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The Problem with job success rate

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Ace Contributor
George K Member Since: Mar 7, 2015
31 of 107

Like I mentioned in my first post. My last contract that was closed was last year in December. My stats, after the contract ended (successfully) displayed 100% JS. The drop is very recent, so the only explanation is the fact that I have not logged any hours in Upwork.

 

I expect that a Mod should provide an answer here.

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Active Member
Monis A Member Since: Oct 5, 2013
32 of 107

We all are facing the same problem.

 

I stopped working for lets say 2 months as i had my MBA exams so i was only clocking 1hr per week.

 

My JS dropped from 100 to 93 to 89 and now its 88.

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Community Guru
Preston H Member Since: Nov 24, 2014
33 of 107

re: "This is totally rubbish and Upwork has to understand that I am the real client here. Their commission comes from my fees."

 

You are not a client here unless your credit card is being billed so that Upwork can send money to a contractor.

 

You are a contractor.

 

When you say that you are a client, you minimize the significance of your role as a contractor. Upwork understands the importance of contractors. Upwork understands that it would not earn money from the clients if it had no contractors.

 

But that doesn't mean that the role of the contractor is identical to the role of the client. Both are important, but they are different.

 

Where there is some disconnect and some misunderstanding is with the Job Success Score. There are contractors who dislike aspects of it, or dislike it altogether. But the score is a service provided to clients. Upwork is trying to improve the client user experience. That is the important outcome of JSS. Upwork created it for clients and how contractors feel about it is just an afterthought... Far less important in the overall scheme of things.

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Community Guru
Dawn L Member Since: Sep 3, 2015
34 of 107

With all due respect, Preston, when my excel spreadsheets say "Service Fee"... that means that we, as contractors, are footing the bill - not the client. We can add the 10% to our normal hourly/fixed rate, but no matter how you look at it, at the end of the day, its the contractors paying Upwork for services rendered - which makes us Upwork's customers, not the client.

 

Given your explanation, that would also mean that since my credit card wasn't billed for the one month membership that I paid for in December - but instead, it was taken out of my Upwork balance - I'm still not considered a customer? No, the fact that money was taken out of our pay, whether automatically or billed/invoiced to our credit cards, makes us Upwork customers. 

 

After all, at tax time, it's not the clients on Upwork that can write-off the service fees and membership fees on their tax forms. I do. The contractor.

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Community Guru
Preston H Member Since: Nov 24, 2014
35 of 107

Dawn, I didn't use the word "customer." 

 

That's your word.

 

Your post here has nothing to do with what I said.

 

I said that the role of "client" is different from the role of "contractor," and that the Job Success Score was created as a service to increase client satisfaction. It was not created to please contractors.

 

But now that you mention it, Upwork does not regard contractors as its target customer base. Upwork regards clients as its customers, and it regards contractors as a resource that is utilized to obtain revenue from clients.

 

This does not mean that you are prohibited from regarding yourself as a customer. Nor does it mean that Upwork in no way regards contractors as customers.

 

It means that Upwork, as a business, primarily focuses on pleasing paying clients, not contractors, and that if you understand this fact, it helps to explain many of its decisions, such as retaining Job Success Score despite contractor complaints.

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Community Guru
Dawn L Member Since: Sep 3, 2015
36 of 107

Preston, regardless of the word you wish to use to describe the contractors relationship to Upwork, the fact of the matter is - whether their fee is coming off the top of our project rates or billed to our credit cards... we're still the one footing the bill. My clients pay for my services. Therefore, they are considered my clients.... some people may consider calling them their customers. Either way, the wording doesn't really matter.

 

I pay Upwork for their services, through the service fees which are deducted from my total earned amount per project invoice. Therefore, I am Upwork's client (or customer, depending on what word you choose to use). Again, the wording doesn't really matter in this case, what matters is the end result. The end result remains the same.

 

You stating that my post has nothing to do with what you said is bogus. It has everything to do with what you said, you're just hung up on a simple word selection that really has very little to do with the bigger picture. 

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Ace Contributor
Jordan G Member Since: Aug 21, 2015
37 of 107

See I would consider Upwork to be a temporary staffing agency.

 

Typically the staffing agency would take a finders fee for placing a worker.  The fee typically reimburses the temporary staffing agency for acting as an employment intermediary.  In this case the customer would be the employer.

