you.

 

I am not shaming anyone. My comments are all true. By refusing to follow the rules and refusing to create a decent profile, you make yourself a victim in waiting. Unless you change, you will never get a real job. And if you do, it will be a scam because you don't know the rules and aren't interested in following them. If you cannot accept the rules and take personal responsibility, freelancing will never work for you.

 

Even if you were on the platform in 2010 - that's 12+ years. Times and technology change, and if you are going to be online, you have to change with it, or you will fail and lose your money.

 

"I think UpWork do bear at least SOME responsibility on what is posted on their platform."

 

Since this was right after you said I am shaming people, I don't know if you mean Upwork should censor what happens in the forum or the platform. If it is the former, Upwork moderators read the posts and take them down or edit them if they feel it is appropriate. If you mean the latter, Upwork doesn't state anywhere they will save you from scams. Especially considering that 99.9% of scams are easily avoided by not going off platform, there is little excuse.

 

You do not want to accept personal responsibility. You think you are an expert because you have been here now for a total of three days. You refuse to accept the rules or even set yourself up as a professional. No one except a scammer is going to hire you with that profile. I am ending this now because you have no interest in being an adult and taking responsibility for yourself. If you want to follow the rules, I might read your posts after you have actually worked on the platform for a while. You will not take that action; therefore, there is nothing to discuss.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Radia's avatar
Radia L Community Member


CLEARLY, their scams are profitable since they are hitting UpWork so frequently

 

That's true, "educating" freelancers in a more extreme way like popping or placing a big notice in the dashboard, and to make sure freelancers will click it, like using exaggerated words which actually is not so uncommon on some other businesses, will:

 

  • Prevent freelancers from falling into the scams, and...
  • Cut the scammer's food source.

 

It's actually  better than "combating" the spam with filters, vetting clients, suspensions, etc. Filters are extremely easy to trick (they are implemented and tricked already before), and this happened because of an attempt to vet the client.

 

But of course there are:

 

  • Thoughts that allowing the scams will help with natural selection of oversupplied freelancers
  • The scams doesn't really affect current freelancers (unlike the algo change perhaps).
  • Posting big notice with exaggerated words might not be in line with the company's (current) style.

 

It's about cost (effort) vs benefit. The decisions might bring them into succeed, or they might go down, no one knows for sure.

 

Andrew's avatar
Andrew L Community Member

Thanks for your reply.  

 

I've always favoured technical solutions for this kind of thing just to make life more awkward for scammers with less and less need for human intervention (which is costly) like flagging. 

 

If a scammer puts a t.me link in a reply to me, that reply should not be sent at all, and the scammer suspended or banned automatically, the post removed automatically.  After all, external dialogue is not permitted anyway.  And yet, UW technically (key word!) permit it.  

 

You will always need flagging to an extent, but technical fixes (like URL filtering) will remove incentives from scammers, and so there will be less posts to flag.  

I've looked through probably a dozen or so obviously-scam postings just now (and I could find a lot more if I bothered) and most of them have 50+ proposals, with a bunch of "interviews" and interactions.  The idea that we just rely on new people doing their due diligence obviously isn't working.   I'm actually stunned at the current state of this platform in regards to scams being openly perpetrated and 50+ people falling for each scam...

Robert's avatar
Robert Y Community Member

I think other freelancers have addressed most of the points you make. No matter what Upwork does, scammers will think of a way around it, provided people go on falling for their scams. 

 

It keeps coming back to that - people need to know how not to be scammed. As soon as the scammers find they're wasting their time, they're gone.

 

There seems to be a class of person who's born to be conned. If you look at the YouTube channel Catfished, which deals with romance scams, you'll see what I mean. Some of the video titles give you an idea:

 

Woman loses $300k, gets engaged to scammer

Victim sends his 401k to romance scammer

Victim takes out 6 loans for romance scammer

 

And so on and on. And there are equivalent scams on every kind of website. The amounts stolen on Upwork are trivial compared to what goes on elsewhere.
 
The problem will never be solved, but it can be contained. This can be done by making people stick to the rules about no external contact and no money transactions outside the platform. 
 
As others have said, letting anybody join the site is a bad idea. At the very least, there should be a test to see if prospective freelancers know the rules relevant to staying safe from scammers. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

 

Nichola's avatar
Nichola L Community Member

Veterans and newcomers have all complained about the scammers on Upwork (and they don't just target Upwork). However, scammers lie in wait for newcomers who are too lazy to learn how the site works, "Genuine actors" who start working with new tools should always read the small print first.  

(As an aside, it is also against Upwork's ToS, for freelancers to give contact information in their profiles: social media, websites, telephone nos. emails etc.)

Andrew's avatar
Andrew L Community Member

We all see it happens, but what is being done about it? I see scams right now with 50+ proposals.  Do we say that these 50+ people didn't read the small print? It's all a waste of time for those 50+ people, and UW have the headache of having to review a jobs post, then re-credit 50+ people their connects.  If a jobs poster replies to a freelancer with low reputation (no money paid out, no verified payment) puts external links of "ill-repute" (blacklisted URLs such as Telegram) in a reply to a freelancer, they should be automatically flagged, the post removed, the jobs poster suspended, anyone who's replied to the job should be automatically recredited.

 

Such scammers have carte blanche right now, they can do as they please - which is why there's so many scam jobs posted. 

 

 

Jeanne's avatar
Jeanne H Community Member

If the scammers didn't find easy pickings, they would go away.

 

If you encounter a scammer, flag them and explain the issue.

 

If the freelancers didn't set themselves up to be victims because they choose to be ignorant, it would not be happening.

 

Once, after several conversations, the client says to go to Telegram. I explained the rules, she never contacted me again, and I got my connects back. Then I learned to see the signs of the thieves. I have never had a problem with being scammed. You have free will. If you and other freelancers don't want to follow the rules and don't want to heed the advice of experienced freelancers, then don't. But no one can help you if you don't follow them. Read and learn the advice of people like Wes, who put time and effort into explaining how the scams work. Have you even checked out the link?

 

What you don't understand is that everyone who posts is trying to help you and others understand the rules and the terrible things that can occur when you don't them. None of us want you or anyone to be scammed.

Jeanne's avatar
Jeanne H Community Member

Again, you have not wasted connects; they will be returned. You can't expect to use only a few connects. You need to work on your profile - there is nothing there. Being new and obviously having not read the rules or set things up as you should - the scammers can see you are ready to be scammed.

 

You don't know what to look for and you have not read the rules. It would benefit you greatly to read the Terms of Service, and everything you can find on how to be a freelancer on Upwork. Then you need to make a decent profile and find something for a portfolio. If you have been an experienced " Web developer/Data Entry Clerk/Copywriter/Article Writer" for 20 years, why have you nothing to show?

 

"New people like myself have wasted credits on these scams, because you simply don't know what to look for when initially applying for jobs."

 

There is an easy solution; learn.

 

"I consider myself quite "streetwise" but it's only AFTER you've spent your credits (as a new freelancer) that you find out they are not serious."

 

You are not 'streetwise" as a freelancer. You have no clue as to how to set up a profile, much less apply for jobs and do it properly. Or avoid scams.

 

Only the individual can protect themselves. There are no parents or guardians here following you and warning you to not violate the Terms of Service.

 

Yes, there are too many scams, but there are ways to protect yourself. Ignorance is no excuse.

 

Andrew's avatar
Andrew L Community Member

I wrote this on another comment just now which is appropriate as a reponse to yours :-

 

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I've looked through probably a dozen or so obviously-scam postings just now (and I could find a lot more if I bothered) and most of them have 50+ proposals, with a bunch of "interviews" and interactions. The idea that we just rely on new people doing their due diligence obviously isn't working. I'm actually stunned at the current state of this platform in regards to scams being openly perpetrated and 50+ people falling for each scam...

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As for your other comments, I am merely providing feedback.  I wasn't expecting critiques of my profile (which is irrelevant to my point).  I hope we can keep on topic here.

Christine's avatar
Christine A Community Member


Andrew L wrote:

As for your other comments, I am merely providing feedback.  I wasn't expecting critiques of my profile (which is irrelevant to my point).  I hope we can keep on topic here.


Actually, it's very relevant, because people with bad profiles won't attract any real clients - only scammers. 

Andrew's avatar
Andrew L Community Member


Christine A wrote:

Andrew L wrote:

As for your other comments, I am merely providing feedback.  I wasn't expecting critiques of my profile (which is irrelevant to my point).  I hope we can keep on topic here.


Actually, it's very relevant, because people with bad profiles won't attract any real clients - only scammers. 


That seems disingenuous since experienced freelancers with impeccable profiles wouldn't even send proposals to such jobs posts, right? Scammers have 50+ new freelancers to choose from in their list of propsoals.  Or are you saying even experienced freelancers with well-honed profiles send proposals to (what is obvious to me, after a few days) scam jobs? If you mean that, then we really have a problem if experienced freelancers can't spot such scams.  So honestly,  I take that point as moot. Rather, scammers full well know their respondents are new and inexperienced, and the numbers do not lie - there are many people falling for these scam postings.

 

Your expectation is that brand new freelancers are going to have perfect profiles from the get-go before they reply to a single job.  Well, I see 50+ proposals posted to scam posts each and every time.   I can't put it more simply than this: if you remove the opportunity, you remove the problem.  Why give scammers the opportunity? I've already highlighted the possible solutions enough times in this thread.

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