However in Upwork's case the finder's fee is taken from the worker, thus making the worker the customer, and the client the contractor.

 

As such anything that is not transparent that affects the hiring of freelancers is basically biting the hand that feeds.  I'm sure excellent freelancers when hit with unexplained, unaccountable hits to their JSS, will eventually determine the frustration is basically unnecessary and leave Upwork.

Sooner or later this will hurt them.  Obviously it's only the bottom line that Upwork is worried about, and not the bottom line inn the future, but only looking at the here and now.

Furthermore why is JSS only a 2 year history, would you rate stock performance on a simple 2 year window?

 

***Edit*****


Also note that Upwork itself says

"Reputation building: Our client feedback system helps you build your reputation in a way that is verifiable and leads to more business and higher earnings. " 

I have yet to hear from anyone who believes this to be true about the JSS and what part of the JSS is verifiable?

 

Also freelancer does pay the fee:

"Once you begin doing freelance work with a client on our platform, we deduct a 10% fee from each payment. "

 

Quotes taken from freelancer faq on Upwork site.

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Community Guru
Jessica S Member Since: Dec 4, 2015
38 of 107

@Dawn L wrote:

With all due respect, Preston, when my excel spreadsheets say "Service Fee"... that means that we, as contractors, are footing the bill - not the client. We can add the 10% to our normal hourly/fixed rate, but no matter how you look at it, at the end of the day, its the contractors paying Upwork for services rendered - which makes us Upwork's customers, not the client.

 

 


 You know this is funny... because even when I add in the Upwork fee and "technically" the client is paying for it, when  I see it taken out, I find myself thinking that the client agreed to pay me this much money for the work, without me saying 10% was the Upwork fee, so, in essence, they agreed to more than what I typically would have bid, if there was no fee, because they saw the value in it. So this extra 10% is still my money Upwork is taking...  haha. Smiley Happy

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Community Guru
Dawn L Member Since: Sep 3, 2015
39 of 107

@Jessica S wrote:

@Dawn L wrote:

With all due respect, Preston, when my excel spreadsheets say "Service Fee"... that means that we, as contractors, are footing the bill - not the client. We can add the 10% to our normal hourly/fixed rate, but no matter how you look at it, at the end of the day, its the contractors paying Upwork for services rendered - which makes us Upwork's customers, not the client.

 

 


 You know this is funny... because even when I add in the Upwork fee and "technically" the client is paying for it, when  I see it taken out, I find myself thinking that the client agreed to pay me this much money for the work, without me saying 10% was the Upwork fee, so, in essence, they agreed to more than what I typically would have bid, if there was no fee, because they saw the value in it. So this extra 10% is still my money Upwork is taking...  haha. Smiley Happy


 That's true. On the flip side, though, sometimes with long-term, fixed-rate gigs that include multiple milestones, I have to remind the client that my quote is $XX plus the 10% Upwork fee, just so I'm not getting shortchanged due to an oversight.

 

So, for one-off fixed-rate gigs, yeah, you can add it to your bid without even mentioning to the client that your bid includes the 10% fee, same with hourly gigs I would imagine. But long-term fixed-rate gigs with multiple milestones - it really only works on the first milestone. Everything milestone after the first one you have to watch to make sure the fee is added in a way that you're not losing money.

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Active Member
Monis A Member Since: Oct 5, 2013
40 of 107

Hi All

 

I am facing the same issue, on december 25th i had 100% Job success after two weeks it rolled down to 93% then 89% and now its 88%.

 

On the rating side i have 4.93 stars and overall i have only 2 bad feedbacks ( i received over the period of 3 YEARS).

Oh! BTW i have completed several moneyback guarantee contracts and haven't received any violations/account holds ever.

 

However, there is something i noticed, i have been working with a freelancer who joined upwork 8 months back has only completed 5 jobs in total and is already top-rated.

 

I mean how come someone who has more than 63 jobs (with a really good repo and more than 50% returning clients) not top-rated and someone who has less than 6 jobs top-rated.

 

And lets not forget the clients who don't even reply back after the completion of their project, i have skyped them, contacted them on upwork several times still no response Smiley Sad

 

I would really appreciate if someone can give me an honest review and let m know if i am doing something wrong Smiley Happy

 

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